[Closed] 2019 General Election

Klunk

Member

I can’t see how the SNP can be denied another ref on this result, 48 out of 59 for a nationalist party “is we want independence and we want it now!”

Actually I think it was more a "we want to stay in the EU" type plea more than anything else. I hope Sturgeon does get another referendum and gets her arse handed to her on a plate again. I can't see the Scots being dumb enough to be out of the EU and independant of Britain as well.

Please could you possibly point me at any socialist/liberal/democratic government here or across Europe who has in the past or is now doing anything to overcome this Europe-wide problem?

Homelessness right here in the UK went up during austerity, as did poverty and in-work poverty. It was better in this country before austerity. I don't think you need to look elsewhere for your arguments.

It's funny that it's just Tory voters that get conned. Where did all the demented OAPs who were confused about the original referendum and would now change their vote go? To the polling stations that's where, to finish what they voted for in 2016.

The result called a while ago. Predicted ..
Boris wins Tory leadership
New deal negotiated
Governing becomes impossible
Election called
Best Tory majority since 1987.

https://order-order.com/2019/12/13/one-pundit-called/

Homelessness right here in the UK went up during austerity, as did poverty and in-work poverty. It was better in this country before austerity. I don’t think you need to look elsewhere for your arguments.

I've no doubt you are right but what was the fundamental cause of Tory austerity measures? Was it maybe the Blair/Brown governments putting an end to the cycle of boom and bust? Didn't exactly do us a lot of good did it trying to bankrupt the country. Yes, of course, we should have just thrown more money at the problem that would have solved it.

Could you possibly suggest what is the excuse for Germany, France, Spain et al in this regard as well?

Brian Blessed could pull it off though so i’ll concede the point.

Brian Blessed has a big shouty posh voice, rescues lost animals, and has shagged his way through about fifteen hareems whilst simultaneously navigating to the north pole on a sled pulled by huskies.

Also, he said "Gordon's Alive".

Ideal Prime Minister material.

Actually I think it was more a “we want to stay in the EU”

if that was the case then Swinson would have kept her seat.

Brian Blessed has a big shouty posh voice, rescues lost animals, and has shagged his way through about fifteen hareems whilst simultaneously navigating to the north pole on a sled pulled by huskies.

Also, he said “Gordon’s Alive”.

Ideal Prime Minister material.

But he has a beard.

Hugh Grant FTW.
Posh shaggers seem to be all the rage.

Beard:

 forzafkawi I can’t see the Scots being dumb enough to be out of the EU and independant of Britain as well.

Cheers for that, i can't see how the english are dumb enough to elect a turkey slaughterhouse to lead them into xmas.

I am pro indépendance and pro EU/pro immigration rather than a closeted narrow minded brexiteer.

Just reading through all the results, it's very depressing.
All 3 Stoke seats went blue.
High Peak gone blue and most disappointingly Dennis Skinner lost his seat 😩. The house of commons will be a very different place 🙁

The house of commons will be a very different place

Indeed, there won't be so much counter argument as in recent past. It'll just be a bunch of torytards pointing fingers and shouting down anyone who cares to open their mouths.

I’ve no doubt you are right but what was the fundamental cause of Tory austerity measures? Was it maybe the Blair/Brown governments putting an end to the cycle of boom and bust?

Simplified, if you borrow shit loads of money ay some point you have to pay it back or be forever indebted.     Lots of people furnished themselves with the results of that borrowing. and now are impacted by UK/.org paying it back.

Vis a vis there's decades of people in large houses with several cars and a greenhouse complaining about potholes in the road and the length of time it takes to get a Dr's appointment.

The house of commons will be a very different place

I'd imagine Holyrood will be a different place also after the new government rams through legislation to strip it of as many powers as it can.

It's all about Taking Back Control innit.

somafunk

Subscriber

forzafkawi I can’t see the Scots being dumb enough to be out of the EU and independant of Britain as well.

Cheers for that, i can’t see how the english are dumb enough to elect a turkey slaughterhouse to lead them into xmas.

