[Closed] Are all MPVs money pits?

I've had a Renault Megane Scenic for 10 years from new.

It's been serviced once a year as per the manufatcurers instructions (so includes a cam belt change which was a few hundred quid) but generally it's an oil and filter change job. Couple of warranty items like a window regulator. Had the EGR valve replaced last year which was a few hundred. Otherwise it's been fine.

You don't need an MPV with 2 kids a Golf is easily big enough, we only switched cars once we had 3. That being said any of the Galaxy/Sharan/Alhambra are reliable as are the Verso versions of the Toyotas. They are just normal cars underneath, no reason to differ in terms of reliability

We've had a VW Touran for 5 years and it hasnt exploded or cost us anything more than the usual. We go it at 33k, and have done another 50k plus.

Likely to sell it soon, but only because with 3 kids, bikes, tents etc. we need more space! Here comes a T5 ?

All cars are moneypits.

reviews are generally written by people who have problems not the ones who don't.

MPVs probably do get a harsher life on the whole being used by families and loaded up etc. They have the same engines as lighter cars to get economy but people still probably drive them as they would a car. Also more gubbins to go wrong, people being more heavy handed etc etc.

Do the leg work finding one in good condition with an immaculate service history and has obviously been well looked after you should have a better chance of not buying a turkey.

Do you really need/want an MPV? Estate cars generally have more load space for things like pushchairs.

I ran a 07 Xsara Picasso- it was fine. Just don't buy a Korean MPV thats out of its warranty period.

You don't need an MPV with 2 kids a Golf is easily big enough

Our c-max has been good so far (touch wood). Much more boot space than a standard hatch too.

Do you really need/want an MPV?

Ah, got it !

VW T5 kombi.
Throw everything in the back, wheel the buggy and your bikes straight into the boot..
Enough room for 3 full size child seats should you have another romantic mishap.

[quote="jambalaya"]You don't need an MPV with 2 kids a Golf is easily big enough...
Really ? We have one kid and a Passat estate and we've filled that on more than one occasion. A weekend away with granny (i.e. three adults + one baby) required a massive roof box !

Incidentally, the roofbox was actually brilliant for the pushchair, not needing to put it inside the car made packing the boot far easier.

Really ? We have one kid and a Passat estate and we've filled that on more than one occasion

We went camping in a 5door Citroen C1, 2x adults, 1 toddler, 6man tent, airbed, quilts, cushions, blankets, bike on roof, all bike kit INSIDE the car etc. I could see out through all windows fully. Its all about clever packing.

For instance alot of your bike and quilts/sleeping bags can shove down the passenger/back foot wells- amazing amount of space down there if you compress everything.

Saying that the OP has a seatback/2xkids issue.

I know this wont work but to be safe in a car you don't need to feel higher up. She'll actually BE safer if shes more incontrol/has alower centre of gravity. I'd personally get a newshape Mondeo estate if I had two kids.

I have to take exception to the "Galaxy /Sharan/Alhambra are reliable" I'm afraid.
They're not. I see plenty of these breaking down every week - they weren't that reliable when new and they're all getting on a bit now.
Corolla Verso? Honda FRV? Tourans are ok but stupid money - people still believe the "if only everything in life was as reliable as a Volkswagen" nonsense from those ads in the nineties.

Sadly not the case.
With these enormous "rear facing 'til they're 4" car seats, and me being over 6' means I can't drive the damn thing with a car seat behind me.

A lot of mpvs will have the same leg room as the car they are based on.

The high up position is nice so I get that, main think I liked about the T5 as you are on a level with Range Rovers.

I would still say for a 2 kid family an estate makes more sense and is better VFM but for rear room and boot your best bet is probably an S-Max. Gonna cost more to run than an estate though.

Skoda Scout as a compromise? Still a practical height for roof box/bikes on the roof.

@hora - That was my initial thought when we realised we'd need to go bigger. Maybe I'll revisit that thought.

