[Closed] Caffeine Shampoo - wtf?

Sposed to be good for baldies

Stimulate blood flow or something?

I think it is a test to see who the really gullible people are.

I saw that advert but was afraid to ask.....

Refreshes tired hair perhaps?!

I am just getting vision of people going around with wired hair. Would be quite funny if it was accurate.

Scalp has a good blood supply, possibly makes you feel more awake as the caffeine gets absorbed though the skin?

Just rub ground coffee into your head and stop pissing around with shampoo.

Utter bollocks marketing - it looks (deliberately of course) like a carton of motor oil or something.

Wired hair

German engineering... I'm sold!

ScotlandTheScared - Member
I think it is a test to see who the really gullible people are....

You've been watching the gadget show and the 12 min long ad breaks!

btw - zulus - I forgot to email you about those tyres 🙁

Makes your hair stand on end..

Apparently it's ''german engineering for your hair''
Mullet in a bottle!!!

Utter bollocks marketing

Tried it?

Boots are stocking it and widly advertising the fact , I'd be surprised if they'd put their reputation on the line by selling total guff.

I can't see it working

Boots are stocking it and widly advertising the fact , I'd be surprised if they'd put their reputation on the line by selling total guff.

Well they happily sell Homeopathic (sp) remedies so their reputation isn't exactly what I'd call spotless. At least this shampoo actually has an active ingredient. Whether or not it is actually of any tangible benefit is another matter altogether.

saw the ad last night and noted that it was completely bereft of any benefit statement. The message was "if the Germans like it if must be good so buy some"

I can't see it working

No? Expert on drug absorbtion through skin?

To obtain better insight into the robustness of in vitro percutaneous absorption methodology, the intra- and inter-laboratory variation in this type of study was investigated in 10 European laboratories. To this purpose, the in vitro absorption of three compounds through human skin (9 laboratories) and rat skin (1 laboratory) was determined. The test materials were benzoic acid, caffeine, and testosterone, representing a range of different physico-chemical properties.

...

All laboratories assigned the absorption of benzoic acid through human skin, the highest ranking of the three compounds (overall mean flux of 16.54+/-11.87 microg/cm(2)/h). The absorption of caffeine and testosterone through human skin was similar, having overall mean maximum absorption rates of 2.24+/-1.43 microg/cm(2)/h and 1.63+/-1.94 microg/cm(2)/h, respectively.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15135208

Lots of people have bought it, so it must be good. i.e. There is no actual reason to use this product, other than lots of other people do.

Interesting. There's reasons why it would work but yet there was more people believed a hologram wrapped in silicon would work than this.

more people believed a hologram wrapped in silicon would work

?

Quite a few people believe that if you put an air plane on a conveyor belt...

I can't see it working

No? Expert on drug absorbtion through skin?

I suppose is depends on your definition of "working" though.

1. Will the shampoo clean my hair? I'm prepared to accpet that without the need for any other info.

2. Will the Caffine be absorbed into my body? Again I'm fully prepared to accept this especially in light of the link from molgrips.

3. Will this product stop me from going bald? Here is where I have a problem. Surely the caffine absorbed into my skin will simply be carried round my body in the same way that caffine is when injested in the more ususal manner? Given that I drink a lot of coffee and I'm going bald, I'd like to see some sort of double blinded trial to determine this shampoo's effectiveness in curing baldness. Given that it's a cosmetic product however I'm going to bet that this hasn't been done, depite it being a relatively easy test to accomplish.

Read all about it.. Read all about it.. STW in 'chemicals cannot be absorbed through skin' Shocker.

I guess I had better throw away any topical anaesthetic I have, including ibuprofen gel as well as deep heat etc, and might as well dip my hands in a bucket of liquid LSD, I am sure it will be fine.

1st google result. I think Canadians work the same as us, could be wrong though.

"How does a chemical enter my body through the skin?

Chemicals which pass through the skin are nearly always in liquid form. Solid chemicals and gases or vapours do not generally pass through the skin unless they are first dissolved in moisture on the skin's surface.

