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I would not trust a re-welded alu frame. Repaired carbon or steel maybe but not alu. £350 for a new front triangle is good deal and a much safer option I would have thought
Didn't Giant used to make bikes that you invalidated the warranty if you used the "correct" sized seatpost- they came with a shim and you had to use a 27.2?
I think it's pretty ropey tbh, seatpost shims have been around forever, so it's not too shocking that people would use one, and while mechanically I don't like the idea I think it's pretty reasonable for people to expect that parts that are so commonplace will be basically safe.
I would not trust a re-welded alu frame. Repaired carbon or steel maybe but not alu. £350 for a new front triangle is good deal and a much safer option I would have thought
thanks for the advice Dan, but i am sure that you can understand that i have not any wishes to spend more money on them
Pjm84...
Looks like Giant have changed positions quite radically. That's a real shame. They used to be fantastic to deal with.
johnny really knows how I feel...
Changed my seat post to a Thomson on my Giant Advanced XTC and this allowed Giant to refuse the warranty. Component change!
😯
There's a guy on here, MidlandTrailquestsGraham, who broke a few frames at that point and had them successfully repaired. Have a look for his threads.
What is the minimum insertion for your frame? Surely a 4" shim would be enough? And if it doesn't say to the contrary in the warranty... Poor service IMO.
By the way, I think we know each other McGowan... I'm in Donosti.
This was a couple of years ago so they may have changed. They lost a few customers so short sighted by Giant and Devinci will do the same.
I just took it on the chin because I didn't have the time to pursue and life is too short. I will not buy a Giant again and it gave me the excuse to move across to 29ers.
I think we know each other McGowan... I'm in Donosti.
Hi Bob!
Yes, we rode together ¿5? years ago
We wait you in Olarrain!
Pjm...
My good experience with Giant will predate your bad sadly. I've been out of the industry about 10 years now.
Based on your experience, I wouldn't buy Giant now either. The only weapon we have is to with-hold sales from the bad guys. Your experience is particularly bad, and I can't imagine that would hold up in legally - it's like warranting an iPhone on the cable! Ridiculous.
They lost a few customers so short sighted by Giant and Devinci will do the same.
they have lost already one customer as one of my friends was thinking about buy a Dixon...
McGowan, I'm in Olarrain quite a lot but on a road bike... But I want to get back on mtb a bit more. Are you doing the martxa from Benta Haundi this year?
Anyway, sorry to derail the thread 😉
But I want to get back on mtb a bit more. Are you doing the martxa from Benta Haundi this year?
of course, this year is the 25th anniversary of the "martxa", we can not fail 😀
Ok I'll check the date and try to get some other guys to come this time. It's a great route. Hopefully see you there (and good luck with the frame :wink:)
Hang on, side from anything else, they said that damage is [u]usually[/u] caused by not inserting enough seatpost. So they think that is what you did, but they want to see it still because they don't know...
Surely if they want to see it, that means they might change their minds, make some other offer or whatever. But it certainly isn't "NO WARRANTY!" as you put it.
It isn't clear cut, so send it back and let them give you an actual answer because at the moment it sounds like the only one stopping a warranty claim even getting started, is you.
If I buy a bike and fit my own headset does that void the warranty?
Kind of, if it's a Yeti. DIY is frowned upon. The Handbook clearly states that
[b]"This warranty is void if the bicycle was not assembled by an authorised Yeti dealer"[/b]
I'm sure other brands say something similar; who reads the small print?
You tried a bodge, your bike broke perhaps because of the bodge, you tried to claim and the bodge was noticed.
I'd be pissed off too but more with myself than the retailer/manufacturer.
The list of exceptions/conditions on that warranty means it's pretty much worthless.
I'd be tempted to go down the 'not fit for purpose' route which I think is based on EU regulations. You've got to send it back to them first though surely.
Hang on, side from anything else, they said that damage is usually caused by not inserting enough seatpost. So they think that is what you did, but they want to see it still because they don't know...
Surely if they want to see it, that means they might change their minds, make some other offer or whatever. But it certainly isn't "NO WARRANTY!" as you put it.It isn't clear cut, so send it back and let them give you an actual answer because at the moment it sounds like the only one stopping a warranty claim even getting started, is you.
