[Closed] The price of gear cables these days...

Sounds about right, stainless gear inner £3, SP41 outer £4 a metre.

Was just about to suggest you go to wilkinsons !

I got a shock when I got some brake and gear cables from the LBS a few weeks back and they were about £6 each.

I'd be interested to see how you get on with the Wilko's ones though. I imagine they would stretch lots and rust probably.

I bought a box of 50 Jagwire inners on ebay for about £25 about a year ago and a pack of 100 ferrules for about £5 and 15m of outer cable for about £10. That's me sorted for the next decade.

I've been to several LBS in South Manchester and been told "That'll be expensive!" when I've asked for 3m of outer cable. Well it is if you charge £5 a metre for it! From the various reactions they don't sell very much of it, it just gets added to the bill when asked to "Sort my gears please". Ken Fosters in Chorlton I even had to explain that I wanted it to run full length cable, then explain why I wanted to do it as whoever was completely baffled by the concept.

(It's to keep the Peak District out and to stop the cables getting water in and freezing in the winter. Yes, I know there's a tiny bit more friction, but there's a lot less after a couple of months when the various bits are full of grit and rust and my full length is still nicely sealed at both ends!)

Yes, I know there's a tiny bit more friction...

There's less friction in a single outer. Friction in a separated system comes from the cable ferrules/cable stops, and that's even before they get a build-up of crud in them.

I'm putting off a build because of the price of cables...

Cool, good point Three Fish, I knew I was doing the right thing.

So why do bikes not come with a single length of cable? I'm struggling to see a disadvantage that isn't the extra few grams?

It's because it's so expensive!

"So why do bikes not come with a single length of cable? I'm struggling to see a disadvantage that isn't the extra few grams?"

Would look ugly, need more brazings or zip ties all over the bike to hold them in place.

To be honest I found the best solution to be normal lengths of outer with grease nipples half way along the run so you can squirt GT85 etc in and clean them out.

Online prices - £2 for decent gear inner and 3 metres of outer about £2 / metre - so £6 + £4 + maybe 25p each for ferrules = £12-£14

Wilkinsons - did you see if they were stainless decent pre-stretched cables and stainless or decent plastic ferrules and good outer were they - SP41/42?

Not much of a grumble I think 😉

reason 161 why singlespeed is better.

It doesn't need anymore fixing, you just have outer cable in the bits where normally you'd just have inner. 4 cable ties to the back of my Bullit. Converting doesn't require cable ties at all though, you just drill out the cable guides and use them as they are. I've never had to replace a full-length cable because of water or crud getting in.

Aesthetics could be a down side, but it's not significant, and i speak as a chap that rates aesthetics.

To be honest I found the best solution to be normal lengths of outer with grease nipples half way along the run so you can squirt GT85 etc in and clean them out.

Is that meant to be ironic?

sorry, i asked for 3 feet.....

i am sure the wilkinsons stuff will be fine, looks like any other!

i could have brought a whole gear changer for £15 and got the wire for free!

Sorry to disagree but outer and cable and ferrules are not made the same - buy cheap buy twice IME 🙂

I bought 30 jagwire cables and ferrules from a guy off here for £20. He'll no doubt be along shortly.

Sorry to disagree but outer and cable and ferrules are not made the same - buy cheap buy twice IME

If that's the price compared to what I paid I can pay 4x before I need to worry.

MY LBS just quoted me £27 quid for 3 meters without inners. Yeah but it's Shimano he said. Looks like I'll be resuing the ones off the last frame if I can.
However if I can't these look like good value.

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=46053

I buy them when cheap from online places, but buy decent stuff. Fibrax cable inners from CRC were £1.50 I think & get shimano outer from JE James in Sheff (pretty much the only thing I get from there) and it's about £3 a metre last time I went in.

There's defo a difference in durability of cheap stuff against say shimano outer & end caps.

"Is that meant to be ironic?"