The skin is the second most common route by which occupational chemicals enter the body. It consists essentially of two layers, a thin, outermost layer called the epidermis and a much thicker underlayer called the dermis. The epidermis consists of several layers of flat, rather tightly-packed cells which form a barrier against infections, water, and some chemicals. This barrier is the external part of the epidermis. It is called the keratin layer, and is largely responsible for resisting water entry into the body. It can also resist weak acids but is much less effective against organic and some inorganic chemicals. The keratin layer contains fat and fat- like substances which readily absorb chemicals which are solvents for fat, oil, and grease."

Molgrips there was less doubting of the powerbands than this shampoo. Are they really claiming it helps baldness, that does seem a bit unlikely.

OK sorry I had no idea it was being sold to reduce baldness. I just thought it was a 'wake up in the morning with super zing freshness of a MONSTER (tm) infused shower gel.

I don't think a caffeine shower gel will stop you balding.

Molgrips - I think you forgot to put the last sentence on that reference:

The variation observed may be largely attributed to human variability in dermal absorption and the skin source

I didn't read that power bands thread, I thought it was about those great big elastic bands you use for exercises.

I did see a link with reference to baldness, the suggested that topical caffiene could block the action of testosterone on the hair folicles in male pattern baldness. Of course that mean you'd have to use it day in day out from the age of about 16 onwards 🙂

and when the variability is greater than the mean you have to question the data....

Why? Not necessarily true. There's an enormous variability in lots of things, doesn't make them false.

Hair is 'dead' - no living cells so all shampoos do is fill in cracks/ strip off oils and make the hair appear shiny.
Caffine aint gonna do shoot.

It affects hair folicles though which are very much alive.

Interesting that no-one's noticed the values in that abstract I posted. If you work it out (I think) less than one mg of caffiene would make its way into the blood if you showered for an hour...

My real point was don't be so stupid to dismiss stuff out of hand when you've no idea about the science and have done no research, not even 2 mins with Google 🙂

My real point was don't be so stupid to dismiss stuff out of hand when you've no idea about the science and have done no research, not even 2 mins with Google

Is there any science behind the claim that using that caffine shampoo prevents baldness? All I've seen is marketing stuff and that link that you provided shows that caffine is abosrbed through the skin, it doesn't make any claim as to the caffine's ability to prevent baldness.

Molgrips that was my point - it was obvious you only did [s]two minutes[/s] less than thirty seconds work on google...
You linked to a poor study that measured low amounts with large variability and was poorly controlled and then called everyone else 'stupid'.
Yes lots of things are variable but if the test you are using to measure them has greater variabilty than the amount you need to measure; it doesn't take a genius to realise you need a better test.

Just imagine if you wash your willy with it 8)

Is there any science behind the claim that using that caffine shampoo prevents baldness?

Er there was a study.. let me look:

(30 secs later)

Moreover, caffeine alone led to a significant stimulation of hair follicle growth

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17214716

magowen100 - you miss the point. I don't care about the science, the point I was trying to make was that many of the posters above were being stupid by pronouncing on subjects that they didn't know about, and hadn't made any effort to find out even the slightest bit of info.

I have no idea if the shampoo works in reality (in either waking you up or preserving your hair), because I have not studied the science properly or tried it out.

Yes lots of things are variable but if the test you are using to measure them has greater variabilty than the amount you need to measure; it doesn't take a genius to realise you need a better test.

Still not sure I agree. If the variability is random you can average it out can you not? And the error would cancel itself?

Androgen-dependent growth inhibition of ex vivo hair follicles from patients suffering from AGA was present in the human hair organ culture model, a constellation which may serve for future studies to screen new substances against androgen-dependent hair loss. Caffeine was identified as a stimulator of human hair growth in vitro; a fact which may have important clinical impact in the management of AGA

That study states that in people with AGA, caffine stimulates the growth of hair, but only concludes that it [i]may[/i] have an impact in the management of that particular type of baldness. It says nothing about this particulr shampoo and isn't even applicable if you don't suffer from AGA. Hardly a ringing endorsment.

You have however succeded in pushing me further into the "it doesn't work" camp, although as always with more and better evidence I'm willing to change my mind.

I'm going bald, maybe I should try it 🙂

You have however succeded in pushing me further into the "it doesn't work" camp, although as always with more and better evidence I'm willing to change my mind.

Good man*

*other genders are available.

I don't care about the science,

I'm rather hairy, waist-line length 😀
I'll try it when I find it sold here.

However that's also exactly what you did in linking to such a poor study.

