[Closed] Would you buy Enve wheels if you had the cash?

handbuilt LB carbons on Hope on my 29er. Can't see why I'd spend any more personally.

No but £300-£350 is pretty much a set of Hopes and that is enough for my pro world champion wannabe forum warrior delusions.

Yeah, why not? I really do not have the cash though and can't envisage a time when I would. However....

No; they instantly mark you out as a rider that doesn't have a clue.

Are they called enve because people will envy you if you have them? Serious question. Those wheels are so up themselves if true.

Absolutely
They mark you out as a rider who really knows there stuff.

Better than your spelling then martyn 😉

Why ride anything less?

Your a fool if you do.

Who wouldn't want to give huge piles of cash to a company with a shit customer service? Go nicely on an Evil I suppose

Just go with LBs new rims, don't see why you'd bother with anything else unless you care about not giving Chinese workers Pneumoconiosis/Fibrosis.

No; they instantly mark you out as a rider that doesn't have a clue.

Exactly, and who gives a shit if you can afford Enve wheels if you cannot afford the Santa [s]claus[/s] Cruz to put them on.

You don't see Orange 5 riders mincing round on Enve.

[img] [/img]

😉

If you have the cash why not?

I would now like to add sarcasm in my previous post.

oh the FAIL 🙁

Is nothing sacred anymore?

I'd stick on a pair of LB rims, keep enough in the bank to buy another pair if I break them, and spend the rest on pva and glitter.

Even if the Enves are significantly better- and the verdict's out- they're not sufficiently better to justify the massive price difference. My newLB set is going to cost me something like £450 all in I think inc used DT240S hubs. Also LB seem to have better crash damage support!

Yeah. If I had the cash I'd buy a Foes DH to stick them on and go to Leogang every 8 weeks.

I don't so I ride my Inbred down the local hills. Stupid fantasy.

Edit: I am the sort whose perfect bike is still a 26" Dialled Alpine with stans and pikes and minions. That is still a fantasy... CARBON WHAT!

I'm 48...............so. No

I would, but they don't do fat rims yet.

Just because other people struggle to afford them and Justify the expense, doesn't mean you shouldn't get them.

I have ridden a set, and they do make a difference, but I can't afford them. But I would definitely buy them if the opportunity arose.

Not MTB ones. Was tempted by some road ones. It was fleeting though, and the FarSports ones which turned up today look great!

Nope. I'm not one for chucking money away.

I don't have anything like enve money going spare so yeah being I probably would make a couple of slightly jealously based judgements on seeing a pair of Enve wheels on your bike...

Can't say hand on heart I wouldn't fancy the bling if it was actually within my means but then you could probably have two or three good wheelsets for the same money and you'll be less concerned about busting them, plus there's bound to be other kit you want/need more...

I have m60/king set on my 29r, they are a nice set of wheels. I couldn't afford them if I had to buy them.

I have had Enve AM's and Enve M70 Thirtys. Replacing a rear rim on crash replacement was about £475 after a rock punctured the M70. That cost more than a pair of Derby carbon rims! I have since bought a pair of DT Swiss EX471 rims.

I can but opted for the LB's on both my Mach6 and Switchback, I think there is a line you have to draw between what you can actually afford, the performance benefits to your actual ability and what you can afford to throw away if they get damaged.

I'm very tempted by a set of lb on my next bike. Has anyone anywhere g aged the enve and lb back to back? I'd buy them if I could see they were worth the extra but I'm doubting anyone could demonstrate that.

I had the cash, bought them, dont like them at all. For me, the bike felt harsh as hell and lost all the "compliance".

Flows feel better. Save your money.

i'm a firm believer of you get what you pay for thats my problem.
My bike is perfect the only thing left is the wheels. At the minute I'm running a set of crossmax which have been excellent so far.
I also seen a brand new (first ride) ibis carbon wheel go bang in the summer. I think thats what may be putting me off a cheaper brand.

No; they instantly mark you out as a rider that doesn't have a clue.

😆

Flows feel better. Save your money.

Flows are the only non ENVE wheels I've had for years, and I hated them,

Last ENVE rims I paid retail for was 45 Tubulars in 2010, price has been creeping up since then - had quite a few since, all used as the resale value is crap and bargains can be had - did get a set of 65 Clinchers on Powertap G3 hubs for less than the cost of the rims

I'd buy light bikes and far sports rims too no issues

Absolutely I would. A big part of the attraction would be the wind up value...

It seems to me that Enve's biggest customers are other bike manufacturers who buy them for new bike photoshoots.

