[Closed] Are you getting your 7-a-day?

Junkyard I'm trying to get in touch, give me a shout when you get chance (email or phone)

You vegan curious ?

I assume it is pretty hard for a meat eater

Nope.

I have seen your dinners [ ok you posted them up once] and you may not be typical

Does it have to be opaque? I was hoping the stuff we bought in steel jerrycans from round the back of a derelict farmhouse counted. The rust added to the bouquet.

[i]Pretty[/i] sure that's red diesel 🙂

You vegan curious ?

I assume it is pretty hard for a meat eater

Nope.

Meateater here and struggle with 5 let alone 7, must try harder.

[i]Its what he does on every vaguely diet related thread dont take it personally they cannot help themselves and is is not you but them. On the plus side I will get the flak for a bit now and not you[/i]

Yay, Junkster is back. And posting on my behalf. Pity you're wrong though. But when has that ever stopped you.
😉

I expect that you'll be frothing up quite nicely, soon.
😆

I assume it is pretty hard for a meat eater as I am not certain that every single day [ perhaps one or two a month*] I achieve it and i am a vegan

I'd agree, just veggie here rather than vegan though (AKA - weak :-))

I'm thinking of an average day:

Brekkie - 2 boiled eggs, 2 slices of Vogel, tea.
Lunch - Salad, houmous + carrot sticks, crisps (my treat)
Tea - veggie chilli / pasta (usually Quorn plus onion, peppers, courgette, maybe grated carrot)

Probably an apple as a snack at some point, too much coffee & tea through out.

I doubt that there's 400g of veg in there. thats a lot of veg.

I'd guess it's reasonably easy if you made a concerted effort to make it a part of your diet

It's as complicated as:

1. buy more veg
2. eat it

I might bung a 'typical' day's worth of veg in a bowl tonight and weigh it.

I eat porridge for breakfast, banana mid morning, lunch is usually a sandwich, a couple of tangerines after lunch, then dinner is usually meat or fish and potatoes/rice and a portion of veg

Never realised how big a portion was

1 portion =

1 leek
8 spring onions
1 cereal bowl of lettuce
8 brussel sprouts

Most of the examples I can find seem to be about double what I would count as a portion.

[quote=Solo ]Its what he does on every vaguely diet related thread dont take it personally they cannot help themselves and is is not you but them. On the plus side I will get the flak for a bit now and not you

Yay, Junkster is back. And posting on my behalf. Pity you're wrong though. But when has that ever stopped you.
I expect that you'll be frothing up quite nicely, soon.

The prosecution cases rest M Lord

1 portion =

1 packet Mini Cheddars
1/2 bar Milk Chocolate
1 can Red Bull
8 Penny Chews
1 Portion Chips
30ml Ketchup

Change of plan for my tea: roasted squash and stir fry of red onion, red pepper, green beans and leeks. With roast potatoes and a steak.

I may have to cut down on fruit and veg to meet the new target 🙂

Tea:

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You are aware that having steak without chips and onion rings is actually illegal? And the absense of a creamy pepper or Roquefort sauce is only compounding the original crime

Best get that down your neck sharpish, before the knock at the door

You are aware that having steak without chips and onion rings is actually illegal?

Roast potatoes are [i]almost[/i] chips. And sauce on a steak is wrong; it's not the 70s.

Good to see Binners is all over this like chilli sauce on a kebab.

If you eat the salad with your kebab, that must be 3-a-day?

Its not that hard if you base your diet around veg. Meat isnt all that necassary for humans... biologically frugivores aren't we. The main problem is too much meat.

biologically frugivores aren't we.

Don't think so.

Just weighed my daily banana...146 grams..get in! Think I mostly do 5 to 7 portions a day but this is only in the last year since I started getting a veg box and so had to get creative with veg as I hate wasting food/money. I really enjoy eating veg now but it does take time and imagination to make it interesting. My fav way of getting a load of veg down is roasting up a big tray sprinkled with herbs, spices, balsamic vinegar, rape oil..just discovered cauliflower is gorgeous like this.

Roasted veg is a wonderful thing

I think the issue is that most of us are buying food from sandwich shops etc at lunchtime, and they have very little in the way of veg that's not salad.

If I am somewhere with a canteen I can get 5 a day fairly easily. If not, it's really hard.

We share the same/similar biological charateristics and genetic heritage as other apes. Frugivores; plant based plus very small amounts of animal protein (more or less animal protein depending on location and species). Acting omnivores but not biological omnivores.