No its not enlighten me.

Shimano SP41's £2.25/m at [url= http://www.parker-international.co.uk/5084/Shimano-SP41-Outer-Casing-4-mm-x-10-m.html ]Parker[/url]

Yes, I know there's a tiny bit more friction...

There's less friction in a single outer. Friction in a separated system comes from the cable ferrules/cable stops, and that's even before they get a build-up of crud in them.

I disagree but am in no position to prove it. From experience full outer never works as well and when it does start to get dirt in which it will from the rear mech end it's worse and you don't want to do anything about it as it cost more and should be better. YVMV

Shimano cable and sealed ferrules and a no brand outer although I'm going to try and source shimano outer in a big roll next time also. All bought in bulk.

Typically getting 400 miles of all weather riding out of them but that's been due to a few damaged mechs and hangers, shifter changes in the last couple of years. I'd probably get double that with no issues. I tend to put new on every spring once winter has buggered off.

I disagree but am in no position to prove it. From experience full outer never works as well and when it does start to get dirt in which it will from the rear mech end it's worse and you don't want to do anything about it as it cost more and should be better.

One word

Blackburncableoilers

Sorted!
😉

Typically getting 400 miles of all weather riding out of them

Christ! Is that all? I'm getting 2-3 years out of my outers, with usually one change of inner cable in that time, so 2-3000 miles

That's Shimano SP41 bought in bulk (circa £25/10m) and 99p inners from CRC

I use decent stainless inners, SP41/42 and XTR ferrules and rubber covers and replace them about every year - £20 / year is not a lot 🙂

Just buy a set of Gore Ride-On cables. Expensive at £30-ish a pop online. But you'll never ever worry about cables ever again. They're still as silky smooth as the day they were fitted, after 18 months of muddy abuse. Its that simple

I use decent stainless inners, SP41/42 and XTR ferrules and rubber covers and replace them about every year - £20 / year is not a lot

I use cheap of chips cables and outers and they last for about 2 years, £5 per year is not a lot.

branded cable kits are hella expensive but my lbs has a huge roll of jagwire outer thats no more than a couple of quid a metre 😕

Typically getting 400 miles of all weather riding out of them

Christ! Is that all? I'm getting 2-3 years out of my outers, with usually one change of inner cable in that time, so 2-3000 miles

That's Shimano SP41 bought in bulk (circa £25/10m) and 99p inners from CRC

Sigh! You didn't read the qualifications then regarding broken mechs and shifter changes obviously.

I'd tend to do 12 months on a set of cables and bin them in the spring which is anything from 500-800 miles for me on the geared bike.

Cable oilers - No thanks.

PP don't you mean [b]MIDDLE[/b]burn cable oilers?

Oh and cable oilers are bloody excellent, spray can of your chosen lube and most of the crud gets pushed out by fresh lube. Works a treat.

I just stick XTR cables on, never had a set that didn't last as long as the bike. Which OK isn't always very long

binners - Member

Just buy a set of Gore Ride-On cables. Expensive at £30-ish a pop online. But you'll never ever worry about cables ever again. They're still as silky smooth as the day they were fitted, after 18 months of muddy abuse. Its that simple

Well said that man. Bit of a faff to do, but with the price of cables you're talking about, not THAT much more expensive, and keep the crap out for years!

I just picked up 10m of SP41 on eBay for £17:00. Which was nice 🙂
I run full outers on all the bikes in the family nowadays. Cheaper in the long run I think.

foxyrider - Member

I use decent stainless inners, SP41/42 and XTR ferrules and rubber covers and replace them about every year - £20 / year is not a lot

I do the same, always xtr inners as well. Never have a single problem with shifting. Preventative maintenance init!

Yep I did a bulk buy before and as mcmoonter said, it was around 7.50 for ten inners and crimps posted.

Its a pain packaging 200 cables though!

May be able to do it again if there was intrest- i've got enough for personal use I reckon!