I am pro indépendance and pro EU/pro immigration rather than a closeted narrow minded brexiteer.

Jibes aside I can't see what Scottish independance would achieve? I can understand why the Scots would prefer to be part of Europe but can't fathom your isolationist attitude to GB (or is it just England?). I just don't see the majority voting to go it alone in another referendum.

Posh shaggers seem to be all the rage.

As it happens, I haven't shaved for a couple of months...

The house of commons will be a very different place

I’d imagine Holyrood will be a different place also after the new government rams through legislation to strip it of as many powers as it can.

It’s all about Taking Back Control innit.

Is a very good point.

Is a very good point.

No, its not, its moronic garbage like so much posted on STW's political threads - carry on in your deluded bubble.

Ignore

Is a very good point.

No, its not, its moronic garbage like so much posted on STW’s political threads – carry on in your deluded bubble.

Meh

No, its not, its moronic garbage like so much posted on STW’s political threads – carry on in your deluded bubble.

If you can't see that, bouyed by the success of his recent tactics, Dominic Cummings won't instruct Boris to  use whatever means necessary to further consolidate his position then you're the one that's deluded.

He's lied to the Queen, purged the moderates from his own party, thrown his DUP mates under the bus and sidelined all of the Westminster opposition parties.

Who's next? The judiciary, the BBC and Channel 4 should also expect a stormy time ahead.

It's about time the BBC were taken to task, especially for their pathetic interpretation of The War Of The Worlds

If you can’t see that, bouyed by the success of his recent tactics, Dominic Cummings won’t instruct Boris to use whatever means necessary to further consolidate his position then you’re the one that’s deluded.

There is absolutely zero benefit in political terms - therefore will not happen.

Posh shaggers seem to be all the rage.

As it happens, I haven’t shaved for a couple of months…

Implied humblebrag by CFH, I've been told you're not as good looking as you think, Tracey from seat 107c joining the mile high club doesn't count. 😉

There is absolutely zero benefit in political terms – therefore will not happen.

What do you mean. Boris cannot comprehend the concept of scrutiny. Anything he can do to neuter it, he will do.

Posh shaggers seem to be all the rage.

David Beckham for PM

Jibes aside I can’t see what Scottish independance would achieve? I can understand why the Scots would prefer to be part of Europe but can’t fathom your isolationist attitude to GB

We can't fathom England's love affair with the tories

How come none of the countries that have gained independence from the UK have ever came crawling back? What makes Scotland the exception? Why is our desire for independence questioned?

I can’t see the Scots being dumb enough to be out of the EU and independant of Britain as well.

I pray the SNP aren't dumb enough to hold another Indyref without some sort of assurances from the EU.

Problem is, this is where the next battle in the media will be fought, it will be the 65% Tory/right wing papers telling us that we can't rejoin the EU, v.s. the centrist/lefty papers telling us maybe, and the National telling us definitely.

And moderates like me stuck in the middle wondering which way to gamble. I wouldn't and didn't vote for Scotland out of EU AND GB, although look where that got me, Scotland out of EU whether I like it or not.

Richard Burgon in denial on world at one there: no no, nothing wrong with policies or leader, it's just a blip

Blunkett and Clarke talking sense: different leader with soclal democratic policies would have cleaned up

There is absolutely zero benefit in political terms – therefore will not happen.

+1. Boris is going to spend the next five years doing popular stuff to chase votes. He's not going to do anything to jeopardize that.

We can’t fathom England’s love affair with the tories

Really? Because Scotland has two Tory MPs and only one Labour MP. If you all want a Labour government so much how about providing 50 or so Labour MPs to join the 200 or so England and Wales provides?

Feels to me as though Scotland is as reluctant to vote for Momentum/Labour as anyone in England and Wales.

He’s got a majority of 80, he hasn’t got anything to worry about, especially from a bunch of MPs who spend their time banging on about independence.

+1.

What do you mean. Boris cannot comprehend the concept of scrutiny.

He's got a majority of 80, he hasn't got anything to worry about, especially from a bunch of MPs who spend their time banging on about independence.

