I've been struggling with long covid for just over 2 years now. Most of the symptoms are clear but I can't handle high intensity exercise. If I go on a typical 2 hour blast with my mates I wake up the next day feeling like I was on a 3 day bender and slept in my car. And I feel like that for several days after. Essentially my energy reserves are unreliable and take a loooong time to recharge.
AS you can imagine, this is beginning to put me off riding my bike. BUT I'm willing to try everything rather than give up.
So my next thought is to get an ebike. My logic is that if I don't run my energy down as much I can still enjoy all the good bits without the shitty long covid hangover.
But.... it's a lot of money. So I'm looking for some advice from ebike owners:
1) Can riding an ebike be less physically demanding OR do you tend to just ride twice as hard and wear yourself out just as much? (Sorry if this is stupid question).
2) Is the weight of the bike a factor? I like the Orbea Rise because of the lightness but is this just a marketing hook? I'm concerned that the energy I save on the uphills will be wiped out as I try to handle the heavier bike on the downs.
3) Are they reliable? I've had a couple of acquaintances have loads of trouble with their Levos.
4) Is it worth getting a second battery?
5) What else do I need to know!?
Ta everso.
Are you going to be riding with non ebike mates? If yes, you'll ride at the same speed (to stay with them) but use significantly less energy.
If riding on your own, you'll either ride further for the same energy, or ride as you would with other non ebikes.
Weight would only be a factor if you'll be going over gates, lifting the bike onto a car roof rack etc. The lightweight ebikes (orbea less, specialized more so) have less power than a full fat ebike so if conserving energy is the aim, go full fat.
If you can, get a demo on a few.
Firstly, despite how many people seem to need to qualify any talk of Ebikes with it, you don't have to have a physical ailment to have an ebike.
It's just a silly, narrow minded view that in time, will naturally subside.
If you have restricted physical ability, they can potentially ease that.
If you're completely able physically, they will ultimately allow you to ride far more of what most people consider the fun bit, downhill trails.
They also can make ridiculous, technical climbs that you would probably never attempt on a regular bike just as much fun though.
1) Can riding an ebike be less physically demanding OR do you tend to just ride twice as hard and wear yourself out just as much? (Sorry if this is stupid question).
It's entirely up to you, the rider. You can ride it so as you put in very little effort, or you can put in more effort and go further(or use more batteries)
2) Is the weight of the bike a factor? I like the Orbea Rise because of the lightness but is this just a marketing hook? I’m concerned that the energy I save on the uphills will be wiped out as I try to handle the heavier bike on the downs.
Yes and no. My bike (Orbea Wild fs) definitely does not feel as poppy and playful as my last non ebike or my non ebike hardtail for example.
But to me, it's very reminiscent of riding downhill bikes. They have this feeling that they'll plough through stuff and have loads of grip. To me, it's very much like how it used to feel when I'd go on an uplift day on my downhill bike, after spending the weeks before riding a trail bike.
You feel the weight of course, but it's not really in a negative way. It's just different.
There's not a lot I feel that my ebike couldn't handle.
3) Are they reliable? I’ve had a couple of acquaintances have loads of trouble with their Levos.
Everyone knows someone who has had issues, but you have to remember that you only tend to hear about problems. People without any issues are reluctant to say and jinx themselves!
There are far more bikes out there with very few issues. (I'm deliberately not mentioning mine! 😂)
4) Is it worth getting a second battery?
Totally depends on what and how you ride.
I can probably do around 25-35 miles and 4.5k feet of climbing on one or thereabouts. Then I can stick my spare in after lunch.
5) What else do I need to know!?
I would say that it's not necessarily all positive, owning an eeb. They've changed something in riding for me that I'm not entirely happy with. I haven't really put my finger on what that is though.
It's muddied the waters of simply riding bikes.
That's all more to do with how my mind works though. Other people have a completely positive experience.
If energy levels are low they are great. You'll be able to get out for fresh air even if you're feeling rubbish. Don't worry too much about weight, even lightweight ones are close to 20kg which is still quite heavy. Personally, I'd get one that's fixable once a warranty expires (not Shimano)
I would say that it’s not necessarily all positive, owning an eeb.
I'd agree. The extra weight dulls the experience somewhat. There's less of that snappy instant feedback you get form normal pedalling. Plus, I've noticeably lost fitness. Yes, you can turn the assistance down, but then it's just a 50lb bike with heavy tyres which isn't much fun. I find I'm riding my normal bike a lot more now, after a year of owning the ebike. But, we're all different. I see a lot of people riding ebikes XC on the South Downs or disused railway paths having a good time (which I find really boring on an ebike).
