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Notable that she doesn't call for a VONC or say she's submitted a letter to Brady. Just that she's going to have a jolly good think about it.
it's a sorry state of affairs in the tory party if Loathsome is briefing against you.
Notable that she doesn’t call for a VONC or say she’s submitted a letter to Brady. Just that she’s going to have a jolly good think about it.
Exactly.
Unless her and the rest of them put their money where their mouths are and actually send letters in then its just effectively tutting and shaking their heads as Boris the feral dog continues to shag their leg.
And while thats all frightfully middle-class, middle England, it doesn't really get us anywhere other than making themselves feel a bit better and somehow trying to disassociate themselves with the sexually incontinent honey monster
They really are a completely spineless bunch, aren't they?
Not sure it is a direct consequence of Brexit.
Johnson being PM is a direct consequence of Brexit.
All of this dismissive, just give me a three word slogan, never look at things properly, don't bother to interrupt hollibobs as Kabul falls, one rule for the plebs one rule for us, etc bullshit stems from the way the Brexity rabble side-stepped the usual sniff tests and got into the top slots with a pack of populist lies.
Do we think Theresa May would have held lockdown pissups where she was pictured raising a glass like Rowley Birkin?
No. On two counts - she at least had some shred of self awareness and decency (if only because of how it would play out) and no one would have turned up.
Do we think Straw, Beckett, Milliband, Hague, Hammond or even Hunt would have stayed paddleboarding whilst Afghans loyal to the UK for nearly 20 years were being lined up against a wall or buried in pits by the Taliban?
No. Because they hadn't sidestepped the usual rising through the ranks vetting process as the Brexiteers have.
What we have in the cabinet now is essentially a bunch of fakes, who would have been held at arms length by anyone sensible. But Brexit gave them their chance to move from being fringe loons to senior ministers. It was handed to them on a plate by every Leave vote cast. Any remainers in the cabinet either got ousted (e.g. Hammond) or was such a turncoat that they became 'enhusiasts' (Hancock). Note how Johnson didn't 'form square' around Handjob like he did around the Prittster when she did a bit of hollibobs moonlighting for Mossad.
It is all to do with that ridiculous referendum and virtually everything would be less gloomy than it is now had we voted to Remain.
Inflation would be lower - the chaos at ports will be contributing.
Our covid response will have been better with someone competent in No 10.
The EU would be stronger militarily and diplomatically with the UK still in.
The GFA would not be under threat like it is now.
It all stems from that almighty brain fart on the part of the UK electorate.
It is all to do with that ridiculous referendum and virtually everything would be less gloomy than it is now had we voted to Remain.
I doubt disagree with that but you'd still have Farage & UKIP spreading the same lies & hate, the Tory party have moved onto their territory
Leadsom is trying to walk both sides of the street as usual. It's trendy to give Johnson a kick right now and remember she is a full card-carrying Brexit loon. She probably still thinks we can cope in the modern world with Spitfires and jam sandwiches. For her ilk, Johnson is merely a temporary vehicle.
If she does actually DO something it will be with the aim of putting a 'Brexit Hardman' in charge.
But that's for later. I want Johnson gone now. The Tories can then put a loon like Baker in charge if they want. He'll burn plenty down, but he can never reconcile the contradictions at the heart of hard brexit - because they are irreconcilable. My hope is that two years would be long enough to show that even a Brexit ideologue can't conjure up unicorns. We could then have a GE with Brexit exposed as the utter fail it is. It will then depend on the honesty and IQ of the electorate. I'm still not optimistic.
I doubt disagree with that but you’d still have Farage & UKIP spreading the same lies & hate, the Tory party have moved onto their territory
They feel that they had to to shore up the more 'patriotic' end of the vote. A resurgence of Farage (if he doesn't play electoral games - which he will) should be bad for the Tories. But one thing Farage is very good at is getting airtime way out of proportion to his vote share. If the shit hits the fan he'll stand candidates in the red wall again.
There isn't a single member of the present cabinet who would be in with the merest sniff of a senior government position in anything resembling a functioning competent administration.