Thankyou for your considered response 🙂

And yes I did not properly read the study or even the abstract, but the point I was making was that the information's out there. I was mocking the knee-jerkers who were thinking they were clever. I knew people would think I was pro-caffienated shampoo too, because again people often don't read stuff carefully or think about it 🙂 They are as bad as the people who fall for bad science to whom they feel so superior 🙂

molgrips - Member
Utter bollocks marketing
Tried it?

Ohh, and I have a full head of hair 😛

Ohh, and I have a full head of hair

I dont 🙁

...pass the nescafe.

That original comment way back was about the shampoo supposedly waking you up. That's what I assumed it was about.

That's what I assumed it was about

I prefer coffee in my mouth to wake me up anyway 😉

I dont

...pass the nescafe.

[i]I can't see it working[/i]

Can't see why it wouldn't clean your hair, does it claim to do anything else?

does it claim to do anything else

[url= http://www.alpecin.co.uk/en/products/caffeine-shampoo.html ]Err yes - this line in bollocks[/url]

I like this line on their site...
[b][i]leaving the product on excessively long can result in temporary redness[/i][/b]
Believing their marketing bollocks will leave your face temporarily red too.

You know what, I feel a complaint to the ASA coming on. Given the rubbish weather forecast for this weekend I should have plenty of time to find something on their website that may constitute false or misleading advertising.

I am a petty, petty man

Believing their marketing bollocks will leave your face temporarily red too.

As will automatically disbelieving it without putting any actual thought into it 😉

As will automatically disbelieving it without putting any actual thought into it

(IMO of course - feel free to douse yourself in the stuff - what is the worst that could happen?)

As will automatically disbelieving it without putting any actual thought into it

Actually I'd say that is perfectly acceptable to take an initial stance of disbelief until those that make such claims substantiate them.

Hairloss? Get it with Alpecin
[img] [/img]

LOL good point Dave

BEFORE > AFTER.

#Fail

Perhaps I am badly wrong but I honestly don't [b]believe[/b] I am.

If only science were about faith 🙂

You could always do just a teensy bit of googling to find out if there's any science backing these claims. And as it turns out there might be.

Actually I'd say that is perfectly acceptable to take an initial stance of disbelief until those that make such claims substantiate them.

I'd say that a neutral stance would be more reasonable. Especially as it's a subject with which MF is not personally concerned and knows nothing about. Not really fair to slag something off automatically is it? What happened to innocent until proven guilty as a moral framework?

What happened to innocent until proven guilty as a moral framework?

That's not how science works. If you make a claim it is up to you to prove that it is vaild, it's not up to others to prove that it's not.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty as a moral framework?

Most of the final editing of beauty related adverts is completed by lawyers. "Can help reduce [i]the appearance of[/i] wrinkles" or "7/10 people [i]noticed they[/i] had an improvement."

Alternatively they just fill the adverts with psuedo-scientific bullsh*t terms to fool people.

Or on the product demonstration section of adverts, they have to leave a tiny amount of the plaque / dandruff / spots still showing after treatment in case it gives the impression it will definitely cure you.

100% agree joey. I particularly hate this kind of advertising to those who are often (as said above) of low self-esteem because of the complaint.

molgrips, own up you work for Alpacino er I mean Alpecin don't you

No - I just think Molgrips is being Molgrips - trying to draw people into an argument even though he doesn't actually believe the argument he is making.

I think it is called Trolling.

I have no idea why I have been drawn in.

Molgrips - you're on one today - you is on fire! Stop playing devils advocate all the time. 😆
Some of the chemicals in shampoo are known carcinogens (in higher quantities) but the advertising companies hardly say '..becasue I can get malignant lumps....'
They've cherry picked the 'science' just as you have done.
IIRC the motto of the Royal Society is - [u]On the word of no man[/u]
for good reason.
😀

That's not how science works. If you make a claim it is up to you to prove that it is vaild, it's not up to others to prove that it's not.

True but this isn't science, it's marketing. Adverts would be pretty dry if they just talked about the studies supporting their science 🙂

My point is this:

Don't slag something off until you've actually bothered to find out about it, even a little bit.

Next time, why not try these more reasonable phrases:

"I'm sceptical..."
"I find that hard to believe.."

