[Closed] T-Mo punctures at CyB G-Enduro

maybe she was running tubeless.

your experiences sound f all like the ones i've had with tubeless over the last few years.

I run tubeless & have had two punctures on rocks in the last month that wouldn't seal even though there was plenty of gunk in there.Didn't tear the tyre just put a small slit in it each time & sealent sprayed everywhere !
IME - tubeless is great in the fight against thorns & pinch flats,but just as bad,or maybe even a little worse when you catch a sharp piece of slate or rock

or go round a sharp bend without enough air in...

or go round a sharp bend without enough air in...

LOL,yeah done that twice this year as well......

i should caveat that i've never actually tried them. ALL of the issues i have had is riding with friends who are ambling along telling me how i should give it a go, and how wonderful it all is...

before they inevitably blow the tyre off rim, gradually lose air-pump up-lose air all day long, burp the crap out of 30psi tyres on tight corners, that kinda thing.

seem absolute dog shit to me, really, really don't get it.

+1 to the above, reasonable chance she was running tubeless, doesn't avoid punctures altogether, although yes it does significantly reduce their frequency IME.

ime experience, (same as tracknicko) have had several mates tubeless puncture on rides particularly when hitting rocky stuff fast...
a tear in a sidewall is gonna knacker any tyre, im willing to bet tracey was pushing hard too!

what Nick said,

and i've tried it, and it's crap.

Tubeless is no panacea, had rips which won't seal, tyres fold off the rim after a burb looses too much pressure. Still better than tubes though on rocks.....

You need UST tyres on proper tubeless rims to avoid most, if not all of the above issues. UST Nobby Nics on Flows is a hard to beat system at low pressures for ease of setup and handling.

I slashed one of my tubeless tyres with flint. Couldn't seal but the tube was fine so I have one tyre tubeless, one with a tube.

+1 Trailrider Jim, run the proper stuff not Ghetto bodges and you won't get half the issues.
This is based on riding round Wales too and with riders going quicker and harder than me too.

The chap I ended riding the latter part of the event with had three punctures... the first being when he was running tubeless!
That being said... I was tubeless and didn't have any probs (apart from ripping off my rear mech in seeding!)

No if you hit a sharp rock/slate at speed then they can puncture,my UST's on Stans are proof of that...Around Cannock & the like they're great,but pointy stuff is another story.UST's are too heavy as well...

Just ridden up at Glencoe all weekend with thin tubes, and single-ply 2.35" tyres... not one puncture... saw many 'tubeless' riders coming down the chairlift with blown rear tyres...

yeh but then i have had 'proper' ust tyres in my hands in the past... and they are PROPER heavy. like car tyre heavy.

so where's the benefit?

cheers for the support tho chaps. normally i say things like this and get shot down in flames!

i just don't think you can beat tubes currently. puncture. new tube, carry on. what could be easier?

Nicko, ride tubeless, puncture less, if I do something really silly and do puncture replace with tube and carry on 😀 😉

My tubeless wheels and tyres 819 XM and Fat alberts are lighter than the previous tubes Maxxis mavic rim combo.

I'd rather have a fairly heavy duty fuss free setup and not climb quite to quickly, not racing uphill anyway.

Also, being able to swap tyres quickly depending on the conditions must be a big benefit - same reason most WC downhillers aren't on tubeless yet.

WC Downhillers have several sets of wheels with different tyres on them

I swap tyres for conditions, just have about 8 sets of tyres I know will go straight up with a track pump. No fuss.

exactly. no fuss.

what is all the fuss about? the 'no puncture' thing clearly aint true. neither is the 'less weight' bit.

so why tubeless? just cos its a bit showy?

Of course they'll puncture,
you're not going to pinch flat at lower pressures, have only burped the tyres at silly low pressures (20 to 25psi) which is too low.
I prefer the feel of the them and get more grip too, this is down to the lower pressure thing which I couldn't do if I was running tubes, I used to run freeride in tubes and dual ply tryes but still punctured too often, since going tubeless no punctures at all.

Why would Ms Moseley be running tubeless if they were worse than tubes as well? going back to the OP

seem to contradict yourself ref pressures there a bit.

the one's i've seen burping needed to be pumped ROCK hard to stop them doing it once they had started.

faff!

I don't know what you lot are doing to get so much punctures but I have had all of one in the past 2 years and that was a pinch coming down the first dh section on the MBR. I didn't even get one the next day coming down Snowdon (rangers and telegraph) I was running my usual 30psi and my usual tubes. I don't do anything special and I don't have any special tyres. I'm 15st so no lightweight and whilst not Steve Peat I'm no slouch coming down.