. I find I’m riding my normal bike a lot more now, after a year of owning the ebike.
I'm the same.
The novelty was a strong pull initially, but afterwards, if you love riding bikes, you love riding most bikes.
Plus, I’ve noticeably lost fitness.
I came to the conclusion that I've not necessarily lost fitness, but rather my sense of pace.
I rode my fatbike up a big hill a couple of months back and Strava gave me a PR. I was faster than several previous attempts before I owned an eeb, but at the time, it felt slow as I guess I was used to the faster, non-stop nature of riding eebs.
As a long covid sufferer, I could definitely see the value. You'd be able to work at a lower heart rate and therefore are less likely to be trashed the next day. I never got one (and thankfully after a year a started to feel a lot better on my bike) but did think about it! However, my Mum and Dad both have chronic health conditions, and both purchased e-road bikes in the last 18 months and it has turned their lives around! They both ride much more frequently - they can ride even when feeling 'meh' and it means they don't have to spend so long recovering between rides. I would seriously look at getting a demo, given your circumstances.
Hi Specialisthoprocker, it sounds to me like an E-MTB is just what you need.
1) Can riding an ebike be less physically demanding OR do you tend to just ride twice as hard and wear yourself out just as much? (Sorry if this is stupid question).
You can set assistance as you want, and change it during and between rides very easily. I bought by Levo three and a half years ago for similar reasons to you, I need to avoid my HR spiking and stay within zones 1-3 as much as possible, so my Eeeeb is perfect for that. I can also ride with mates who are faster/fitter than me, with the Levo dialled-down on power to take the edge off. This sounds like just what you're after.
It's also a lot of fun, even on long XC type rides on the South Downs, just due to the mileage and area you can cover if you're time-limited, and the fact you can include super techy climbs just for the fun of it.
2) Is the weight of the bike a factor? I like the Orbea Rise because of the lightness but is this just a marketing hook? I’m concerned that the energy I save on the uphills will be wiped out as I try to handle the heavier bike on the downs.
The weight is not an issue, it's an e-mtb with 90Nm torque. The only hassle is if you have lots of styles/gates where you live to lift the bike over. Downhill the bike handles fine, definitely heavier but I like the planted feel and grip it provides.
3) Are they reliable? I’ve had a couple of acquaintances have loads of trouble with their Levos.
I've had motor issue with my Levo in three and a half years, although it was annoying when it happened, it was sorted very quickly with no fuss by Specialized. Their warranty is excellent.
I also quite like the look of the Orbea Rise, I'll definitely be demoing one when I decide to replace the Levo.
4) Is it worth getting a second battery?
I manage with a 540wh battery. If I could afford one, I think the 700wh would be better. that said, the maximum I've managed was a 90km ride on the 540wh battery, dialled down to eco-saving assistance.
5) What else do I need to know!?
Get a demo or borrow a mates if you can. Buy one with nearby local bike shop support.
Adding my experience into the mix as well.
1) Can riding an ebike be less physically demanding OR do you tend to just ride twice as hard and wear yourself out just as much? (Sorry if this is stupid question).
Absolutely not a stupid question and it's something a lot of people who don't ride ebikes don't understand. How much effort you put in is up to you. You can bimble along slowly and use next to no energy or you can hammer it and put in just as much effort as on a normal bike.
Personally, I've found the effort to be a lot less like mountain biking and more like road riding. There's less sharp peaks in effort and you're more focused on cadence than most other things.
2) Is the weight of the bike a factor? I like the Orbea Rise because of the lightness but is this just a marketing hook? I’m concerned that the energy I save on the uphills will be wiped out as I try to handle the heavier bike on the downs.
It's definitely a factor compared to a 12-15kg normal bike, but once you're over the 20ish kg limit I do genuinely wonder how much difference you'd notice. My ebike is 24kg, my mates is 22kg, I honestly can't tell the difference when riding either. The big thing here, as said above, is lifting the bike over things and transporting it (if you don't have a van).
3) Are they reliable? I’ve had a couple of acquaintances have loads of trouble with their Levos.
It honestly seems to be a crap shoot at the moment. My bike has been absolutely fine *touch wood* but some of the lads I ride with seem to be on a new motor/battery every 3 months or so.
As long as it's under warranty it seems to be ok.
4) Is it worth getting a second battery?