The common mistake is to confuse to "be" with to "do" when thinking 'ivore etc.. If I start to eat only meat it doesnt suddenly make me a carnivore... We have cooked food for up to 2.5 million years so human digestive tract has evolved on its own, but we are closest anatomically to our frugivore relatives.

Another way to look at it is eat only meat and youll be very unhealthy and develope cronic illness. Eat only plants and the opposite occurs. Thats because plants are what we are primarily evolved to eat.... more recently cooked plants.

Depends really. Mostly not. But I go though phases. But other wise I eat terribly.

Acting omnivores but not biological omnivores.

You're going to have to do better than 'we're quite like apes'.

Another way to look at it is eat only meat and youll be very unhealthy and develope cronic illness. Eat only plants and the opposite occurs.

Ah.. wait.. you said FRUIT at first, now you are saying plants.

The evoution thing is a red herring in some ways. Humans (along with lots of other successful animals) have evolved to eat a huge variety of things. We can be very healthy on man different combinations of foods - meat or non-meat.

Another way to look at it is eat only meat and youll be very unhealthy and develope cronic illness.

Crap logic. Drink only water and you'll die - therefore water is bad for you!

Crap logic. Drink only water and you'll die - therefore water is bad for you!

S/he didn't say that meat was bad for you, s/he said only eating meat was bad.

As far as I understand, and I could be wrong, is that it isn't fructose in it's natural form that is bad; it's fructose in unnatural, highly concentrated forms, such as High Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS), that is bad (m'kay?). High concentrations of sugar also include fruit juice.

Ergo, fresh fruit should be fine as our bodies are use to processing the levels of sugar within.

This could all be crap, though

Ergo, fresh fruit should be fine as our bodies are
use to processing the levels of sugar within.

Not necessarily, they stopped feeding the monkeys at Paignton zoo bananas as modern varieties contain too much sugar.

Show me where i said "fruit"?

Isn't that what frugivore means?

S/he didn't say that meat was bad for you, s/he said only eating meat was bad.

If his/her point wasn't that meat is bad, I'm not sure what else it could be.

they stopped feeding the monkeys at Paignton zoo bananas as modern varieties contain too much sugar.

I thought all bananas were clones/genetically identical.....how can "modern varieties" have more sugar ?

There are loads of banana varieties. We only get one in this country generally.

[img] [/img]

Yes I'm aware that there are many varieties of bananas but I assumed that Paignton zoo were feeding the ordinary easily available variety to their monkeys.

They should try the cloned variety which hasn't changed for hundreds of years if they are worried about the rare fancy varieties.

If his/her point wasn't that meat is bad, I'm not sure what else it could be.

Really ? You couldn't work out what allmountainventure's point was ? It was written in straightforward plain English.

Eating only meat and nothing else is very bad for you. But eating only produce derived from plants/trees and nothing else isn't so bad for you. HTH

eat only [s]meat[/s]bananas and youll be very unhealthy and develope cronic illness.

my diet on tuesday

breakfast.. coffee three weetabix.

lunch..coffee and a slice of home made almond slice

evening meal.. can of baked beans

supper.. warfarin pravastatin coffee slice of apple blueberry pie

did i get 7 in there..

801010 diet is pretty damn healthy. Look up 30 bananas a day on the web or fruitarian athlete.

http://www.nomeatathlete.com/fruitarian-experiment/

http://www.thefruitarian.com/

So rather than being ill you can be a top end endurance athlete. Try that with steak.

I'm not saying we should all become acting frugivores. I'm saying that's what we are biologically. the more we deviate from it the unhealthier we get. This is also why heating veg is good, our guts are best for digesting soft fruit, not hard veg. That why meat rots inside human guts and doesn't digest (even after cooking it). Plant based (PLANT) is the nearest we can get to our natural diet.

Fwiw frugivores observed in the wild can an do eat animal protien, sometimes frequently. Eggs would be plentiful and very easy to get, so are insects and so on. But it doesnt mean they aren't still frugivores, nature doesnt fit neatly into scientific boxes and most frugivores are acting omnivores/opportunistic feeders.

One thing you can say about human society that is based around animal protien. Short lifespans or longer lifespans but riddled with diseases and propped up by drugs.

Not that I'm a bit obsessive, but I happened to have the kitchen scales out this morning...

The banana and raisins that went into my porridge this morning were 80g altogether (30g + 50g IIRC).