Sadly not the case.
With these enormous "rear facing 'til they're 4" car seats, and me being over 6' means I can't drive the damn thing with a car seat behind me.
A lot of mpvs will have the same leg room as the car they are based on.

This - I'm afraid it's so ith a lot of the smaller ones. Looks like you're on for Espace / Galaxy.

FWIW, I had the same issue (with an 2008 A4 Avant) and had to go to an A6 to find space. I suspect a Mondeo would have been fine, but Mrs bits is a badge snob... She now drives that and I have the golf which actually has more space for rear passengers than the A4.

OP - are you looking to buy new?

We got a 1 year old 08 Kia Carens. Couple of minor things done under warranty and a fuel cap release (£50) done now the warranty has ended.

It's been a boring but brilliant car. Happily takes us all on the big European camping trips every year. Had a bit of stick off the guys over the years until I drove then to the Alps this summer. 4 guys, tent and camping equipment all inside the car (with a bike bag). 3 bikes on the back. Sat at 80 on the autoroute the whole way and everyone was comfortable.

It's pig ugly though.

I would still say for a 2 kid family an estate makes more sense and is better VFM

And I would agree. But she still wanted a 'high up thing' so we replaced the Scenic with a C-Max. She could have had my Focus estate and got rid of her PITA Scenic ages ago, that would have made the most financial sense too. But no that was too low. So we have a C-Max with a smaller boot now.

OP - are you looking to buy new?

Some MPV's have 'odd' handling too - Granted Ford are better but I remember a couple of Tourans I drove were quite soft/leaned a fair bit when turning/cornering (normally). I also wasn't happy with their bulk/size. Funnily when a vehicle is longer you don't feel it (unless your reversing). When its taller etc you feel it.
Of course not all are the same.

You have a pregnant wife who has decided she wants something, yours is not the position to argue. Just ask her what colour Evoque she wants, and does she want the contrasting roof and alloys?

😆 @ midlifecrashes

My Renault scenic has been a nightmare based on my experience I'd say part of the problem is that they cost more to service as engine access can be more difficult

Don't look at consumer reviews look at objective data

This may help

[url= http://www.reliabilityindex.com/ratings/best/MPV ]index thing[/url]

What other websites do people use for reliability? I'm dubious abut JD Power after i read that the Fiat 500 low score was partly due to owners finding the rear seats cramped

@ampthill - That's cools, thanks.

Which Scenic? I 'heard' the latest ones (past 4yrs or so) are quite good?

Had my Touran for 8 years and 100k miles. Turbo went a couple of thousand miles ago but other than that it's been faultless.

MPVs also score on avoiding back ache trying to secure 3 kids into child seats in the back, you can be almost upright whilst doing so.

We went camping in a 5door Citroen C1, 2x adults, 1 toddler, 6man tent, airbed, quilts, cushions, blankets, bike on roof, all bike kit INSIDE the car etc. I could see out through all windows fully. Its all about clever packing.

I see no pushchair or food in that list or wet weather clothing or bikes for 5 participants or 4 plus tag a long. 2 kids is the tipping point, most families might work in an estate, ours definitely didn't and number 3 didn't make it easier.

but other than that it's been faultless.

MPV's tend to be taller external/internally but no bigger footprint internally. True? A fair statement?

My better half has a 59 plate Citroen C3 Picasso and it's been faultless in the 18 months we've had it. Plenty of space, good mpg and came fully specc'd for half the price of the Merc B Class she had her eye on (IIRC it was £8k with full dealer history and only 16k on the clock).

I can't help thinking that MPV reliability is a perfect storm of [s]skinflint[/s]price-conscious buyers who want to pay as little as possible for the space, want it to be cheap to run (hence the prevalence of small diesels despite doing little mileage) and for whom doing checks on things like oil and coolant is way down their list of priorities. Plus kids destroying interiors too.

So, anyone got any suggestions as to an MPV which will run trouble free for the next 5 years?

Petrol, manual, japanese. Avoid anything with a diesel (injectors, turbos, DPFs, dual mass flywheels), avoid the silly robotised autoboxes on things like Citroens.