I'm not adverse to wasting money on bikes and the associated bling, but I can't stomach the price for Enve wheels. I'd rather buy some LB rims and some Enve stickers :))

Just buy some ENVE decals instead - they're a bit cheaper

Edit: helps if you read the post above before posting...

😀

Onzadog - we backed to back a pair of Enve m50s and LB with me and a mates Czar. The LBs felt dead, no spring and the spin up was a bit more of a chore. Result: mate puchased some Enve's.

It's quite clear that just because something is carbon doesn't make it great - had USE carbon wheels too , they were lead!

Also, I've got great support and convenience with my LBS and saddleback rep. And personally I tend to avoid Chinese stuff where possible. (Not all Chinese stuff is bad - factory conditions vary etc.)

I don't get the frustration at Enve, they are trying to do something well and that costs.

You can demo M60s up at my LBS if need be - there is a cost to insure and change over discs. Or I'm more than willing for local folk to have a ride on my M50s or AM275.

As a camera operator I can be hired for £150+ a day with a bog standard HD camera for £900+ a day with a Red Epic Dragon 6K. I know which one yields the best quality. Only one of those camera was used on Gone Girl. 😉

I'm sure making them in the US and not China has something to do with cost also.

Hmmm.. Yes.

I'd buy them in an instant - if I could afford them, but that's it because I'm a serial bike-tart. Free matching wheel decals for £1700 - yes please!

On a more realistic note, I'd probably get some LB rims, were it not for those gopping 'LB' logos on them - that just say 'C.H.E.A.P.'

If they did LB rims in blank unlogoed carbon, I'd snap them up in an instant.

And put Enve decals on them.. 😆

Given I had the cash (technically I have the cash at the moment easily, but buying bits for bikes is not the only life priority any more - so we are talking about having more cash than I know what to do with- my priorities would probably change if I still raced) and I had a chance to use them and they had a discernible advantage over cheaper alternatives I might. But I would debadge them first, just as I did with my Zipp wheels when I competed a lot on the road. My opinion is that I'm paying to use them not be a rolling advert for a firm. In the same vein I refuse to buy clothes with big garish manufacturer's logos.

And put Enve decals on them..

If they did LB rims in blank unlogoed carbon, I'd snap them up in an instant.

Pretty sure you can still tick a "no decals please" box

If they did LB rims in blank unlogoed carbon, I'd snap them up in an instant.

Err yeah, they do. With choices of finish too.

depends on what you mean by "have the money"? If you have a huge disposable income, why not, if your spending is limited then they're certainly not good value. I've recently treated myself to TWO sets of carbon road wheels, some superlight LB's and later some of those 45mm USE that Rutland are selling 'cheap' (and with a £50 code); I decided against replacing the whole bike when I got upgradeitis, and the 2 sets combined probably cost £1k which is less than I would have spent on a new bike and much less than one set of Enve, Reynolds etc

If they did LB rims in blank unlogoed carbon, I'd snap them up in an instant.

my LBs are totally "stealth"; UD-finish with no logos.

I'd need persuading that I'd personally see an advantage before spending that much on a wheelset. I'm pretty sure Flow EXs outclass my riding.

So, personally, I probably wouldn't as it seems a lot of cash to tie up for no reason, but they are undeniably blingy.

Your money, if you want nice wheels why not.

I have a set of road Enve Classic 65 Tubulars with the DT Swiss Hubs.

They were $2000 for bare wheels, picked up at a discount as I love shopping for a deal, I wouldn't have paid 3k+ for them.

I like how the spoke holes are moulded into the rim unlike other rims which are drilled. Neater and lighter solution. I have raced on them for the past 4 months and they haven't needed truing or had any issues.

I could have got ffwd rims for less with their own branded hub, or $100-200 less with the DT Swiss hub.

Buying Chinese carbon wasn't for me.

Neater and lighter solution

Moot point when the rims are heavier.

If they did LB rims in blank unlogoed carbon, I'd snap them up in an instant.

Errrrrr, you can spec them with no logos. In fact the last time I bought a pair you had to spec logos if you wanted them.

Oooooh.. You can get LB rims with no logos.. Oooooh.. 😯

Finding this out could be expensive for me now.. 😆

Yup, these are my lb rims, 26er, 32 spoke am rims (33mm wide hookless, 27mm internal width... Wanted a subtle look so 3k weave matte finish.. Loving them.

[img] [/img]

Subtle would have been UD finish, what you chose is just 90's tackiness 😛

Carbon 29er wheels are a great upgrade, much stiffer than ally ones, but can feel a little harsh at times.