So either you lot are super rad core or I ride light and/or possibly sick to the power of gnar. I'm pretty sure I don't ride light as I just bash through things and I'm certainly not sick to the power of gnar. I'm not sure what's going on really so I will just bow down to your superior puncture getting.

Loco is on the money - Tubeless you can run @ lower pressures but here is as I see it (talking generally).

Std rims with kit + Std tyres = harder to inflate and may burp at lower pressures and side walls may not be strong enough to prevent tears.

Tubeless ready rims and tyres = easier to inflate, sl thicker side walls and valve and tape needed but unlikely to burp or rip.

Tubeless rims + tubeless tyres - much easier to get up, burp rarely, bit heavier d.t. the thicker side walls but don't need sealing.

All benefit from milk inside the tyre 🙂

what is all the fuss about? the 'no puncture' thing clearly aint true. neither is the 'less weight' bit.

I've never had a thorn puncture that's not sealed instantly, just ripped tyres a few times, so tubes wouldn't have helped.

I use standard Schwalbe tyres, with roughly 50g of sealant, so yes I could use the most insanely thin tubes for a similar weight, but then they'd definitely puncture more, so yes there's a weight saving. I also run 20-25psi as standard, and have never burped a tyre. Realise the experience isn't the same for everyone.

so why tubeless? just cos its a bit showy?

Hardly showy, you can't even tell if someone's using tubeless!

that's what makes it extra showy 😉

ah well. not for me.

20 psi is too low that's based on the bike being grabbed for a quick spin and them having lost a bit of pressure hence being too low and a burp occuring 😀

25 plus does cause any issues, just to put this in context one of the team guys told me I ride like a 12 year old 😆

Pre-tubeless I actually managed to pinchflat 3 times in a single descent of Garburn.
Since going tubeless I haven't suffered anything like the same failure rate but no they are not infalable, just a lot, lot better IMHO.

On the rare occasions that I've split a tyre beyong the healing capabilities of Stans fluid and had to put a tube in, I have [b]always[/b], without exception, managed to pinchflat the tubed tyre again within the next mile or so.
For me, this is sufficient proof that the bit of faf is worth it.

Dual ply High Roller on the back & Single ply ST Minion on the front, Flows, Stans, sorted.

Yes, UST tyres are thicker and as a result, heavier, but they seem to grip when cornering better IMO. Don't know why, maybe they stand up better under load?.. Interesting that there are so many differing opinions about this - given tubeless has been with us for some time, I guess it's always going to divide opinion.

Must check my trail pack tube and pump still work - they've been buried in the bottom of the pack unused for three years now 🙂

I had pinch flats on my 355's with tubes in, wnet tubeless with Specialized 2bliss tyres and haven't suffered since even though I've dented the rim to the poin where it needed straightening with a pair of mole grips.

All (2 No.) thorn punctures have sealed first time too

Not sure what tyre setup Tracey was running: she's sponsored by Bontrager and her tyres just say "Prototype" on the sidewalls.

Personally I agree with the OP and with Trailrider Jim: proper UST = hardly any punctures.

Incidentally I was in the same race running UST and I beat Tracey purely because she punctured and I never! 😉

Got to laugh at the eagle eyed man that can tell that people have blown their tubeless tyres from a distance whilst they are on a chairlift. I just don't get the anti tubeless crowd. If it's not for you then move on. For those of us that it does work for, we enjoy far less trailside fix time than you on average and when it does happen, an anchovy (super fast) or an inner tube (er exactly the same amount of time as a tubed rider!)does the job no bother. Those that try and beat the system with paper thin tyres and low pressures on rocky terrain are hard of thinking. I mean you wouldn't put on super tacky dual ply tyres and DH tubes for a road ride would you?

I pulled a 1 inch nail out of my back tyre the other week. The Stans sealed it up pretty much instantly, just like on his "alley of death" demo. Impressed.

You'll notice Stan doesn't have any videos showcasing sidewall tears though, it doesn't fair so well against those 😉

On that subject, has anyone compared Rocket Rons with Ralphs? I like my 29er 2.25 RoRo's but I worry about the sidewall vulnerability and they don't make them in Snakeskin....Would get Ralph Snakes with the slight weight penalty but the tread looks shallower / tighter spaced, like it wouldn't work so well in mud and I'm not a change tyres to suit conditions sort of person...

The lack of inner tube is a bit of a give away when their tyres' totally blown off the rim. Besides, you're only about 8ft from the chair going the other way, not 300ft...

