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"People understand 1x gearing – it’s like in their car. 2x and 3x is a nightmare to explain to non-technically minded beginners!"
Yup but that's 2 different things- when I loan a bike to my brother I'm so glad for 1x because 2x or god forbid 3x confused the hell out of him. In use, it's great for novices. But it mostly makes it less good for the sort of riding that cheap bikes tend to actually do, entry level bikes actually benefit from a bigger range of gears than a dedicated mtb (and none of them come with a 500% single ring)
And yep 18 or 21 or 30 is more than 12 and more is good. I think some folks would sneer at that but even with mtb enthusiasts 1x is poorly understood and Shimano have sold huge amounts of expensive gearsets by adding "one more" without really adding any functionality (so have SRAM, till 11 speed)
Interesting anecdotal evidence in this thread that people who try the new sram 11/12 actually seem to like it! Many people who haven't tried it don't like it 😉
In use, it’s great for novices. But it mostly makes it less good for the sort of riding that cheap bikes tend to actually do, entry level bikes actually benefit from a bigger range of gears than a dedicated mtb (and none of them come with a 500% single ring)
therein lies the problem - at this level the range of gears must suit every customer, not just each one individually. The idea of buying a chainring to suit your riding conditions would be so far beyond this consumer group it would be like asking them to pull the engine out of their car.
One person wants a granny ring to go slowly up country hillsides to a viewpoint, one buys a cheap mtb as a comfy road going vehicle, and one is using it for generic fitness/ exercise from road to trailcentre and everything in between. And a surprising number get into 44:11 at every possible opportunity and gurn along at 12rpm in the mistaken belief it is faster.
i recently bought a new bike that had the option of either xt or eagle (nukeproof) i went eagle, why wouldn't you?
Me too , Trek fuel EX8 . Plenty of XT bikes left but not many Eagle .
On the other hand I recently built a new transition scout from frame only so I could avoid sram, always thought it feels and looks cheap and nasty.
It cost me a little bit more than the off the shelf model but I feel like I’ve got a much better spec for the money.
On the other hand I recently built a new transition scout from frame only so I could avoid sram, always thought it feels and looks cheap and nasty.
What was the last one you tried?
10 speed XO I think, to be fair I’ve never owned a sram groupset and only used them on other people’s bikes.
lol you should try one, might save you some cash 😉
Nah I’m happy with xt.
No worries, file you under the never tried sram 11/12 😉
I had a play with it in a shop but didn’t like it, not had the chance to ride a bike with it though.
and to be fair I know playing with it in a shop isn’t the same as using it but I just don’t like sram. Shimano has always worked well for me, sram could well be better but I’m happy.
"therein lies the problem – at this level the range of gears must suit every customer, not just each one individually. The idea of buying a chainring to suit your riding conditions would be so far beyond this consumer group it would be like asking them to pull the engine out of their car."
Or, more precisely, most cheap mtbs can't just be mtbs, they have to also be hybrids. It'd be the same at all levels if people bought £10000 Santa Cruzes to ride to work and to ride offroad but enthusiast spec stuff generally "only" has to be a great mtb and not also a great shopper.
I've gone from 10 speed XT to eagle GX this year. No problems so far but I think the XT levers had better ergonimics. I mis two way release and find that the donwshift lever is in the wrong place. I know eagle XO1 has an adjustable lver but it is a £95 option.
I'm thinking of going GX gripshift as that is a far cheaper experiment.
GX grip was great for me, went there to get over hand injury but stuck with it until I got a new bike with triggers and worked out it was much better 🙂 Hacksaw and your existing grips make things match
I've ridden Shimano drivetrains for nearly 30 years and up until 10speed MTB wouldn't even think of using Sram but disappointing 11spd XT isn't a patch on 10spdXT.
For new school Gravel/adventure 1x bikes Shimano are not even on the same planet as Sram, this coupled with a lack of complete build kits and I think Shimano are in serious trouble with their heads in the sand about it. Hope to be proved otherwise.
Aye, Shimano 10 speed was mint- the Saint shifter really set the standard tbh and the shifting nicked everything that was good about SRAM 9 speed and kept Shimano build quality. Meanwhile for 11 speed XT they've nicked SRAM's crappy 9 speed build quality and added weight to balance it out.
I've gone from Shimano (exage!) to SRAM (X9) to Shimano again (sainty-XT-mixy) as being "the best" but GX eagle is just bloody awesome.