That modification would only work on a dual air fork - on solo air the ratio between the +/- chambers is dictated by the position of the dimple inside the stanchion; the only way to increase the negative is with a hollow hat-shaped piston, like the Luftkappe.
Serviced Lyriks back from TFT. One of the comments was Modified the luftkappe to reduce stickiness.
Anyone know what this modification would be?
Servicing a mates forks last night and pulling the air shaft out revealed the following modification done by a suspension tuning company, simple, but only gaining a little extra negative volume.
I did a similar mod to a Revelation to lower it for use on a jump bike recently which resulted in the piston not passing the dimple as intended and a rock hard beginning stroke due to a lack of pressure in the negative air chamber. Not ideal.
Just checking why folk at using the Loctite 272 rather than the 271 mentioned in their install video?
I've just received my kit. Was going to fit it this weekend till I saw in the video about using this type of thread locker.
I used nail polish does the same job.
Wow! The bolt on my air shaft had so much loctite on it that it was all down the threads of the air shaft and had run most of the way down the inside too.
4 cups of boiling water and one set of mole grips later and it's finally out but wrecked.
The bolt came out of my spare air shaft dead easy after 5 min's in water.
How annoying.
dingus - Member
Servicing a mates forks last night and pulling the air shaft out revealed the following modification done by a suspension tuning company, simple, but only gaining a little extra negative volume.
I did a similar mod to a Revelation to lower it for use on a jump bike recently which resulted in the piston not passing the dimple as intended and a rock hard beginning stroke due to a lack of pressure in the negative air chamber. Not ideal.
I checked the number of O-rings and it came out exactly the same as the conical rubber spacer. Forks feel fine and no reports of any issues with them.
I tried spacing down a set of dual position revs, in the end I chucked the air assembly away and fitted a u-turn coil spring.
I've just orderd one of these to - I'm really happy with my pikes (they are GREAT forks!) but I'ma serial fettler (snarf snarf) so though I'd have a play to see what difference it makes...
Having more sensitive small bump response with less dive and more mid stroke will make the forks incredible!
Plus, it'll be a chance to take something apart!
I'm under 70kg (slimming up for summer!) so I think it'll help me on that front...
It's on a HT, so all this may be superfluous ot the fact I've no rear bounce, but hey ho!!
DrP
I have one coming too, even though I quite like the way my pikes work on the Bronson, I'm keen to see what difference the LK makes...
Got one on the way for my Yari's too.
I figured that for £60 I'd pop it in whilst I'm reducing the travel. On paper it should get air forks closer to how I want them, with a nice soft initial stroke for the chatter etc. So far all of the forks I've had have been a compromise between suppleness and not blowing through the travel.
The funny thing is, the Pikes really do seem great at the mo - they DO move well over the chattery stuff, so I'll see how the respond to the lufthansa in terms of mid stroke..
Really, I just wanted to try it..hope I don't mess up teh install!!
DrP
I'll see how the respond to the lufthansa in terms of mid stroke
I reckon you'll be flying mate.
Saw a review on PB, will probably give it a try myself when it's service time for my Pike & Lyrik...
Being able to take the tokens out made a real difference for me, reduced arm pump to nothing.
[quote=Bagstard ]Being able to take the tokens out made a real difference for me, reduced arm pump to nothing.
Agreed.
I got mine fitted at TF recently. Bizarrely I sent it to them with 2 tokens fitted. They sent it back with the Luftkappe plus 3 tokens!
Felt awful. Really bad arm pump which I never get. Switched it to 1 token with the pressure set for 30% sag. Feels fantastic. Such a difference.
Had it in for one ride now. Installed it at same time as increasing travel to 160mm and It's pretty much what I wanted.
Pikes always seem to stay well into travel when pointing down so I was running 3 tokens and way more pressure than I should. But this ruined the sensitivity and my arms would be feeling it by the end of the run.
The Luftkappe seems to increase support so less diving and increase sensitivity. So doing what it says but was hoping for slightly more support. Worth the money.
Fitted my Luftkappe and 140mm airshaft to my Yari's this week.