Toyota Verso / Corolla Verso / Previa (and japanese equivalents of those), Honda Stream / FR-V, Mitsubishi Grandis, Mazda Premacy or 5.

edit: personally I'd be looking for a Mazda5 (and probably will be this time next year). The 05-00 ones are 5-star NCAP, nice simple reliable petrol engines, sliding van-style doors, plenty to choose from at the £4-5k mark.

Just don't buy a Korean MPV thats out of its warranty period.

With their transferable seven year warranties, you can get a four year old one for less than a quarter the price of a new European/US/Jap one and still drive away with the same cover.

Smax here, which has been expensive.

Going petrol next time, and probably an estate.

Rewatched an old rerun of Topgear this week where they discussed 12 MPV's (Backroad caravan race) and they said they have the same engines yet are taller, thirstier and slower with no noticeable reason to buy yet people still buy them.

Now, judging by the reviews of MPVs on sites like parkers and Honest John, they all seem like they'll explode within the first few minutes of owning.

Online reviews/forum post tend towards being whiney/negative [i]"I bought a thing and it's not perfect!"[/i] so take them with a pich of salt, those having positive experiences with just about any product are too busy enjoying life to tell the internetz about it... IMO.

You don't need an MPV with 2 kids a Golf is easily big enough,

Perhaps in your experience, but not everyone's family vehicle needs are the same...

we've just moved up from a Golf Estate to a Cmax with two kids, not because we plan to shift lots of people but because of all the "Peripherals" that come with being a family unit, if we go for a week away in Devon or Cornwall; Daddy wants to take his bike, so do the kids now, various boots and shoes, Mummy likes Body boarding so does Daddy so two Boards and wetsuits, beach tents and other assorted kit... Plus My missus will pack sufficient clothing everyone, for a month...

Take the middle seat out, it becomes a 4 seater with masses of luggage space... I'll be able to get all that stuff in without roof boxes or external bike racks.

As a weekend bike wagon for me on my own it's almost perfect as all the rear seats can come out making it quite van like, big old tarp/liner, bed roll and a sleeping bag and I can Sleep in there with the bike and no need to pitch a tent...

And it's a nice enough car to drive on a daily basis, based on a Focus so footprint isn't any bigger than the Golf really, my missus is comfortable enough driving it.

And that's a small MPV, more kids and junk and a seven seater starts to make sense IMO, not for the seats, but for the extra carrying capacity...

Some people need to pack lighter!

Wow and I got everything in a C1 compared.

Hora Firstly my Scenic is the one before the current one. The more recent one is meant to better

Rewatched an old rerun of Topgear this week where they discussed 12 MPV's (Backroad caravan race) and they said they have the same engines yet are taller, thirstier and slower with no noticeable reason to buy yet people still buy them.

I would say there are reasons to buy them are

Bigger boot volume

More seats

Better rear space. The back of the Scenic has a flat floor, a gap between the front seats and upright seats. So can get 3 tall teenagers and a dog in the back. I'm 6 foo four. Our Scenic is the only car that I've tried were I can set the driving seat for me and then sit in the seat behind it.

Pack light? Two kids and we couldn't manage a family camping trip in any of our recent cars (Scenic/Focus Est/C-Max), so the only (STW approved) answer was a T5....

[img] [/img]

we just got rid of our old faithfull mk4 golf hatchback because of another new arrival because the baby seat didnt fit behind the drivers seat without having to push it right forward into an uncomfortable postion and i'm only 5ft 10 at a push! And our eldest is still in his booster seat thing which causes the same problem. We looked at old passats and the like but ended up with a mk5 golf estate which has more legroom in the rear and a big boot so we now only need the roof box when we go camping with the extra clut that entails. And the car drives just like a normal golf and my wife is happier driving it around (she uses it the most in the week) as it isnt to big and unwieldy.