Only had one puncture in 3 1/2 years and that was a 3" slash in my brand new Ardent 🙁 during an event, of all the times to have my first, been using Stans Flow rims and sealant.

On that subject, has anyone compared Rocket Rons with Ralphs? I like my 29er 2.25 RoRo's but I worry about the sidewall vulnerability and they don't make them in Snakeskin

I use both fairly often. Rons are better in loam, where there's something to bite into, Ralphs are better on harder ground or if it's rocky. Ralphs have more tread on the shoulders, which can make them better in some types of mud, but they have a propensity to spin if it's too slippery. Ralphs last longer and weigh more.

Njee: Thanks, that's a very helpful somethingion.

So there were "many" on the chairlift with their rear tyres blown right off the rim with no innertubes present and you went within 8 feet of them all just to make sure that your prejudices were indeed correct?
That's amazing. You're amazing.

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T-Mo?

I'm epicly dissapointed that Glock (everyones favourie mid-pack back-marker F1 driver) wasn't raceing. Seeing as we're giving everyone Hip-Hop names, even tyres, I am henceforth to be known only as T-Spoon.

Think the T-Mo bit may come from here http://www.tracymoseley.com/

I heard of a downhill racer that is running a rim with two valves in. He has an innertube inside a tubeless tyre and runs the tyre with sealant. It's a bit heavier but is apparently the best solution to punctures.

Didn't some DHers used to run 2 tyres, a slick with the bead cut off on the inside?

exactly. no fuss.

what is all the fuss about? the 'no puncture' thing clearly aint true. neither is the 'less weight' bit.

so why tubeless? just cos its a bit showy?

I'm always amazed at the amount of thorns in my tubeless tyres when I change them, I think I counted 8 last time I changed them, that's 8 times I didn't have to stop to change/repair tubes on just one tyre that has been on for a couple of months...

Tubeless is great...

Didn't some DHers used to run 2 tyres, a slick with the bead cut off on the inside?

I've heard of trials riders doing that but not DH'ers

I heard of a downhill racer that is running a rim with two valves in. He has an innertube inside a tubeless tyre and runs the tyre with sealant. It's a bit heavier but is apparently the best solution to punctures.

Tubeless isn't perfect, but I just like the lack of thron punctures and pinch flats, a torn sidewall is just as much a PITA tubed or no tube and I've not burped a tyre since my first UST tyres in about 2004, whther thats rim design (unlikley, all my rims are normal ones), UST tyre design (unlikley, I run normal maxxis and 2bliss spesh with equal success) or just Conti Gravity UST tyres being utter cack (highly likely).

Two tyres would be pretty heavy?

I've heard of the dual tubes before - a few years ago somebody snapped dual valves on a pro's bike.

Two tyres would be pretty heavy?

Ridiculously, sure I remember it in MBUK or sommat 10 years ago.

tracknicko - Member

i should caveat that i've never actually tried them. ALL of the issues i have had is riding with friends who are ambling along telling me how i should give it a go, and how wonderful it all is...

before they inevitably blow the tyre off rim, gradually lose air-pump up-lose air all day long, burp the crap out of 30psi tyres on tight corners, that kinda thing.

seem absolute dog shit to me, really, really don't get it.

Man, your friends suck at tubeless! Sometimes a new tyre loses air for a little while before it seals properly, that's the only time you should need to add air- if they constantly lose air, something is wrong but some goons just keep adding air. Never had one blow off the rim, never had one burp at 30psi (or 25psi for that matter, except that time when I also broke a big french rock and knocked my rim about an inch out of round). That's standard tyres on tubeless-ready and UST rims though, doing it with BMX tubes was a pain in the bum.

Do it right, with the right kit, and you will most likely be rewarded with good results. Do it badly and you won't.

She was running tubeless, she rolled the tyre off the rim whilst ripping the crap out of a berm on the jumpy bermy bit.

She certainly showed plenty of the men how to ride at CyB, legend.

I was even more frustrated as I had no idea how I had punctured as I was running tubeless, however investigations the next day when I got home revealed a small dent in the rim and some damage to the bead and sidewall of the tyre, so I must have hit the rim earlier in the day or earlier on that stage which must have lost some air pressure then when I pushed hard in the berm the tyre just burped and lost all the air…bummer

But,hold on.......you never get flats with tubeless do you........... 8)

to the OP

the new mini sized dirt just arrived...

t-mos bike spec b4 the race; new thicker sidewalled bonty xr4 tubeless