Still trying to figure the set up out; TF recomended two tokens plus more air, but the ramp up was nuts and the forks felft awful. Took out one token and started with 105psi but even like this the ramp up was quite severe so I gradually reduced the pressure whilst riding last nigh to 90psi. This gives 26% sag.
At the moment the set up goes against the general advice of more pressure.
I think I'm going to go for a higher pressure and no tokens on Sunday to see how that feels.
The breakaway is nice and soft though and they forks don't bottom out like my 350's did (they were always too much of a balancing act between sensitivity and resistance to bottoming out even with 15ml extra oil in the air chamber).
no tokens and 65psi in my Lyriks
Apparently the damper in the Yari causes a lot more spring ramp up than the one in the Pike and Lyrik.
No tokens and plent air pressure for me.
Apparently the damper in the Yari causes a lot more spring ramp up than the one in the Pike and Lyrik.
Possibly - mine ramped up like mofo's with two tokens in. Probably great if you're a proper sender.There's a strong ramp up with just a single token.
Has anyone cut down a token? Just wondering if it's possible in case one is too much and none is too linear.
Just got mine through and looking forward to getting it fitted over the weekend.
minmap3 - are you adding air gradually and cycling the fork as per the [url=
VORSPRUNGSUSPENSION.COM Yup adding air bit my bit and cycling the forks - you can hear the two chambers equalising when you do.
Maybe out scales are out of whack and I'm not as far as they say I am?
Has anyone cut down a token? Just wondering if it's possible in case one is too much and none is too linear.
Or buy the Rampcart
Can you fit a ramp cartridge with a luftkappe?? Didn't think you could in some cases?
Can you fit a ramp cartridge with a luftkappe?? Didn't think you could in some cases?
It depends on the travel - I could at 140mm but thought I'd give the Luftkappe a whirl first as its half the price.
At 95kg I am running 100psi in a 160mm Yari with no tokens and it feels great. I would experiment with a little more air before reaching for tokens.
Debating if to get this upgrade on my 160 Yari as it's so cheap. To be fair being 15 stone, plenty of support in a stock Yari for me with two tokens. They also are pretty plush on slow trail stuff and I don't need to run more than 1 click of LSC. Hoping the upgrade will make things a little plusher on small to medium hits (general fast trail chatter).
Anyone else's fork making more rebound whoosh noise ?
They also seem to be sucked down 10mm into the travel.
Not sure it's made a massive difference to my 160mm Lyriks as they were good before I had it fitted.
60psi and 3 tokens before
75psi and 1 token after
Still trying to get the setup right tho
Possibly grease blocking wee transfer port? Common with pikes, not sure about lyriks though.
Mine suck down about 9mm too, but I have included the lost 9mm when setting sag and they ride really well. Since they ride higher in the travel now it ia a non issue, not noticed any noise though.
Finally got around to fitting mine at the weekend. Simple 20 minute job. Was running 65psi and one token before with zero tokens after. However I've had to stay at 65psi to keep the sag at 30%.
I've still got the full 140mm travel - although there's not much spare stanchion when they bottom out. Adding the air bit by bit and pushing down slightly to allow the chambers to balance seems to ensure any travel loss in minimised.
Rode mine again yesterday - no tokens, 100psi and two clicks of LSC and they felt really good. This gives me 21/22% of sag. I found I was using more of the travel yesterday but not quite bottoming out.
Given my general dislike of Rock Shox forks, I've been impressed with the Yari's and Luftkappe so far.
Did the old cable tie down the seals trick on both sides and got my missing travel back.
So I've Luftkappe'd both my bikes and it did take a while to hone in on the best set-up for me but I'm always quite fussy about fork set-up. Both bikes have Pikes. On the hardtail I was running 140mm with 2 tokens and 15-20% sag. On the full-sus 150mm with 1 token and 15-20% sag. I've previously had the hardtail at 130mm with 3 tokens and the full-sus at 160mm with 0, 1 & 2 tokens and sag everywhere from 10-30%.