I've been running 2 sets of LD wheels for over a year now. Awesome.

I'm thinking 26" carbon wheels must be pretty harsh. 😯

Erm...

No. I think Mav wheels are better and have better warranties.

Mavic? 😯 Maybe if you've got two pairs!

Subtle would have been UD finish, what you chose is just 90's tackiness

The 3k weave on top of the structural UD rim actually gives it some impact protection I believe. So it's worth having.

id rather have no protection, although thats been the story of my life in recent years 😳 😆

Possibly, I went 3k mainly as UD would look too plain to me with out some sort of decal.

Superstar AM Carbon? I shall tell you what they're like once I've managed to get a f..king tyre on..

I can't make any comparison to LB etc as these are my first mtb carbon rims, but I immediately noticed that steering/tracking in very rough descents is miles better than the Stans crest/archex. Don't find them that harsh either.
I am a bit biased as they sponsor me, but I've seen what goes on in terms of r&d/quality and they really know their onions and they really involve themselves in pro teams, builders and events to keep developing.
[img] ?1[/img]

Had some, broke them - crash replacement was basically distributor cost anyway, so still rediculously expensive.

Stupid design on an MTB with the nipples hidden in the rim so you have to remove the tyre and rim strip to true them.

Probably the weakest of all the carbon rims I have run. Otherwise I couldn't tell the difference between them and any other carbon rim i've used.

I did post on here a few weeks ago with my opinions of carbon rims on an MTB being used and raced in a gravity environment being largely b*llocks, so i'm not the biggest fan.

That said, LB warrantied the cracked front rim of the pair I ruined recently. The Derby rim on the back? No warranty this time.

So, would I buy them if I had the cash? Well I do have the cash, and nope, not a hope in hells chance would I buy them.

Had the money and the SC Nomad CC to put them on but went for Mavic Crossmax enduro instead and have never once had to inspect my wheels for damage and cracks.
My mate has ENVE's on his bike and just looking at those spindly little spokes fills me with a total lack of confidence.

The rims are good but they really need to make a wheel where the rim,spoke and hub technology come together.

I think mtb hubs will get a look in...

and just looking at those spindly little spokes fills me with a total lack of confidence.

what the spindly little spokes that make up 99.999999% of the worlds wheels? 😆

mavic don't have the best track record with spokes 😉

http://velonews.competitor.com/2009/06/bikes-and-tech/a-shattering-experience-a-post-recall-r-sys-wheel-failure_93054

Its not if they are affordable or not. Its about value for money. My LBs, without stickers, rims were bought from the classifieds, built onto existing Hope hubs by 18 Bikes, cost less than £400. Got two sets of Superstar one for £350 and one last week for £300. Both sets have been hammered this year and still look good. Cant see the Enve been that much better for our riding

They're eight.nine.ten times the price of an LB rim, with the aforementioned hassle of removing the tyre to true them or tighten a spoke.

There's just no justifying that premium in my mind. Especially for a product that is, whether Enve or LB, somewhat flawed. Pinkbike have had three or four sets crack during reviews alone.

Dunno, I'd need to try them TBH.

But realistically when I'm sweating about buying a bike ( currently MTBless) prob not!

On my road bike however!!

[IMG] [/IMG]

I have had Enve and have Derby rims, 29 and 27.5. The Enve's in my opinion do feel different. Generally backed up by people that have ridden my bike with them and then got their own, generic LB or Derby or similar rims and been happy with the wheels but always say they just don't feel the same, often talking about compliance or a magic feel.

The same happened when someone rode my bike and immediately wanted the frame. I sold it to them but they always said it never felt the same, even when they put their own carbon wheels on.

I let mine go when I built a 27.5 custom after my 29 customs but if I had the money would have no hesitation about getting another set.

My 29 Enve's are available again I know as the friend has defected to 27.5 after being bewitched by Chris Porters Nicolai collaboration.

msg me if you want me to put you in touch. I think you'd get them for a comparable price to a good quality new build with Chinese rims.

Having recently bought some other Chinese rims for my rigid and to try the plus sizes the quality of the carbon and the finish is not in the same league. Enve don't have to paint their rims, the finish is so good. That's not to say they aren't as strong etc, just that they are a quality product and I think, in the long run, worth it.

Chainline - Member

Having recently bought some other Chinese rims for my rigid and to try the plus sizes the quality of the carbon and the finish is not in the same league. Enve don't have to paint their rims, the finish is so good. That's not to say they aren't as strong etc, just that they are a quality product and I think, in the long run, worth it.