But this is Boris's circus and he is threatened to have anyone of even middling intelligence in the vicinity of number ten, so we end up in the position where genuine thicko's like Raab, Truss, Braverman and Dorres are promoted to senior positions
Our only saving grace is their total and complete incompetence. Their lack of any obvious ability means translating their often-vocalised, unhinged brain-farts into reality never actually happens.
Can you imagine Nadine Dorres actually managing to find her own arse using both hands? She still doesn't actually understand what Channel 4 is or how its funded, so I can just imagine how her plans to privatise it are going. She's busy doing cringe-making Tik Toks instead. I just pity the poor civil servants working under her having to explain the most basic elements of her brief to her without using any big words that might confuse her
That was brilliant - "savaged by a dead sheep"
Howe ultimately lost though, didn’t he. Framing everything as Europe against us is the political mainstream now.
Anyway… drip…
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1531611829964775429?s=21
https://twitter.com/john4carlisle/status/1531612657077436421?s=21
Keep writing to your MP. Mine has already said that Johnson should go.
Imagine a PM who took over at a time of crisis and suffering, ran the country as best as he/she could out of a sense of duty and public service rather than self-aggrandisement and the need for electoral success?
Incomprehensible, I know.
Problem is that politics doesn't pay enough (unless you're crooked). Johnson was earning twice what he now earns as PM on his various columns etc; and he needed a large chunk of that money to pay alimony. Hence why he missed COBRA meetings early in the pandemic to try to finish off his latest Churchill book, to get the next instalment of his advance from the publisher.
More broadly, though, it means that competent people who are well-versed in the type of executive decision-making, organisational management and crisis handling that the position requires don't become PM for the money, as they could earn 10x as much being a CEO of a large company.
So one ends up with people like Angela Rayner who started at the bottom and are very good at representing her electorate but not necessarily of running a party or country; ideologues who believe that they must do this job for the good of the people (Corbyn?); the self-defined political class who don't need the money but feel that they were born to represent the proles (Blair? Cameron, JRM, etc); and the shysters who do it for the (crooked) money.
https://twitter.com/CatNeilan/status/1531610996070047745
best outcome is that he scrapes a narrow VONC win, but has to limp on, despised by his MPs, and so weakened that he cant push through his legislative agenda (not that he has a legislative plan beyond keeping himself in power)
Keep writing to your MP. Mine has already said that Johnson should go.
Gove seems to be studiously ignoring me despite me chasing him. Well ! What a surprise.
Text of yet another email sent to Mr Invisible my MP.
Dear Mr Xxxxx,
With even Andrea Leadsome saying that Johnson should go, I would be worried about missing the bus if I were you (not the one with the £350m a week lie on it, mind).
Do the decent thing, publicly withdraw your support from the Prime Minister and hope to salvage some respect from your constituents. As a rural constituency with many older people (who were petrified to even open their front door during 20-21), I can assure you Mr Johnson's antics have played very badly here. Simply being anonymous and hoping for the best won't wash this time, I am afraid.
Only you can decide if you want to be on the right side of history now, but at least the power is in your hands.
Rgds,
Gardentiger
It won't do any good. He is a remainer who swallowed his principles for a ministerial post and a safe seat. He isn't interested in anything other than feathering his own nest.
come on who's the first cabinet minister to break cover ? has to be Sunak surely, what's he got to lose ? doesn't need the money and if he doesn't make PM he'll get his old job back.
There isn’t a single member of the present cabinet who would be in with the merest sniff of a senior government position in anything resembling a functioning competent administration.
None of them would make it past middle management in an estate agency in the real world. The system (Eton > Oxford backed by Bank/Connections of Mum & Dad) has landed these morons in a world which they simply can't handle.
It's the old pigeon / chess analogy. They knock all the pieces over, shit on the board then strut about like they won.
strut about like they won
They did. By 52 to 48.
Problem is that politics doesn’t pay enough
simply not so unless you have very skewed idea of what "enough" is
Personally I have them as very much overpaid. Paid far more than the bulk of the country
Personally I would have the wages set at say twice national average ( so £60 000 ish) all expenses to be scrutinized to be legitimate with much tougher rules and all second jobs banned. then we get folk with a public service ethos not those with snouts in the trough
No one in the NHS for example bar one or two very top leadears each anything like as much as MPs - same for all the public services.
Far too many are there for the snouts in troughs in all parties not to serve.