We can’t fathom England’s love affair with the tories

It's not so long ago that the SNP were known as the tartan tories. And don't forget that nearly four in every ten Scots voted to leave the EU.

My point is that Scotland, like England, is not a homogeneous entity. Plenty of us down south live in Labour/ remain areas.

BoardinBob

What makes Scotland the exception? Why is our desire for independence questioned?

Your "desire for independance" is in the minority though as ably demonstrated by the last referendum 45%-55%. Do you think leaving the EU will overcome that defecit?

In seriousness; Labour needs a celebrity, charismatic leader without significant baggage, ASAP. It’s the main reason Boris harvested working class, not particularly politically engaged votes. Time and again I heard “yeah, but you know, he’s funny isn’t he?” from friends and colleagues (in the bloody NHS!!?!?) as a justification for why the were drawn towards Boris.

Charisma, sadly, is worth a great deal more than worthy policies.

The manifesto, other than being perceived as complicated and a bit ambitious, was not particularly toxic, and many liked the individual policy ideas.

So Hugh Grant/Frank Skinner/Peter Kaye and a simplified, less ambitious manifesto should walk it in 5 years time.

Blunkett and Clarke talking sense: different leader with soclal democratic policies would have cleaned up

Talking sense or representing your politics? It's obvious that Corbyn is unpopular but Labour's policies tend to poll favourably. I think they made a huge mistake to shoehorn so much into their manifesto but it doesn't mean that everything in there should be scrapped.

He’s got a majority of 80, he hasn’t got anything to worry about, especially from a bunch of MPs who spend their time banging on about independence.

Grand Moff Cummings

The Scottish Parliament will no longer be of any concern to us. I have just received word that the Emperor has dissolved the council permanently. The last remnants of the Old Republic have been swept away.

General Mogg:
But that's impossible. How will the Emperor maintain control without the bureaucracy?

Grand Moff Cummings
The regional governors now have direct control over their territories. Fear will keep the local systems in line.

In seriousness; Labour needs a celebrity, charismatic leader without significant baggage, ASAP.

If by "ASAP" you mean "about five years ago" then you're bang on the money.

If by “ASAP” you mean “about five years ago” then you’re bang on the money.

True dat. Still, we are where we are. Any raises on H Grant/F Skinner/P Kaye?

If by “ASAP” you mean “about five years ago” then you’re bang on the money.

If the unions hadn't got the wrong Milliband elected the right Milliband would still be PM today, and there wouldn't have been a referendum.

Fantasyland that ‘the right Milliband’ would have made the foggiest bit of difference.

Fantasyland that ‘the right Milliband’ would have made the foggiest bit of difference.

The manifesto, other than being perceived as complicated and a bit ambitious, was not particularly toxic, and many liked the individual policy ideas.

It was dreadful for all the reasons debated endlessly on the other thread.

David Blunkett described it as "An impossible program which nobody would believe."

The manifesto was as bad as Corbyn himself and the mental Brexit position.

If the unions hadn’t got the wrong Milliband elected the right Milliband would still be PM today, and there wouldn’t have been a referendum.

+1.

Do you think leaving the EU will overcome that defecit?

I voted no because I didn't want to be out of the EU, it was a big part of the campaign and something that the SNP were unable to reassure us on adequately. Now it's irrelevant, we're out!

It wasn't the only thing, remember the concerns about the oil running out and rumours that the Tories were sitting on the knowledge of a big new field being discovered? Guess what was in the news the very next day after IndyRef? That's right! Guess what guys, the oil isn't running out!

I don't want to get into an argument about oil though (it obviously is running out in the grand scheme). Point being, a lot of things which might have scared moderate voters away from a YES vote have since been rendered moot, or shown to be project fear. I'll vote Yes this time simply to be shot of the toxic wasteland that is Westminster.

also I wish the SNP had the guts to just say 'why should we present an economic case for independence, where was the proven economic case for Brexit?'

They get held to an impossibly high standard, remember the white paper they issued for IndyRef1, which got debated in forensic detail? Where was the Brexit equivalent? A slogan on a ****ing bus?