PP don't you mean MIDDLEburn cable oilers?

Cable oilers - No thanks.

got a full set of clarks front and rear cables, outers, ferrules for £8 from evans

I've been to several LBS in South Manchester and been told "That'll be expensive!" when I've asked for 3m of outer cable. Well it is if you charge £5 a metre for it! From the various reactions they don't sell very much of it, it just gets added to the bill when asked to "Sort my gears please". Ken Fosters in Chorlton I even had to explain that I wanted it to run full length cable, then explain why I wanted to do it as whoever was completely baffled by the concept.

It would have cost you £5.97 down the road in Altrincham at Bikeshak.

I am fed up with cable outers splitting from cheap to XTR so I will only buy the braided stuff from now on..

At my traditional, no bike over £500, "what's disc brakes?", non of that fancy nonsense LBS they have gear inner a £2.49 (Clarks I think) and outer by the metre @£2 pm.

Clas Ohlson have Shimano sets, £5.49

[url= http://www.clasohlson.co.uk/Product/Product.aspx?id=158149104 ]Linky[/url]

all my bikes have wilkinsons cable, maintain as you would normal "expensive" cables and they last the same amount of time

sometimes cheap as chips is good

[i] Cable oilers - No thanks.

Why ever not? Give me one good reason why they are a bad idea!
Go on!!
It sounds like you're being deliberately obtuse about this to me! [/i]

They go on full outers yeah. I don't want full outers as they don't work as well. Plus I'd then need to ziptie cables on my frame. I once got a custom built to use full outers and when it was resprayed I got all the cable guides ground off and stops put on as it didn't work as well.

Good enough?

Does anyone know if the Goodridge sets fit Shimano ROAD STI levers? I have them on the mountain bikes but am unsure if they fit the road levers? Cheers... Might just go for some Clarks inners and a few metres of the SP41 though...

I don't want full outers as they don't work as well.

You don't think that something else might have been the cause? Every one of the eight bikes we've had for the last four years has used single-length outers and we haven't had any shifting issues. That's on hardtails, short-travel and long travel suspension frames. Apart from requiring more housing and the possibility of frame mods/fettling, a single length has absolutely no disadvantages.

Does anyone know if the Goodridge sets fit Shimano ROAD STI levers?

There's nothing unusual about Goodridge fittings. Are Shimano road barrels different to MTB barrels?

I don't know, Three_Fish - they just appear to have fatter cable outers than the road ones that are on there? Might be my eyes... 🙂

The outers are big, around 5mm, but the fittings step down to fit shifter/derailleur barrels. This is the clearest image I have to hand:

[img] [/img]

Cool - so even they should fit the road STI ones ok then by the looks of it? I'm sure I have some of the stepped ferrules somewhere. Now I know why they exist!

Weird, kenfosters fitted full length outers on my new build without even asking 🙄

We where at Inners on Sunday and my mate broke his rear mech the LBS(not Alpine bikes) charged him £50 for the mech then another £20 to fit it not bad for 15 mins work

All that and expensive burgers too. Something about fools and money comes to mind...

[i] I don't want full outers as they don't work as well.

You don't think that something else might have been the cause? Every one of the eight bikes we've had for the last four years has used single-length outers and we haven't had any shifting issues. That's on hardtails, short-travel and long travel suspension frames. Apart from requiring more housing and the possibility of frame mods/fettling, a single length has absolutely no disadvantages. [/i]

I never said they don't work. They clearly do let the gears operate correctly but not as well as split outers. I also added YVMV way up there as we live in different parts of the country with different soil types. There are very few people locally I know who run full outers. Those that do tend to be because the frame forces them too. I base my use of them on my experience, split outers are better when used with shimano sealed ferrules where I live. My opinion might be different if I lived in the Peak district.
Is that ok?

8 bikes in 4 years. How much use have they had in bad conditions?