Thread cross polunation

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/minimal-riding-kit/page/2#post-6631541

Smax diesel here for 5 years and 60k miles. It's been good, excellent in fact. Not perfect, some minor issues which have been investigated and sorted by my local non dealer mechanic, so thankfully not too expensive in the end. Use dealers and they will fleece you, they're not interested in investigating the real cause and will just start swapping parts at your cost hoping they'll stumble on the fix. I think that is the real problem.

Rewatched an old rerun of Topgear this week where they discussed 12 MPV's (Backroad caravan race) and they said they have the same engines yet are taller, thirstier and slower with no noticeable reason to buy yet people still buy them.

So who's wrong. Judging by the amount of mpvs sold, I'd say it's the top gear folk who are missing the point...

If you have issues with seats touching kid seats you want a longer car. Tried Passats/Mondeos etc?

If you can't fit all your shit in your car take less shit. It's a lot cheaper!

We went to Scotland with a baby - full camping gear, chunky off-road pushchair AND an Orange Patriot all inside the Prius. It's not complicated.

Are you planning #3 offspring? 8)
In which case, go big and save the hassle later down the line. Full size 7 seater, not compact like a Touran...

Here you go - have a bit of fun whilst lugging the ankle biters and post-natal better half around... 😉

[img] [/img]

Never fancied a Ford in the past - But a Mondeo est is hard to look past and a full size car i.e. can take 3 car seats in rear and 'stuff'.

Others are A6, E class & Mazda 5.

A4, Passat etc. are too small.

Smax if you need the 5+2(kids) in reasonable comfort - but don't expect any luggage (mclaren and some shopping maybe).

The Mondeo/SMAX 2.0 ecoboost petrol titanium powershifts are often great value, powerful and comfy.

Ppl were shunning petrol - but compare purchase cost with diesel and the reliability (DPF, DMF etc.) for round town <12k/pa.

I chose a Skoda Roomster over a CMAX and think I made the right decision.

Are you blind mudshark?

I can't see what it looks like from the inside 🙂 Lack of looks was it's only bad point - rather like me.

Do you have pimped out side windows so you can't see the adults laughing and children crying? 😉

So who's wrong. Judging by the amount of mpvs sold, I'd say it's the top gear folk who are missing the point...

Three fella's living their mid-life crisis' out in public who get all sorts of flustered over sports cars worth more than my house?

Not really the people I'd listen to if trying to make decisions on a practical, affordable bit of transport for the cookie clan...

It is what it is, proportionate to our needs and budget, we didn't get a 7 seater or a 4x4, we got a mid size MPV, because we're stopping at two sprogs, and on our bigger outings we would rather transport all the crap we want to take, rather than sit crammed into a hatchback scoffing at people with slightly bigger vehicles imagining them to be profligate fools...

I mean nobody's suggested a Chrysler Grand voyager or a bloody great Shogun here, mostly it seems [i]sensible[/i] estates or MPVs... Or T5s, Hmmm.

Loddrik onesies sell really well in the UK.

Molgrips exactly!

A Roomster over a C-Max? Imagine that choice. A truly depressing day/realisation for a proper bloke.. 😆 8)

What's all that got to do with anything cookeaa?

You sound like one of those types that want to suppress the British male's peculiar desire to tell other people what they should and shouldn't be buying, particularly when it comes to cars.

Are you one of those American oiks that simply says 'nice car' to someone driving a nice car, and is too ****less to lecture all who will listen at great length about why he shouldn't have bought it?

Tut.

A Roomster over a C-Max? Imagine that choice. A truly depressing day/realisation for a proper bloke..

Says a Man driving a C1...

So who's wrong. Judging by the amount of mpvs sold, I'd say it's the top gear folk who are missing the point...

Every time they get in our Touran now Galaxy they comment on how good they are for the kids and life....but won't buy such 'dull' cars.

😐

Are you one of those American oiks that simply says 'nice car' to someone driving a nice car, and is too ****less to lecture all who will listen at great length about why he shouldn't have bought it?