Far too many are there for the snouts in troughs in all parties not to serve.
Totally agree with this, though.
My MP won't criticise his boss because he's already swallowed him Remain/One Nation principles in order to retain and enhance his own position. He's already sold out, there's no way he's going to grow a conscience now. 😒
Problem is that politics doesn’t pay enough
simply not so unless you have very skewed idea of what “enough” is
Personally I have them as very much overpaid. Paid far more than the bulk of the country
Totally agree - I don't want people to be politicians because it pays well, I want them to do it because they're driven to improve the lives of the people they lead and the country they govern.
If one wants the very best people to run your country, without being in hock to someone other than their constituents, pay them exceeding well but ban external payments and possibly no expenses.
Say £500k, but they need to pay any researchers themselves, no second homes allowance, no non-exec roles (nor within 5-10 years of leaving office).
They can have any required security details on top of that.
It would probably save money on the present salary plus expenses plus folk to police the expenses routine.
Otherwise they look after unions or companies or whatever and move on to far higher paid roles that are not looking after their constituents. Didn’t Hague get £900k for public speaking one year? Ban that.
There are very few politicians in it for the MP salary. They earn there money through dodgy 2nd jobs/consulting etc. Be far better paying them far more, say in line with a consultant doctor for example and have much tighter rules on what they can and cannot do for 2nd jobs.
£80k is a lot compared to the average UK salary but it really isn't a huge salary compared to what can be earned elsewhere.
Its funny isn't it that " pay to get the best people" applies to politicians and bureaucrats but not to doctors or nurses or teachers or police
half a million a year - that just will attract the snouts in troughs mob. Its them we want rid off
Errmmm - £80 000 is just under what a consultant gets if they are on the crap new contracts. very few MPs would be able to earn anything like £80 000 in the real world doing a real job - partly because jobs paying that much are very few and far between
I don't think the base salary is at all bad. It's top 10% of salaries, factor in expenses, most MPs claim back a lot of their day to day expenses which the rest of us have to pay. Pension is good and job security is not bad, most get at least a 5 year contract, I've only had one role that lasted longer than that. Do a good job and you are on a rolling contract. To be honest pay much more and you will attract people who are solely after the money, the salary package is plenty comfortable enough for people with the right mindset to not be out of pocket and focus on the job.
So no I don't think they should be paid more. I also think there should be zero second jobs and would like to see lot of caveat around subsequent employment, if you don't like it don't stand.
But for PM you don't want some random Joe off the street who's unemployable in any other sector, without any ability to lead, negotiate or manage. Corbyn tried that, and apart from anything else, he was somewhat lacking the skillset required to run a country or indeed a political party.
BoJo is a clown, but he is employable, and earned quite a lot being employed. He's also somewhat able to organise things - as shown being London mayor. Unfortunately, he also thinks he's born to lead and that's why he's doing it.
MPs salery is in the top 5% of UK earners.
Nicko - but there are perfectly capable people earning a lot less than that. Head teachers, hospital managers. to give two groups
Its funny isn’t it that ” pay to get the best people” applies to politicians and bureaucrats but not to doctors or nurses or teachers or police
Not in my opinion, I think most public sector workers are underpaid.
very few MPs would be able to earn anything like £80 000 in the real world doing a real job – partly because jobs paying that much are vwery few and far between
Many of the current crop yes, but some MP's and its easy to forget there are a lot of good hard working ones that deserve every penny they get and would be easily capable of earning more in the private sector. The ones milking it are not earning the majority of their cash through the MP salary.
Ian Hislop said something similar on HIGNFY once.
Double their current pay.
Then ban any expenses claims beyond absolute necessities like travel for constituent business only (none of this decorating second homes, duckponds, every sodding food shop at Waitrose...), ban any second jobs (we're told how busy MPs are yet they all seem to have time to take on second jobs...), ban any donations to individuals, it all has to go through an independent Committee and funds go to the party so there can be no "buying off" a politician locally.
Remove most of the subsidy on the bar and restaurants - everyone else has to buy a lunch at work out of their own pocket.
Then see how many of them stick around "to serve the people"...
there are a lot of good hard working ones that deserve every penny they get and would be easily capable of earning more in the private sector.