Are they EIGHT times as good? Because that, give or take, is the price premoum over LB.

Most bike products have a cheap and an expensive versionm and I'm as much a sucker for that s anyone. A Nomad carbon frame is twice the price of some aluminium equivalents - that sort of thing isn't new.

But justifying a carbon rim that's eight times the price of the competition - I just can't. If they were indestructible, or their warranty was beyond reproach, you might consider it, but they're anything but.

Having recently bought some other Chinese rims for my rigid and to try the plus sizes the quality of the carbon and the finish is not in the same league. Enve don't have to paint their rims, the finish is so good. That's not to say they aren't as strong etc, just that they are a quality product and I think, in the long run, worth it.

Bollocks. The finish is no different. How are you discerning that the "quality of the carbon" is better?

If i had the cash....

I'd go for Superstar carbon AM rims built on CK hubs, available on their website for £1100.

This swayed it for me:

We are so confident in the reliability of our carbon rims that we have extended our crash replacement policy to completely rebuild your wheel with new spokes and nipples for half the retail price of a new rim.

I'd spend the rest on a nice holiday ?

Chainline - Member

Having recently bought some other Chinese rims for my rigid and to try the plus sizes the quality of the carbon and the finish is not in the same league. Enve don't have to paint their rims, the finish is so good.

Wait, wut? How exactly are you evaluating the quality of the carbon? And what is the comment about painting rims about? Practically nobody paints carbon rims. (let's be honest, most people with carbon rims don't want to hide it with paint)

I have had Enve and have Derby rims, 29 and 27.5. The Enve's in my opinion do feel different. Generally backed up by people that have ridden my bike with them and then got their own, generic LB or Derby or similar rims and been happy with the wheels but always say they just don't feel the same, often talking about compliance or a magic feel.

<cough>BS</cough>

Come back when you've tested them double blind, or even with some Enve stickered LB rims, so the riders don't know what they're expecting to feel. I'm pretty dubious about the "magic feel" comparing carbon to alu rims, but suggesting there's a difference between one carbon rim and another is taking it to a whole new level.

I'd probably get the Zelvy's instead
http://www.zelvycarbon.com/

Having ridden the following:
MTB - Enve XC, LB XC and 38mm wide
Road - Enve Smart 3.4, Farsport 38mm and LB 35mm

I can report there was no difference in ride or feel (I have yet to find out what a 'dead' wheel feels like) between ENVE MTB wheels. However on road the 3.4 do hold their speed better and this is due to the design and not the Enve Carbon.

My Enve wheels can with bikes on stock build, keeping my road rims but sold my MTB rims. As for the quality / finish it hard to tell the difference. Also the Enve internal nipples are a pain.

I have yet to find out what a 'dead' wheel feels like

It's what it feels like to be dry bummed by a marketing man 😉

nipples are a pain

You can get cream for that.....

Nah, internal nipples being a pain is minor surgery I think.

Theres no way I'd spend that on a set of wheels for the bike, they're just not worth the money to me.

I owned a set of lightbike 26" carbon rims, but when I changed bikes to a 650b bike, I went back to bog standard aluminium rims. The upsides of the carbon rims were not greater than the downsides. So at 7 or 8 times the price the enve's are definitely not worth it for me.

I wouldn't. I feel like I've got the same performance from my Bird wheels including the same peace of mind.

I'd go LB rims and an extra trip to whistler/the alps or a few more weekends away, more performance enhancing.

It is pretty unanimous that alu rims do give you a better ride quality, carbon are just lighter and stiffer, more efficient, but harsher, both LB rims and enve's will give you this.

Until there's a carbon rim that stays as light as they are now, but give the compliance of an alu rim, they're all much of muchness, paying extra for nothing.

I'm a LB user.

Might get some for my audax bike

I have a Cervelo and Enve wheels, but im not a dentist! (Did they move onto Pinarellos now?)

[img] [/img]

I'm finding this topic really interesting, just a bit curious about "feel".

With 160mm of travel and a 2.3" tyre at 25 psi, I assume vertical compliance is not the issue. I'm not sure I'd tell the difference between carbon and alu let alone two carbon manufacturers.

I assume we're talking lateral flex, how much does the wheel fold over in corners? Again, isn't there more give in the tyre than the rim? I can see that if the wheel is too stiff it will bounce over the ground in corners like a rigid fork vs a suspension fork.

Just curious about how big a part of this system the rim is.