I think that you are wrong
Before asking me anything they told me that I could send it back to the UK but saying that there were not too many possibilities. Before asking for photos or knowing what parts I have been using! After that it was clear for me that they had not too many wishes...
So think about it, send the frame to the UK and back again almost certainly without warranty accepted... for that it's better for me to accept the 350 pounds "offer"
Once I prove with photos that the cause was not Little insert of the seatpost (as they said firstly) now they say that the cause was the shim. Ok, does the Devinci's owner manual avoid the use of a shim like some other brands do? NO, NO and NO.
They are not asking me to send back the frame again to see it better... the only offer is to pay for another front part of the frame
"This warranty is void if the bicycle was not assembled by an authorised Yeti dealer"I'm sure other brands say something similar; who reads the small print?
i think that this is not compatible with selling frames by mail order like Freeborn. But of course, selling by mail order means more money for them...
You tried a bodge, your bike broke perhaps because of the bodge, you tried to claim and the bodge was noticed.
I'd be pissed off too but more with myself than the retailer/manufacturer.
Hardly a bodge - he didn't make his own shim as plenty of folk here advocate.
I think that's rubbish if it doesn't expressly exclude it in the warranty. Analogies about "it doesn't say don't ride it into a wall" fall flat because it will say that it doesn't cover crash damage.
Have you actually sent the frame back to them then? Have they actually rejected it, or is this just a note to say that's the usual cause?
I'm not quite clear from previous posts, did you tell them you were using a shim, and they didn't emotion anything about warranty?
grum - Member
I'd be tempted to go down the 'not fit for purpose' route which I think is based on EU regulations. You've got to send it back to them first though surely.
That wont get far:
"Did you use the correct size of components?"
"No"
"Next!"
I'm not quite clear from previous posts, did you tell them you were using a shim, and they didn't emotion anything about warranty?
Yes, I told them I was using a shim and that I have the invoice where they can see that it is a correct one (lenght and diameter) and not one made by me with a can.
I think that's rubbish if it doesn't expressly exclude it in the warranty.
Although the crashing into a wall analogy is a poor one the notion that warranties can't be exhaustive is correct.
So at the crux they asked you to send the frame in for warranty inspection and you declined. Instead you showed them photos and / or told them you had been using a shim and then they said no go and offered you a discount front for 25% of the full frame price and you feel hard done by?
That wont get far:
"Did you use the correct size of components?"
"No"
"Next!"
Yes, I told them I was using a shim and that I have the invoice where they can see that it is a correct one (lenght and diameter) and not one made by me with a can.
Dunno about legally but morally they are on very shaky ground IMO.
Although the crashing into a wall analogy is a poor one the notion that warranties can't be exhaustive is correct.
And fair in this instance? Considering plenty of people here have just said "my god man, of course it broke, by using a production shim that's been around for decades you virtually sawed through your own weld!"
Some odd opinions on here sometimes.
Dunno about legally but morally they are on very shaky ground IMO.
Business in shaky morals shocker.
So at the crux [b]they asked you to send the frame in for warranty inspection and you declined[/b]. Instead you showed them photos and told them you had been using a shim and then they said no go and offered you a discount front for 25% of the full frame price and you feel hard done by?
That's not true.
They asked me to send frame without knowing almost nothing about the problem and saying that there were Little possibilities.
So before do that I explained them with photos all the problem. After do that they have not asked again to send back the frame.
I think that the normal process in this cases is to send all the information with photos before send back the frame.
And fair in this instance? Considering plenty of people here have just said "my god man, of course it broke, by using a production shim that's been around for decades you virtually sawed through your own weld!"
Fair is a movable feast as this thread proves.
You're now guilty yourself of using an analogy so exaggerated as to lose any meaning.
Do you actually think warranties could be exhaustive?
When I worked in a Giant dealer around 70% of Giants came with a shim from new, and a sticker on the seat tube letting you know this. Evil hardtails were the same.
If you had brought that frame in to me to be warrantied and the manufacturer said "no, you used a shim" I'd be phenomenally embarrassed to have to tell you that you weren't getting a new front end. I had a Giant crack there (no shim, way below minimum insertion) and they warrantied it based solely on photos. I even got to keep the rear shock off my old frame to do with as I pleased.
A shim is not a bodge, it is a widely available part and I think Gravity Dropper even usually supply them with their posts to fit whatever frame you have.