Really? They would be able to get a job paying the top 5% of wages? Name one who is remotely qualified for a job earning that much
Yep. There's a MMT (magic money tree) when it comes to expenses, free houses, foreign holidays. No fiscal probity there.
There isn't any point in me naming anyone as you would disagree as you think £80k is excessive.
There are plenty careers in which people can easily earn over £80k (not me though just so we are clear)
Law
Medicine
Engineering
Consultancy
Its all about perspective, to some 80k is excessive to others its not enough.
very few MPs would be able to earn anything like £80 000 in the real world doing a real job – partly because jobs paying that much are vwery few and far between
Except they're not - not really. If an MP's salary is £80k which is a smidge above the 96th percentile (according to 2019 data which is the latest I could find) of employees, then that means that 1 in 25 is earning more. NB that's employees so wouldn't include company directors or people with familial wealth. 1 in 25 doesn't seem that much to me.
Divide that down by the demographics that apply to MPs (*well-educated, often a high level of family wealth etc) and multiply by their skillset (networking, personable, good negotiating, hard-working etc). I bet they wouldn't consider themselves high earners among their friends & peers.
It's also nowhere near enough to stop people from being tempted to leverage their position for other salaries (from legal stuff like speaking fees, consulting, down to financial market manipulation / insider trading etc). I don't really subscribe to the argument that they should be paid more in order not to break the law. But then I believe that there should be honour in these high offices and look where we are...
* NB loads of generalisations here.
What I would have liked to have said but phrased far better than I would have managed. I agree entirely.
excel of Hospital trust and authority pay scales
The only ones that come close to the level of MP are roles like Head of Facilities at a small trust. The median wages for most senior roles in NHS trusts are more or less double what an MP gets as a basic. I would expect some MPs to be able to do some of these roles. If you went from running a large NHS trust to becoming an MP (not inconceivable) you'd take a pretty substantial pay cut
There are plenty careers in which people can easily earn over £80k (not me though just so we are clear)
Law
Medicine
Engineering
Consultancy
Very few in those professions will earn significantly more than £80 000 pa
Medical consultant - I put the pay scale above. GPs earn a bit more. Law - again trial barristers will and equity partners in top firms but the majority of lawyers are not in these posts
engineering - again a very few at the top
You have a very skewed idea of what folk earn
do you really think an MP is worth a lot more and is a harder job than being a medical consultant or a head teacher?. remember this is back benchers we are talking about - ministers get a good chunk more
The median wages for most senior roles in NHS trusts are more or less double what an MP gets as a basic.
Only if you exclude the medical consultants, the nurse managers etc. they don't count as senior roles?
How many folk get those salaries?
do you really think an MP is worth a lot more and is a harder job than being a medical consultant or a head teacher
No, which is why i stated earlier that most public sector works are underpaid.
I think we shall agree to disagree, you think 80k is a massive salary, I think its a good salary for sure but realise more is available elsewhere.
Once again we see here the massively skewed ideas of what people earn
There is no qualification to be an MP. No training, no set of standards. The back bench MP is a simple job and paid far in excess of what these people would get outside of parliament with their skills for the vast majority of them. This means it attracts the wrong sort of people. those after the money not those with a public service ethos.
simple job
Not if you are doing it properly. And definitely not if you are an opposition MP
excess of what these people would get outside of parliament with their skills for the vast majority of them
Just something you have decided is true.
those after the money not those with a public service ethos.
This is only true for the ones earning silly money for dodgy 2nd jobs.
the nurse managers etc. they don’t count as senior roles?
Director of Nursing at a larger trust is on about £150,000. Most GPs are on about £10.5k a session with will give them about the same as an MP's salary. I don't think I'd want a constituency of 90-100K people while earning "about" the same as a local doctor with a patient load of 2500 people (give or take), with all the public exposure that being an MP entails.
Plus of course there's the matter of getting there in the first place. This Sky news piece thinks the average candidate spends about £118,000 to become an MP.
Klunk's tweet basically says "I will reward disloyalty", imagine how you'd feel if you're one of the poor useless idiots that's been parroting the party line all the way from Paterson to Hancock to Partygate and suddenly some guy that's <gasp> belatedly done the right thing gets offered a promotion? How else are you supposed to progress in the tory party other than unrelentingly fellating the boss?