Tom, that just doesn't appear logical to me. If there's a break in the outer, there's going to be friction if it's to be sealed properly - that's unavoidable. I know you didn't say that it doesn't work, I clearly responded with a response to your assertion that single outers don't work [u]as well[/u] as interrupted.

With all else being equal - fittings/ferrules, shifters, derailleur, routing bends - there's no reason why a single-outer system should perform worse than an interrupted one. The reduced friction from less ferrules/seals should leave the single-outer system feeling easier to operate. If it doesn't, then something somewhere is wrong.

I'll take my hardtail as an example. I use my Orange as my daily transport; so it's work, shops, etc., whatever the weather, on roads/pavement and almost always through the muddy paths of city park I need to pass through - then it gets a different set of tyres and does trails. Off-season it gets the occasional weekend, but the rest of the year it's out two to four times a week. It's had the same gear cables since summer 2008: Alligator braided outer with a decent stainless inner. The outer has been scuffed and nicked in several places, which brings up another question of overall durability. The cables were removed recently and replaced with a Goodridge outer and Gore inner which had been on my SX Trail for about eighteen months. The reason for replacement was because the SX is sold and the cable set is the better of the two. The inner cable I removed from the Orange's original set is perfectly usable and will go on the hook with other spares.

There was no dirt in the outer cable I removed. Nothing. I favour a dry system, so no grease like the SP41, and nothing to thicken or degrade. It's never had any lubrication put through it. Pulling the the ball-end of the inner, it moves with only the smallest amount of friction.

I honestly don't care what kind of dirt/soil/gravel/whatever anyone rides in. There is simply no argument that a spilt system, no matter what sealing it uses, will keep more crap out than a system that doesn't have any spilts. That's just common sense Shirley. It might be a faff-on to attach it to the frame, but that's a different discussion and a matter of opinion.

There is simply no argument that a spilt system, no matter what sealing it uses, will keep more crap out than a system that doesn't have any spilts

Why who's arguing that?

[i]With all else being equal - fittings/ferrules, shifters, derailleur, routing bends - there's no reason why a single-outer system should perform worse than an interrupted one. The reduced friction from less ferrules/seals should leave the single-outer system feeling easier to operate. If it doesn't, then something somewhere is wrong. [/i]

As I said I cannot give you proof one way is better than the other.
If shifting was truly better with full outer though would Shimano not be pushing it that way?

You prefer full outer and find it works for you. Brilliant.
IME it doesn't offer a cost effective solution for ME.

YVMV (Your value may vary)

They go on full outers yeah. I don't want full outers as they don't work as well. Plus I'd then need to ziptie cables on my frame. I once got a custom built to use full outers and when it was resprayed I got all the cable guides ground off and stops put on as it didn't work as well.
Good enough?

No. You've not stated one single reason not to use cable oilers! 🙂
Well done for evading the question and still being right though..... 😉

And I fail to see your problem with full outers. I don't think you ride in the wet often enough TBH 🙂
Where do you ride BTW?

If shifting was truly better with full outer though would Shimano not be pushing it that way?

Apparently not.

Take a look at absolute cycles on ebay for the XTR kit. £20 delivered which is the cost of 2 XTR inners these days (recently went from £6 to £10 at CRC) + you get the nicer shielded end caps.

I was going to drill my frame and go full length buying some off Parker (£20 for 10m) but i opted to use the XTR kit with a £3 full sealing kit from wiggle to replace all but the front mech exit XTR one with nice sealed tubing which works with conventional end stops.

just an update to keep on topic;
cables are all good; i use a split system, for old times sake; the frame is 15 year old after all. its ridden 6 days a week, work; long mid week ride and epic on a sunday.

so; feel great, especially as i sucked oil through the outers before installing. its nice to have some kind of shifting after a winter of mud and stuff. finally i have loads to keep in the rucksack, in the bike box and some pressies for the guys on sunday!