[Closed] barefoot running - the truth about that

I didn't just give up because I hated being crap.

I suspect you are not crap and anyone who perseveres is an athlete in my book 🙂

Are you suggesting that I suddenly gained a minute over the course of a few days and then ended up forefoot striking as a consequence?

No, worded like that would suggest it (the forefoot striking) was a by product of running faster and was not a concious decission.

I said maybe in order to move away from a heel to a forefoot strike, as a concious decision, you [b]had[/b] to run faster. As heel striking is more natural below a certain speed*.

The fact that you then found forefoot striking easier is the by product.

Basicly, 'running faster allowed you to run faster (by allowing you to forefoot strike)' not 'forefoot striking allowed you to run faster'.

EDIT:
*I'm not claiming this as fact, just what I believe.

...As heel striking is more natural below a certain speed*.

EDIT:
*I'm not claiming this as fact, just what I believe.

and you're wrong 🙂

try running on the spot, with a heel strike.

how natural does that feel?

McGregor’s studies indicate that there is no such thing as good running form. Rather, skillful running is the result of an unconscious, evolutionary process wherein each runner’s unique body finds its own best way to run economically, resulting in a form that is slightly different from that of any other runner.

would that also be an argument against using padded built up 'corrective' shoes to run in? because they would surely make it harder to feel your 'natural' running style?

I suspect you are not crap and anyone who perseveres is an athlete in my book

Yay!

Imma athlete. 🙂

Not you DD your still pants ! 😉

🙁

No, worded like that would suggest it (the forefoot striking) was a by product of running faster and was not a concious decission.

No, it was as conscious as any decision could be. I thought 'hey I wonder what it would be like to run as if I were sprinting, but slower? Cos you know, the achilles and calf are meant to work like a spring, right?'

I thought 'hey I wonder what it would be like to run as if I were sprinting, but slower?

So you used the technique that you'd normally use to sprint to run faster... madness.

Why the sarcasm? I wasn't sprinting, so it wasn't obvious to use my sprint technique for not sprinting, was it? There's a big difference between sprinting and distance running, as you well know.

Because to me it seems like phil.w knows you better than you know yourself...

Regardless... run more.

Bit of an insulting thing to say Yeti. Feeling down about this whole thing now. You lot telling me I'm a fool and you know best, despite having not been there.

This is an interesting conversation so another serious question.

There's a big difference between sprinting and distance running

Is there? I dont agree. Where does sprinting end and distance running begin? There is a continuum of speed between say a 50m race and a 10,000m race and of course running 50m will mean you run only on the furthest point of your foot but why would you not still stay on your forefoot? There is no reason to then run on your heel.
Both events are "sprinting" to some degree.

I wasn't sprinting, so it wasn't obvious to use my sprint technique for not sprinting, was it? There's a big difference between sprinting and distance running, as you well know.

forgive me if i'm being an idiot, but:

a)i thought the only difference was the speed you did it at (thus impacting on how long you can do it for... the faster you want to go the more exaggerated the movements become)

and/or

b)if you already knew so much about technique how come you had to think/change/develop to work out that runnings easier when you dont slam your ankle into the ground?

iConfused

Where does sprinting end and distance running begin?

Next to the pile of vomit by the side of the track 😀

sprinting: properly on your toes, arms pumping away.

running: a bit more like mr soft...

You lot telling me I'm a fool and you know best, despite having not been there.

Easy tiger I'm not calling anyone a fool I love your enthusiasm on the running threads and certainly not trying to put you off. Sorry if it came across like that. 😥

try running on the spot, with a heel strike.
how natural does that feel?

Tried it, your right, there's nothing natural about running on the spot...

In order to run on the spot you have to use a high knee lift, this is more similar to running at speed. Nothing like running at speeds slow enough to mean you are more likely to heel strike.

You lot telling me I'm a fool and you know best, despite having not been there.

In order to run on the spot you have to use a high knee lift,

no i don't.

i must be doing it wrong!

🙂

my running on the spot style is pretty much the same as my running at 4min/k style.

Sorry... I did warn you I was going to get offensive if it's any relief?

It's also nowhere near as offensive as I thought I was going to be...

Where does sprinting end and distance running begin?

Exactly at your anaerobic threshold, I think.

surfer - I shouldn't have said 'you lot' I should have said 'Yeti' 🙂 You are contributing nicely, and it's appreciated.

Philc

- I didn't know anything about technique at first.
- I had an idea (unprompted, I hadn't read anything or heard of barefoot style) and I tried it out.
- At the same speed on the treadmill, it felt much easier.
- Over the same distance as my previous running routes, I was much quicker.
- After this discovery, I went to google and found a lot of information about barefoot style
- I then started thinking even more about technique, resulting in lots more experimentation during my own runs.

I used to think that I naturally knew how to run distance because everyone does, I realised I was very wrong.

a)i thought the only difference was the speed you did it at (thus impacting on how long you can do it for)

No because thats true of every distance.