The veg (some red onion, red pepper, mange tout, baby sweetcorn, and salad leaves) that went into my lunch box came to 230g. Normally there's be half a tin of chickpeas (120g) in there too, but we'd run out; there's two leftover sausages instead.

So, 310g of 'fruit&veg' from breakfast and lunch today, but it'd normally be 430g.

I'm not saying we should all become acting frugivores. I'm saying that's what we are biologically. the more we deviate from it the unhealthier we get. This is also why heating veg is good, our guts are best for digesting soft fruit, not hard veg. That why meat rots inside human guts and doesn't digest (even after cooking it). Plant based (PLANT) is the nearest we can get to our natural diet.

nother way to look at it is eat only meat and youll be very unhealthy and develope cronic illness.

Just like the Inuit don't.

The problems with the 5-a-day message are two-fold. Firstly no-one knows what a portion is (okay, smart-arse STWers do, most people don't), and secondly that sounds like a huge amount of vegetables. I'm mostly vegetarian, and that sounds like a lot of fruit and veg to me.

The message should be simpler - "Eat a balanced diet, get some exercise"

Just like the Inuit don't.

You mean the inuit that have a life expectancy of 40 or 50 years? Bad control group because they don't live long.

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.sg/2008/07/mortality-and-lifespan-of-inuit.html

Sick on 100% fruit? You judge.

B12 is actually a bacteria that, if not for modern chemicals and pesticides in the environment, we would probably synthesize naturally in our intestines. Gut flora basically.

I pity your pancreas.

Why?

Seconded, just read through this, thought that food sounded ok, can you explain?

We share the same/similar biological charateristics and genetic heritage as other apes. Frugivores; plant based plus very small amounts of animal protein (more or less animal protein depending on location and species). Acting omnivores but not biological omnivores.

Ladies and Gentlemen, let me introduce to you....the Inuit Paradox.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11566644

Anyway, I seem to remember that one of the reasons why humans developed bigger brains is because we started eating more meat.

Plant based diet pyramid

[img] [/img]

Eat like an inuit if you want to. Some of them even live to 60 years old.

allmountainventure

I'll give up expensive cheese and wine over my cold dead cancer ridden body.

allmountainventure
I'll give up expensive cheese and wine over my cold dead cancer ridden body.

Its a free country bro 😆

B12 is actually a bacteria that, if not for modern chemicals and pesticides in the environment, we would probably synthesize naturally in our intestines. Gut flora basically.

Link please to proof that 1) The Small Gut can produce enough B12 in healthy individuals and 2) That pesticides affect small gut B12 production.

A quick google reveals sites that are mostly owned by hippies.

Theres been a terrible mistake. There are no specific references to pasties, cheese strings or Monster Munch on that pyramid. You can't just lump them all in as 'processed food' for gods sake. Theres a world of difference between, say, a pot noodle, and a Rustlers Microwaved cheeseburger. And the Pepperami Hot is a very different animal altogether. And wot of the Cheesy Wotsit eh? Wot?

You have the bare faced effrontery to come on here expecting to be taken seriously? Then lump in the Mini Chedder with Branston, and the McDonalds Mozzeralla Dipper. Laughable!!! Now go away and do your research properly man!!!! 🙄

I thought it said 'beer' at the top of that pyramid.

[i]you can be a top end endurance athlete. Try that with steak.[/i]

I think Jacques Anquetil did ok, famous eater of steak tartare, as he was.

Look up 30 bananas a day on the web or fruitarian athlete.

That's a rather creative way to develop hyperkalemia.

Anyway, I seem to remember that one of the reasons why humans developed bigger brains is because we started eating more meat.

I think recent ideas have suggested it was because we started cooking veggies. (There was a documentary where (the lovely) Dr Alice Roberts at a lot of carrots.)

I discovered during the summer that Getmans feed their babies so much carrot during weaning that their little noses turned a bit orange.

because we started cooking veggies.

Worth a read "Catching Fire: How Cooking Made Us Human"

Jacques Anquetil

Is this the same Jacques Anquetil that died of stomach cancer at the ripe old age of 53? Coincidently the average life expectancy of a traditional Inuit...

Come on, you're making this too easy!!

I seem to remember that one of the reasons why humans developed bigger brains is because we started eating more meat.

There are many suggestions and no proofs

[img] [/img]

One study, published last month in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, examined the brain sizes of several primates. For the most part, larger bodies have larger brains across species. Yet human have exceptionally large, neuron-rich brains for our body size, while gorillas — three times more massive than humans — have smaller brains and three times fewer neurons. Why?