Apologies, I'm sure if you leaf back through my history you'll find some example of me denigrating others choice of car... and of course Hora's matchbox 2 minutes ago...

'Drove' and it was great as a cheap lease car 😀

and of course Hora's matchbox 2 minutes ago...

Doesn't count, they're internationally ridiculed.

hora - Member
'Drove' and it was great as a cheap lease car
POSTED 2 MINUTES AGO #

Well it wasn't going to be expensive was it.

Better than beige-slacks CRV's.

Go on then Hora, whatcha driving now?

Roomster has better mpg, acceleration, flexibility and is more reliable than a CMAX and costs rather less. Yeah it doesn't look great, CMAX handles well but Roomster is fine - I tried and hated a C3 Picasso.

I still stand by my belief that the angriest people you'll see on the roads are all driving older Citroen MPVs actually...
Nothing is quite so scary as a ruddy faced, ball of rage forced by finances and circumstance to drive the top heavy, box of ugly, deathtrap that is a Xara picasso...

[Img] [/IMG]

I think the reason that there are loads of noise about MPV's having problems is due to them having harder lives, and the fact that they are bought privately rather than on business, consequently when the owners have issues they tend to shout a lot louder than company car drivers do.

I ran a Kia Sedona for 10 years and it was Brill, I would still be using it now except it was written off in an accident in September.

How long have you been a farmer Hora?

Yeah, can I just read you something from Top Gear magazine? No, it’s alright, I’ve got it here, I’ve got it here. [Opens the magazine on the bed and reads] "With a mere ninety break-horse-power available, progress is too leisurely to be called fast, but on the motorway in fifth gear the Megane’s slow pace really becomes a pain. Uphill runs become power-sappingly mundane, while overtaking National Express coaches can become a long, drawn-out affair." Not my words, Carol, the words of Top Gear magazine. [Click] Hello?

hora - Member
Better than beige-slacks CRV's.
POSTED 32 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

I'm getting to really like my CRV, it was just bought as a relatively cheap vehicle for carrying my boxing stuff, bikes and dogs. I was not expecting to find it so relaxing to drive or useful for taking stuff to the tip. It's been the perfect car to sit with my others and it's staying long term. Highly recommended.

I never said there were anything wrong with your satorial choice. Rather you all like beige trews gramps 😀

hang on a mo folks.

Lots of rear leg room + huge boot + inverse badge snobbery = Skoda Superb Estate, surely?

Oh were taking it to the clothing game. Do Subarus come with a tapout hoody? Or the C1 with a school tie and a green P plate?

Sorry OP I won't derail the thread anymore, and I do actually like Subarus.

hang

on a mo folks.

Lots of rear leg room + huge boot + inverse badge snobbery = Skoda Superb Estate, surely?

But ops wife wants high up. Superb is not high up

We could swap fashion tips? 🙂

Mpv's get more complaints?

You could see it that they are generally driven by families as not serviced properly/used as tools rather than 'pride n joys'? If I bought (secondhand) one I'd personally veer towards a Toyota Previa.

More likelt though-If I had two kids I'd be looking at:
E class estate
Mondeo
Superb estate
A6 estate

When my kids were young the only MPV's were the Renault Espaces, and I couldn't get those as a company car - so had estates instead.

I'd buy an MPV now over an estate, if in the same position (3 young kids).

Ah yeah, bugger

OP - tell your Mrs she's being hormonal and irrational and to stop being silly.

Good luck. At least you might not be around to have to drive said dad mobile

😉

XC90 ?

I had a Smax for 3 and a bit years....no problems with reliability (apart from a crack in the Cat which it had from new and took ages for Ford to fix). Not sure what to buy next, the Smax isn't perfect, but with 3 kids, I'm not seeing many better options?

SMax is superb at what it does, but overkill for two kids. If you're needing to lug extra people, but not all the time, I can't see much better. Having said that, new Zafiras are much better than the original, and can be had brand new for less than ten grand. Put that next to new car warranty as well and it's hard to ignore.