Or my personal favourite:
"I have yet to be convinced..."

And so on 🙂

No - I just think Molgrips is being Molgrips - trying to draw people into an argument even though he doesn't actually believe the argument he is making.

Well that woudl be the case if I were FOR the idea of caffienated shampoo to cure baldness, but I am not.

I am arguing for intelligent thought 🙂

I am arguing for intelligent thought

And I don't NEED to research into whether or not coffee makes hair grow back because I know, through reasoned intelligence, that if coffee DID make hair grow back, it would not need to be advertised. The simple fact that they have paid to advertise it means they are just trying another marketing angle to sell stuff.

To be honest, the whole advert comes across as a spoof 'German Engineering' my hairy arse (and no, I don't rub coffee into it).

Anyone with intelligence knows it to be marketing twaddle

Wait a minute - dismissing something out of hand without knowing about it is intelligent behaviour is it? News to me 🙂

And I don't NEED to research into whether or not coffee makes hair grow back

Mate, I thought you were claiming to be intelligent? No-one's claiming that coffee makes your hair grow back! This is about topical application of caffeine. Very different thing to drinking coffee.

But I'm sure someone as intelligent as you knows that.

Wait a minute - dismissing something out of hand without knowing about it is intelligent behaviour is it?

No-one's claiming that coffee makes your hair grow back! This is about topical application of caffeine. Very different thing to drinking coffee.

But I'm sure someone as intelligent as you knows that.

I have already explained my reasoned intelligent opinion on the matter. Just up there ^^^ look

I didn't consider that intelligent reasoning 🙂

Why not? I would like to think I am intelligent enough to form an opinion on a claim without having to resort to finding absolute proof of said claim before choosing not to believe it.

MF and M
sitting on a tree
K
I
S
S
I
N
G
You guys so love each other it's reminiscent of binner's love for Hora 🙂

LOL - I don't mind Molgrips in the slightest - but no tongues thanks.

I might give it a try to see if I can grow some hairs as I need some warm over my head.

OK mol,I'll play
1 they offer no evdence for any of their claims,nor do they quote, or even reference, any academic studies to prove their claims about caffeine and hair growth
2 I suspect that any studies that have been done are on oral caffeine,so the effect is systemic rather than topical,so heavy coffee drinkers should have noticeably less hair loss than the average and oral administration should be more effective than topical.
Ian

I assumed the shampoo was to wake you up actually. Which seems reasonable, since drugs can pass through the skin. So I googled it to counter all those folk scoffing on here, and found some research about baldness too.

And yes I'm fairly sceptical if it'd really work but these people don't just invent any old thing to put in their shampoo like they did in Victorian times. There's usually some science linking the two concepts, even if there's no use in their actual product.

Doesn't take much to show an interest in how things work 🙂

Blimey,you type quick LOL
Ian

I suspect that any studies that have been done are on oral caffeine

Did you read the links I posted?

I need hairs and plenty of it ... 😆

Yes,after I posted,I'm not sure what the direct relevance of in vitro studies to a real life situation,nor am I surprised the caffeine resideue is found in hair follicles afetr topical application,but I'm not sure how you tell whether it's due to topical or systemic absorption.
Ian

By the way,you're a bit sharp today,have you been washing your hair too much?
Ian

My point is this:

Don't slag something off until you've actually bothered to find out about it, even a little bit.

Next time, why not try these more reasonable phrases:

I don't believe that [i]I[/i] did.

I slagged off Boots for stocking Homeopathic remedies but as far as I'm concerned that's fair game.

Yes,after I posted,I'm not sure what the direct relevance of in vitro studies to a real life situation,nor am I surprised the caffeine resideue is found in hair follicles afetr topical application,but I'm not sure how you tell whether it's due to topical or systemic absorption.

Me neither - I don't much care whether it works or not. But good to see people reading up on the subject 🙂

I don't believe that I did.

You didn't. I'm mostly talking about the first few responders, who've now all sodded off 🙂

My wife uses caffeine shampoo, no idea why, but you're all missing the point.

Embrace the Shiny.

I shaved off my hair 20 years ago, & would never go back. All that washing, drying, combing etc just seems like a real faff.

Molgrips - I really don't understand your obsession with having to Google for answers. Make your own mind up rather than choose to believe someone else's.