Personally, no. I've got a 630kw battery and it lasts a solid 40km/2000m climbing of Welsh riding on one charge - I really wouldn't want to carry a second battery on my person for all that riding. If the bike has the double battery mount thing I might consider it, but again it would depend on the weight addition. I imagine it would close to be touching 30kg with a second battery and that sounds like a nightmare.
5) What else do I need to know!?
Ebikes are ridiculously good fun but they're not the same as mountain biking (for me anyway). I've not riden an ebike yet that I would call 'nimble' but they are confidence-inspiring, planted, and take a lot of the chore out of riding. I use mine to explore local trails, loop more downhills, and carry tools when building. It's a completely different ride to any of my other mountain bikes, but it's a hell of a lot of fun.
Hire or borrow one for a few hours and see how you like it, and how you feel afterwards?
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I also have - or mostly, touch wood, had - long covid dating back to early 2020, and I found that an e-mtb was an invaluable rehab tool and a major contribution to my ongoing recovery. I was incredibly fortunate in that a very kind friend who had a mostly unused 2017 Turbo Levo just sitting about, lent it to me at a point where I wasn't strong enough to ride a conventional mountain bike or on the road either, but was desperate to get out again on familiar trails and in high places. The Levo let me do that and was a huge morale boost as well as a stepping stone to building up enough fitness/strength/ confidence to ride normal bikes again.
Stuff I learned: you can ride an e-mtb at a level that's roughly equivalent to a gentle stroll. I could keep my HR at around 100bpm with judicious use of modes, but also, as my fitness improved, I could dial down the assistance level and work a little harder. Even on Eco it's a lot easier than a normal bike, but that's not really the point. There's also no dead-spot in the pedal stroke, which you notice when you ride without motor assistance again. The Specialized Mission Control app makes assistance levels very adjustable. There's also a third party app called Blevo, which allows you to set the bike up so that it adjusts resistance to keep your HR at a pre-set level.
On a slight tangent, I found it much easier to ride conventional bikes on the road than off road. Mountain biking is really hard, particularly round here in the Peak, you're pushing more mass with higher rolling resistance, having to go anaerobic regularly on steep, techy ups and using more upper body input too. I still tolerate riding my cross bike bmuch etter than riding a normal mountain bike, I figure some of that's deconditioning. I rebuilt a lot of base fitness on the road with steady sub-threshold stuff, but still found mountain biking really hard to start with and I still don't recover as well from mountain bike sessions as I used to.
You ask about weight. It's a sod if you have to lift it over a gate or stile or up steps and are still suffering long covid muscular weakness, but not deal breaker. On the move, yes, you can feel the extra weight, but it's not so bad and the bike I have has a tendency to sort of plough straight over a lot of stuff. It's not like a normal bike, but you get used to it pretty quickly and if anything it helps with core and upper body strength.
Reliability? Mine's been pretty good bar a couple of weird battery shutdowns caused by moisture ingress. There's at least one place that will rebuild most motors now, but a good warranty should cover you anyway, Spesh has a good rep for that, but no personal experience.
I've managed without a second battery - they're incredibly expensive - and with care you can eke run-time out with careful use of eco and even switching the motor off going downhill. I guess the obvious solution is to try with just the original battery and see how it goes. Even with long covid, you rarely really 'need' to use turbo/boost mode ime and you can go a surprisingly long way with care / depending on terrain etc.
What else? I can't be arsed with all the weird partisan crap that bubbles around e-bikes with the hate on one side and the exaggerated defensiveness on the other, I'd suggest ignoring it. I never thought I'd say it, but I do think e-mtbs are brilliant for long haulers. It put a huge grin on my face just being on trails and in places that at times it felt like I'd never see again, but it also let me gradually improve my on-bike fitness to a point where I could start riding a normal bike, ironically prompted by one of the battery glitches. A few months back, I did a group ride with non-assisted mates and my average HR for the entire ride was 105bpm at the same pace as everyone else.
So yeah, I would say absolutely go for it. Maybe borrow a mate's e-mtb for a day first if you can, but it was a game-changer for me. If you want a cheaper option, think about a gravel bike you an ride on road and easy off road as it'll hammer you a fair bit less than a mountain bike ime.
More generally, hang in there, it does get better over time and I'm now around 80-90% of normal. If there's owt else I can tell you, just shout. There's a decent FB group for endurance athletes with long covid that has a few mountain bikers and cyclists in it and is quite a useful source of information based on firsthand experience.