The answer, it seems, is the gorillas' raw, vegan diet (devoid of animal protein), which requires hours upon hours of eating only plants to provide enough calories to support their mass.

Researchers from Brazil, led by Suzana Herculano-Houzel, a neuroscientist at the Federal University of Rio de Janeiro in Brazil, calculated that adding neurons to the primate brain comes at a fixed cost of approximately six calories per billion neurons.

For gorillas to evolve a humanlike brain, they would need an additional 733 calories a day, which would require another two hours of feeding, the authors wrote. A gorilla already spends as much as 80 percent of the tropic's 12 hours of daylight eating.

Similarly, early humans eating only raw vegetation would have needed to munch for more than nine hours a day to consume enough calories, the researchers calculated. Thus, a raw, vegan diet would have been unlikely given the danger and other difficulties of gathering so much food.

Cooking makes more foods edible year-round and releases more nutrients and calories from both vegetables and meat, Herculano-Houzel said.

"The bottom line is, it is certainly possible to survive on an exclusively raw diet in our modern day, but it was most likely impossible to survive on an exclusively raw diet when our species appeared," Herculano-Houzel told LiveScience.

http://www.livescience.com/24875-meat-human-brain.html

Tanzania reveal that the child had porotic hyperostosis, a type of spongy bone growth associated with low levels of dietary iron and vitamins B9 and B12, the result of diet lacking animal products in a species that requires them.

Ohohoh so much for chemicals ruining our ability to produce B12.

So plant eating gorillas are not as intelligent as us because they spend too much time eating ?

That will explain why my two meat eating cats that spend most of their lives sleeping and only waking up to stretch, eat, and shit, are far more intelligent than gorillas. Or even humans for that matter.

So plant eating gorillas are not as intelligent as us because they spend too much time eating ?

Whooosh.

Did the article/journals make any claims to answer that? No.

That will explain why my two meat eating cats ............. are far more intelligent than gorillas. Or even humans for that matter.

Whoooooooosh

That will explain why my two meat eating cats that spend most of their lives sleeping and only waking up to stretch, eat, and shit, are far more intelligent than gorillas. Or even humans for that matter.

Tom_W1987 - Member Tanzania reveal that the child had porotic hyperostosis, a type of spongy bone growth associated with low levels of dietary iron and vitamins B9 and B12, the result of diet lacking animal products in a species that requires them.Ohohoh so much for chemicals ruining our ability to produce B12

Study into death by malnutrition discovers vitamin deficiency shocker. This example was a breastfeeding child so the difficiency was the mothers. Its not possible to know why she was deficient...

But...

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porotic_hyperostosis

"low level of iron in the blood is also a defense against pathogens, so a high incidence of the disease in a population could also indicate an attempt to fight off an infectious disease.[4] From this perspective, porotic hyperostosis could be viewed as a biological attempt to adapt to the environment, rather than an indicator of malnutrition"

Fwiw I only said its possible for b12 synthesis. Its an embryonic area of research.

Gorillas are vegan = falsehood. Gorillas are biological frugivores who can and do eat other animals... uncooked.

The reasons human brains grew is complex and largely unknown, but current theory suggests likely due to cooking than anything else because it allowed rapid consumption and absorbtion of nutruents... 2, 000cal/hour easily.. Human brains have lost the volume of a tennis ball in the last 30k years. How does that reconcile with increased meat consumption in that period?

Btw im not a no meat advocate. See previos posted food pyramid, thats my view.

Gorillas are vegan = falsehood. Gorillas are biological frugivores who can and do eat other animals... uncooked.

The reasons human brains grew is complex and largely unknown, but current theory suggests likely due to cooking than anything else because it allowed rapid consumption and absorbtion of nutruents. Human brains have lost the volume of a tennis ball in the last 30k years. How does that reconcile with increased meat consumption in that period?

The encephalization quotient is the same as it always has been. Thus your last sentence bores me to no end. There are of course other factors that contribute to brain development but at the end of the day, you have to fuel that brain. Your willingness to jump to conclusion and use rather specious unrelated arguments in at attempt to discredit the links I posted is irritating at the very least and intellectually bankrupt at the very worst.

The reasons human brains grew is complex and largely unknown, but current theory suggests likely due to cooking than anything else because it allowed rapid consumption and absorbtion of nutruents.

Link please? Current theory seems to suggest it was a combination of eating meat and cooking - without either then brain growth could not have been supported.

Gorillas are vegan = falsehood. Gorillas are biological frugivores who can and do eat other animals... uncooked.