You probably should send it back to them if they want you to, but if they still say no warranty then I'd be taking it down the legal route.
Does this same rule apply to people using step down headsets to take 1 1/8" steerers in 1.5" headset cups? Or using the plastic spacers on a hollowtech 2 BB to make it fit a 68mm BB shell (since that's [i]clearly[/i] a part that doesn't fit the frame), or a BB30 to HT2 reducer? Absolutely crackers.
And I believe that if you were on here about 5 years ago or more that there were almost monthly threads about shocking service from Freeborn regarding Ellsworths, so I'm not surprised to see this if I'm honest.
Do you actually think warranties could be exhaustive?
Speaking about shims? of course, as it is a part that is very extended in bike's world.
And some SERIOUS brands do that, like Scott:
"Never use another seatpost diameter than 31.6mm or try to use a shim/
reducer between seatpost and frame."
I think that the normal process in this cases is to send all the information with photos before send back the frame.
Yup. And they've clearly seen enough to satisfy them that user error was the cause or at least a contributing factor and therefore not a warranty issue. Whether this is actually the case we'll never know.
Does this same rule apply to people using step down headsets to take 1 1/8" steerers in 1.5" headset cups? Or using the plastic spacers on a hollowtech 2 BB to make it fit a 68mm BB shell (since that's clearly a part that doesn't fit the frame), or a BB30 to HT2 reducer? Absolutely crackers.
➡
You're now guilty yourself of using an analogy so exaggerated as to lose any meaning.
Do you actually think warranties could be exhaustive?
I didn't use an analogy at all, I (mildly) exaggerated what a number of people on this thread have said, which to paraphrase is that of course the OP's frame broke that was guaranteed with a shim, which I think is bollocks, and if folk genuinely think that it seems pretty off it isn't explicit.
If its something very rare then fair enough, but that is not the opinion of many here.
If the headset was to damage the frame - probably
Plastic spacers are an adjustment and part of the BB design - N/A
If the reducer was to damage the frame - probably
Yup. And they've clearly seen enough to satisfy them that [b]user error[/b] was the cause or at least a contributing factor and therefore not a warranty issue. Whether this is actually the case we'll never know.
Sorry? I have not broken any rule of the owner's guide of devinci
Are you saying that, for example, Gravity Dropper is selling unsafe products? Why do not anybody denounce them?
If its something very rare then fair enough, but that is not the opinion of many here.
I'm with njee on that- if it were a part that depended on something very unusual to make it fit (and I'm struggling to think of any, maybe a 25.4mm handlebar shimmed up to 31.8mm where the shim is tiny and stressed at both ends) I'd not be surprised but voiding a warranty because of a part as common as a seatpost shim is daft.
mcgowan, please stop! As has been said already, the list of warranty exclusions is not exhaustive.
Gravity Droppers product doesn't even figure here, it is designed to fit in a 27.2 seat tube, you chose to attempt to run it in a 31.6
I'm not saying you made an error, that's a moot point. I'm saying that they are clearly satisfied that you did which is why they've taken it no further.
[b]That wont get far:
"Did you use the correct size of components?"
"No"
"Next!"[/b]
"Does this same rule apply to people using step down headsets to take 1 1/8" steerers in 1.5" headset cups?"
[b]If the headset was to damage the frame - probably[/b]
Hi Legend
Do you know that Freeborn sold me an adapter (tapered to 1 1/8) with the frame as I told them that I had a 1 1/8 fork?
Gravity Droppers product doesn't even figure here, it is designed to fit in a 27.2 seat tube, you chose to attempt to run it in a 31.6
you are not very serious
checkout this, the oficial web:
http://gravitydropper.com/gravitydropper-classic/
Seatpost size... only for 27'2???? they give you the shim without paying more!!!
Couldn't care less about the headset, your headtube hasn't cracked and if it did you'd be straight back to the shop that supplied you the frame and headset making it their problem.
GD don't know the spec/limitations of every frame that the post will be fitted to, it has nothing to do with GD
Couldn't care less about the headset, your headtube hasn't cracked and if it did you'd be straight back to the shop that supplied you the frame and headset making it their problem.
but tell me... did I use the correct size of components following the advices of Freeborn as they sold me the adapter for the fork???