Hope that's some help, but basically, go for it would be my take 🙂
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I'd already seen it, but ta!
@BadlyWiredDog - thanks fella that is fantastic insight. And yes, I'm on that Facebook group, it has really helped a lot talking to other people as frustrated as I am! I may drop you a private message if I can?
And thanks to the rest that have commented so far. This is all really useful.
Another thing to consider is, if riding with mates on non ebikes - do you ride a lot on canal paths where your mates might be able to get above the 15mph assistance limit and then you get left behind? You'll soon catch them up at the first hill - but does depend on what riding you do.
@BadlyWiredDog – thanks fella that is fantastic insight. And yes, I’m on that Facebook group, it has really helped a lot talking to other people as frustrated as I am! I may drop you a private message if I can?
Yes of course. Happy to tell you anything I can.
I got my ebike a trek rail at the start of covid lockdowns, the idea was ride the canals to the trails, ride trails then ride home it’s approx 65 mile round trip I wasn’t fit enough to enjoy the ride hence the ebike. Ride from the doorstep and still mtb.
I’ve found im fitter due to the ebike due to pushing myself when it was serviced the stats was 60% unassisted 30% eco and 5% tour and 5% turbo, for me I think I got the wrong bike and feel I should of got a levo sl instead as I don’t need the full assist. But I have found I can double my mileage and the other week did 3 laps of llandegla while in the past I would of done 1 lap and not even want to do that climb again. The ebike makes those climbs fun! When I go back to the road bike or the non ebike im beating my pb due to its in my head I can ride futher. I don’t do group rides but when cycling with a mate i bring my other bike.
Weight yep blooming heavy! It’s why I got the trek as the battery can be released quicker and easier to transport. In hindsight 2 years on I love the rail it’s just so much fun and more miles but my head tells me I should of just got the levo sl. So pick the right bike and test if you can.
I'm getting one as age is catching up. I really don't fancy a 25kg bike though (e or not) so if the OP is the same - look at the Orbea Rise (which I'm thinking of getting). Much lighter than a full fat e bike and all reviews say it rides more like a 'normal' mtb, but still gets you up those nasty climbs. I'm going for the alu version which comes with a 540 battery and a slightly detuned motor (60nm rather than 85).
I'm not a regular biker (yet!) but have always hired ebikes when we're on holiday because I am limited in walking - and my knees can't handle the pressure on a regular bike. Initially I found it a bit frustrating as very different to a regular bike, but then you acclimatise to it as something else. The benefits are - you get all the enjoyment of being out on a bike, without very gentle exercise and very little physical effort. Exercise isn't just about "effort". I loved it. I will add that I also have a condition that can lead to exhaustion and "brain fog" easily, and even with the gentle exercise of an ebike, I could become quite tired and a bit of "brain fag" after half a day cyling - so with something like long covid it may be similar. The way brain fag affected was to feel mental a bit tired with concentrationa and eyes be less sharp.
So I agree that I think it's a great rehabilitation tool - also enjoyment, little and often - but not for the same use as you were used to perhaps. But then that may come back over time and by then you may prefer the ebikes!
I've tried emountain bikes and one ehybrid bike. I preferred the full suspension emountain bike - even on road. There is no way I would try and lift it. Some have "walk assistance" if you need to push it, which is really handy. the slightest weight and physical effort can affect exhaustion. The way that works is you press a lever and it kind of moves along on its own at a low speed while you're walking it. Eg if you're walking from a location to where you want to get on or off the bike.
I have done country trails - with stile gates - not ones you have to lift over but ones where you have to manoevre the bike through the stile gate as it folds both ways. That can be awkward but it's fine.
In terms of riding with mates. It should be ok with an emountain bike with full suspension. When we were on holiday, my family had regular mountain bikes and I was always way ahead of them! Going uphills on rough gravel type tracks was a piece of cake. They would have to get off and push their bikes up.
But depends on the kind of riding you do with mates. If it's fairly flat trails you'd be fine but I think the concentration needed for difficult terrain and serious mountain biking could make it a bit risky for you.
I have some weird energy issue, medical tests ongoing 15 years later but basically I struggle for energy during activity and 'pay' for it afterwards too. After the first lockdown I went back to my favourite forest and the climb out the car park literally had me crying in pain, my fitness was gone. It had taken years to gain what I'd had.
I tested three e-bikes, a Kenevo, Whyte E180 and a Heckler. The E180 felt like it had the best handling but required a lot of energy to boss it around and was no good for me. The Kenevo had the best motor but I didn't like the feel. The Heckler was the lightest and best feel to it, lots of little details were right for me.