Gorrilla eat very very little meat, to the point that the original articles argument is still valid.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catching_Fire:_How_Cooking_Made_Us_Human

If you are bored stop reading. You're edging into the lowest form of argument.

The traditional explanation is that human ancestors scavenged carcasses for high-quality food that preceded the evolutionary shift to smaller guts and larger brains

Ohohohoh

Study into death by malnutrition discovers vitamin deficiency shocker. This example was a breastfeeding child so the difficiency was the mothers. Its not possible to know why she was deficient...

But...

The point being, that you clearly missed, is that humans...without all those nasty nasty pescticides that have stopped countless millions from starving, still could not produce enough B12.

This example was a breastfeeding child so the difficiency was the mothers. Its not possible to know why she was deficient...

I'm assuming pesticides weren't the cause.

Ohohohoh

Which means?

Read the link. Could be cause by pathogens, not just diet. Those tanzanians could have been eating loads of animal protien, but an environmental pathogen caused anemia in the population.

One fact thats absolutely certain is that a vegan diet would be good for the more follically challenged amongst us. Its what Junkyard credits his continued modelling success too. And he's just finished his latest campaign for L'oreal. I'm sure that we can all agree that with the moobs his vegan diet has endowed him with, he's most definitely worth eet! 😀

[url= https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3671/13581357323_3e58708b95_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3671/13581357323_3e58708b95_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

😀

Really ? You couldn't work out what allmountainventure's point was ? It was written in straightforward plain English.

Eating only meat and nothing else is very bad for you. But eating only produce derived from plants/trees and nothing else isn't so bad for you. HTH

Well that's such a glaringly obvious and useless thing to say I'd assumed there was another point I was missing. Did you also know the sky is blue?

Come on, you're making this too easy!!

Making what too easy? You're trying to tell us that we don't need to eat meat? We all know this already.

Are you saying that meat is actually bad for us? I don't believe this and you'll have to do a lot better to convince me.

Are you saying that humans havne't evolved to eat meat? This is just wrong.

Incidentally, I have heard a theory that says that suggests early humans lived on the shoreline, where they could eat lots of seafood rich in omega whatever and their brains could grow big.

So plant eating gorillas are not as intelligent as us because they spend too much time eating ?

Not sure some of you really understand natural selection. Species don't develop things randomly, they need external pressures. So Gorillas who are happy munching plants and succeeding as a species don't have any imperative to develop a bigger brain - why goto the trouble? It causes humans enough problems.

At some point in history early hominids were in a situation where superior intelligence gave them an advantage and helped them survive - and they had the diet to support the larger brain mutation. If gorillas had that situation tomorrow, they would start looking for new food sources - and probably eating more meat.

Not sure some of you really understand natural selection.

And I'm not sure some people really understand pisstaking.

This might come as a terrible shock to you but I don't [i]actually[/i] think that cats are far more intelligent than humans because they have a lot of spare time after eating their meaty meals. I thought that was obvious but maybe not 🙂

Binners if i looked like that i would not be wasting my time and hands typing gibberish on here 8)

And I'm not sure some people really understand pisstaking.

Well that wasn't aimed at you.. but others seem to think that big brains developed simply because diet changed, which isn't really the case.

Fair enough. I had assumed because you had quoted me that it was aimed at me.

Making what too easy?

It was a joke really. Someone names a steak eating athlete as an alternative to the fruitarian athlete The steak eater sadly died age only 53 of stomach cancer. Rather ironic example I thought.

Well that's such a glaringly obvious and useless thing to say I'd assumed there was another point I was missing.

There was actually. I was using that as an illustration of my statement that humans frugivore roots and the common misconception that humans are biological omnivores. We are not designed to eat animal protien but have adapted to it... not that well actually.

Im not a no meat advocate, unless we are talking modern farmed animals or red meat which should be avoided at all costs. Even if you are getting wild animals, more than once a week is too much imo.

[img] [/img]

Do sausage rolls count as wild animals if you buy them at the Gregg's in Salford precinct though?

Yes. But must be eaten raw to benifit from the fatist acid.

I was using that as an illustration of my statement that humans frugivore roots and the common misconception that humans are biological omnivores.

I don't think it illustrates that particularly well.

We are not designed to eat animal protien

I really don't think we're DESIGNED to do anything. Everything we can do is an adaptation, and we adapted to eat meat a really really really really long time ago. Way before we were hominids, even.

Some knowledgeable answers [url= https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120704005357AAyCPvR ]here.[/url]