As recommended I started out with slightly higher pressures post-Luftkappe and thus similar sag. I removed both tokens from the hardtail and left the full-sis with none. Felt pretty good on the hardtail but once I got the full-sus onto some rocky trails they were too harsh and I had about 40mm of travel left after some fast rough descents.
Since then I've gradually lowered the pressures on both and taken the forks out another 10mm in travel, so 150 on the Zero AM and 160 on the Spitfire. I'm now running about 25% sag on both forks - they feel very plush initially but nice and firm in the midstroke - normally with a Pike you can't have both, either being plush but soft or firm but harsh. I'm only getting full travel when hucking the hardtail or screwing up on the full-sus but I'm getting to use most of the travel frequently, which feels like a good balance. The 10mm of extra travel cancels out the extra 5-10% of sag to keep the sagged geometry about the same (the geometry when riding hard is probably slacker due to the extra midstroke support).
Definitely worth adding a Luftkappe when doing a service, especially if you already have 2+ tokens in (easier to find your set-up if you're already used to that much progression on the spring). If you're less of a shredder or like your fork more linear feeling then you may need to run more sag to get a good feel.
Fitted a Luftkappe tonight, as well as taking the fork from 150 up to 160mm with a new air shaft. Test it out tomorrow on a nice big lumpy day, and report back.
How is everyone getting on with these compared to without them? Got one on back order for my 150mm 27.5 Pike.
I've had 3 rides on it now, though tbf the first one I mentioned in my previous post wasn't much of a ride, was more walking my bike along unrideable ridges for a day, in the rain and howling wind..
Anyhow, Noticeably better in the initial first maybe 20mm of travel, best described as having lost it's kinda stiction type feel. In terms of support, aye, defo seemed better, but it was really most noticeable when I took my other bike out last night, which also has a pike fitted, sans Luftkappe.
The lack of support and dive was far more apparent than I've ever noticed before.
I've a bit of fettling to do with the Pike that has the Luft fitted, as I also fitted a 160mm airshaft in there as well at the same time. I may reduce the air a little.
I been running mine for a few months now,had it fitted by TF during a service also upped the the travel to 160mm at the same time, I ran the higher pressure recommended by TF for quite a while , approx 95 PSI no tokens (I was running 85psi, no tokens), although felt great at times when things got really rough you could really feel it,dropped it back 5 psi until I was in my happy place again, Ive now settled back to around 85psi again but running a lot less LSC but still feel pretty supportive despite dropping the pressure.Still a worthy upgrade imo 🙂
With the stock pike my bike felt unbalanced with the coil shock. Afterfitting the luftkappe it was more balanced. However, I still found the pike overly damped in high speed hits. I replaced the pike with a mattoc pro with an IRT and it's much better that the stock pike and better than the pike with luftkappe.
[url=
I've don an 'ickle blog of the fitting process..[/url]
..if you're interested!
Not ridden it yet as last night the wife was out, and kids in bed, so it was "red wine and fettle night" for DrP!!!
DrP
I just installed one of these into my 160mm Pike on my Capra,took the bike out for a quick 'urban' style test and really like what I'm feeling so far. Definately softer and easier to get moving into travel over smaller bumps and what I really like is now being able to run more pressure the end front of the bike is much easier to energize off the now more responsive and supportive feeling mid stroke and pop up for bunny hops etc etc .
I've gone from around 170psi with 2 tokens to 180 psi with none achieving around 25% sag.
Early days but I'm really impressed so far.
Do you mean 70 and 80psi?? 180 sounds an awful lot for a fork!!
180? Really?
Yeah good spot guys,bathing in my freshly aquired Luftkappe enthused RADness I did indeed add an extra digit -that digit is '1' before you ask 🙂
Went of r aride last night on my newly lufwaffere'd forks...
Really good..very supple in the first few cm of travel, but feel firmer mid stroke.
I normally lock (or at least mid click ) the RCT3 dial when climbing - didn't feel I needed to.
Plus in the singletrack and over jumps the forks just felt 'better' - hard to explain, but lovely!
Well worth it!
DrP