1.5 years on I love the Heckler and no regrets. Some of my fitness did return relatively quickly thankfully. It does mean I can go out and not be quite as unwell as I was previously though.
1) Can riding an ebike be less physically demanding OR do you tend to just ride twice as hard and wear yourself out just as much? (Sorry if this is stupid question).
Not a stupid question at all, it is quite insightful! I've found I can and sometimes do go higher and further but it is a choice you can actively make.
2) Is the weight of the bike a factor? I like the Orbea Rise because of the lightness but is this just a marketing hook? I’m concerned that the energy I save on the uphills will be wiped out as I try to handle the heavier bike on the downs.
The lighter weight of the Heckler was an attraction to me, mainly in case I ran out of battery. You don't really notice it riding it most of the time though. I did find the E180 I test rode was no good for me due to the energy input needed to ride it. It wasn't the weight so much as the style of handling.
3) Are they reliable? I’ve had a couple of acquaintances have loads of trouble with their Levos.
I had one of the batteries lose a lot of capacity and it was replaced. I know people who've had problems, I also know people who've been fine.
4) Is it worth getting a second battery?
One for before lunch, one after has been really handy for me, depends what you're doing really. Flattening two batteries is hard work, I usually tire after 1.5 and others seem to as well. Mine are 504Wh so the bigger ones available now are probably the sweet spot. A battery is good for about 4.5k climbing.
5) What else do I need to know!?
You don't mention riding with mates. You can definitely make it work but it does change some of the dynamics and your mates may vary :). Some of my mates also have ebikes now too.
I'm assuming you're thinking of routes with some decent climbing in. I did try the ebike around local flat bridleways/cycle paths and the 15mph cutoff means you end up pedalling a lot which I found torturous.
You're asking the right questions and I suspect you'd enjoy one. The revelation for me was that instead of riding past a trail head, not knowing where it goes, you decide to ride it as getting back up again isn't so bad and you can afford to do it even if it wasn't a great trail. They are awesome machines for exploring which I happen to enjoy a lot.
I've done things with the ebike I doubt I would have been able to do otherwise as I simply wasn't up to the big days out exploring otherwise. Hope that helps in some way.
That Heckler looks good. Also very expensive! Which version did you get?
The answer to your questions OP - is as it is for many things, it depends.
For me, I do miss riding a normal bike. I miss the some of the simplicity of moving entirely under my own power. An ebike of 22kg does feel different to ride on trails, but it’s not necessarily negative. As some above have said there can be more grip, hold their line better and technical or longer steep climbs can be made more fun or pass more quickly. What it has let me do is ride more frequently with my riding buddies on more equal terms again.
As my health condition is progressive, I have found it increasingly hard to get my bike (YT Decoy) into my car (Golf) - but with a more stable health condition or even health improvement that won’t be the case. Also, a larger car would make it considerably easier.
*Stealth Ad Alert!*
For anyone entertaining an ebike purchase, I am now selling my ebike as my strength to lift the bike into the car is declining. I will be putting it on the classifieds and eBay this weekend.
YT Decoy Pro 29 in XL size. Bought in August 2020 Less than 900km with some nice upgrades, including Ohlins TTX22 coil shock. It will be priced to sell…
Additionally, and this is more about limiting your exertion to prevent symptoms later, get a cheap smart band (Mi/OPPO) and set the health app in your phone to scream at you when you hit a certain max BPM. Well below what you used to do. A few rides and you'll hopefully find the right point to get out, have fun, and not wake up like the undead.
For anyone entertaining an ebike purchase, I am now selling my ebike as my strength to lift the bike into the car is declining. I will be putting it on the classifieds and eBay this weekend.
Get a towbar installed, and a rack. You can then just 'ramp' the bike on.
I use the Ebike for 'recovery' or resting up days, i sit just below the cut-off and you can basically ride along on most terrain within the limit and barely even get to 90bpm. So in terms of can you ride and enjoy without taking it hard on yourself, i'd say 100% yes.
I don't particularly enjoy riding the Ebike myself.... but it's very effective at the above.
Get a towbar installed, and a rack. You can then just ‘ramp’ the bike on.
I did think of that - but even wheeling it through my house (Where it lives) is too much for me.
Whilst my local riding options are good, it’s too tame for a 150/145 FS bike, I need to get something lighter and easier to manoeuvre from the garage through the house.