You are contributing nicely

I'm learning, DD will be along to bollock me soon if I misbehave! 😳

molgrips - Member

- I didn't know anything about technique at first.
- I had an idea (unprompted, I hadn't read anything or heard of barefoot style) and I tried it out.
- At the same speed on the treadmill, it felt much easier.
- Over the same distance as my previous running routes, I was much quicker.
- After this discovery, I went to google and found a lot of information about barefoot style
- I then started thinking even more about technique, resulting in lots more experimentation during my own runs.

- i didn't know anything about technique at first.
- i knew my shoes were causing me pain
- my doctor wanted to operate.
- i realised that 1 pair of shoes didn't hurt me. i originally bought them for work, but i found i could even run in them, i was very happy!
- i went to a running shop to buy some shoes similar to the now knackered pair of clarks
- they tried to sell me several pairs of orthotics.
- i bought a pair of minimus.
- then someone gave me a copy of 'born to run'
- now i'm one of those ****ty running evangelists.

Philc

- I didn't know anything about technique at first.
- I had an idea (unprompted, I hadn't read anything or heard of barefoot style) and I tried it out.
- At the same speed on the treadmill, it felt much easier.
- Over the same distance as my previous running routes, I was much quicker.
- After this discovery, I went to google and found a lot of information about barefoot style
- I then started thinking even more about technique, resulting in lots more experimentation during my own runs.

I used to think that I naturally knew how to run distance because everyone does, I realised I was very wrong.

fair play 🙂 the way you mentioned contemplating sprint technique led me to (wrongly on my part) assume that at the point you already knew techniquey type stuff. myself... i dont run, if i did i'd stick to short distances as i'm built for power not for distance. used to be the second fastest in my school on the short distance stuff, boringly average for the EPIC and death-defying 1500meters. i'm the same with riding i suppose, the thought of riding further than 1500meters is exhausting!

i dont run, if i did i'd stick to short distances as i'm built for power not for distance.

you laugh yeti, but its troo.

i'll race you on sunday.... 5am, local school field with faded white markings of an old 400meter race track. barefoot, damp grass, the smell of sunrise..... BRING IT ON!

Mate, we'll go at it teeth and elbows... victor takes the loser as his bride.

Molly - I'm sowwy. You do know yourself better than we do... it's just the way you phrase things sometimes I guess.

I'm sure Yeti once promised us a 5min mile...

I got distracted with swimming...

I intend on getting to that speed by running more.

i will DESTROY him with a 4minute mile. after all if i can handle a 1500meter all dayer i'm pretty sure i can whip past him on a pathetic mile.

I have found that my technique has improved the faster I have got. It certainly wasn't the other way round. I do have different shoes with less cushioning for running sprint and threshold intervals. I also use them for anything off road.

I have found that my technique has improved the faster I have got

Its interesting that years ago when I trained a couple of times a week on the track if I missed a couple of weeks through illness or injury the first session back (as well as the vomiting :P) I felt like my arms were flailling all over the place. It comes back after a session or two, then its just the never ending pain to worry about!

I do find it easier in terms of body mechanics to run faster - it all seems to come together much better. However it's harder on the lungs and legs of course. I do train for that of course, and I have become quicker.

wow,

Slow runs for me 9min/mile pace I can run happily on my heels, no pain no worries BTW Molly, I'm "slamming" my foot into the ground. I can heel strike right up to pretty much my faster runs 20 mins for a 5km, at which point I'm on my toes.

Slightly OT but check out the lovely colour schemes on next year's new inov-8 models 😀

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[img] [/img]

Jeezus, they're more gopping than ever.

Mind you, I've never seen anyone who looks that shit, run that well. 🙂

BTW Molly, I'm "slamming" my foot into the ground

Well to be fair I can do that at 9m pace, but I don't really want to run at that pace! What's most important I've found is where your foot hits the ground. In heel striking I was putting my foot out in front, which was slowing me down. Now its always underneath me.

I like the top one (trailroc 155). Reminds me of the chewits and opal fruits I use to love as a kid.

Opps, meant to say im 'not' slamming my foot into the ground. Soz.

anyway maybe all a bit useless now anyway, as yesterday twisted my ankle on a curb, it's come up like a balloon and it's really sore 😥

Cant put any weight on it this morning, and nearly fell down the stairs...

Cant put any weight on it this morning, and nearly fell down the stairs...

I'm sure if you just think hard enough about why it's hurting emsz, it'll improve. In an instant.

Twisted ankle... bummer.. what shoes were you wearing? 😉

Re slamming things into the ground, I weigh a lot more than you.. I suspect this has something to do with how we start to run.

Was wearing flats doing sprints. My inov8 are v flexi but not very supportive. My own fault for no concentrating. It's really sore, put ice on it last night but it's still swollen.

I'm sure if you just think hard enough about why it's hurting emsz, it'll improve. In an instant

That's a proper laugh out loud moment right there!

My comiserations emsz. Happens to us all.

In other news my foam roller does seem to be helping my knee after all, despite my scepticism that ITBS was the cause.