While I'm sure the deal he's signed with Red Bull will be great for him personally and I can't help but be pleased for him, that he's confirmed that he won't be the voice of DH next year (or XCC,and XCO for that matter) has come as a massive blow.
It literally won't be the same without him. I can't say I envy whoever gets that particular poisoned chalice
My personal favourite line? Obviously there's Danny's balls, but I like "I'm glad I didn't pay for this seat Claudio, I've only used the edge of it"
I'll be gutted to see Rob go and be replaced with some rentavoice who doesn't know anything about Downhill but it's just a small part of a bigger shitstorm.
Even the riders are in the dark about next year. No dates, no venues and no word about an updated race format. It's a shocking state of affairs really.
If the viewers disappear I think a lot of brands are going to seriously struggle to justify running a factory team.
Oh man, that's massively disappointing.
Yeah there's rumours of price hikes (from $3000 to $20000) next year for team registrations.
Agreed the lack of news or updates is really worrying, I've got to say, I thought Discovery would be a bit more organised than this.
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So what is he going to be the voice of for Redbull? Is he going to be doing more docu-series, or are they still covering events outside the UCI series.
I've heard his voice pop up quite a lot on Red Bull stuff so no doubt they'll keep him busy. I don't watch any of it regularly but he does freestyle MX and enduro stuff. He'll probably still do Hardline.
that he’s confirmed that he won’t be the voice of DH next year
Has he said that, or that he wont be the voice of UCI DH?
Red Bull have known about this for how many years and they have re-signed him. Are they going to expand crankworx Dh coverage? Broadcast the IXS? Start their own rival series?
I've said this before. DH will never be an olympic sport. There is not going to be athlete crossover with XC or other UCI disciplines. While I don't hate the UCI or think they have done anything specificcally wrong they are unneccessary.
The only reason the UCI DH WC circuit and world champs is the pinnacle of the sport is because the riders and fans (via the coverage) make it so.
I dont know what the RB rider budget is, but if they announced a one off race, different venue each year, winner recieves say $250000? and/or a RB helmet for the next year if they dont have a helmet/drink sponsor already - I reckon the World Champs and Rainbow jersey will get forgotten about overnight.
So what is he going to be the voice of for Redbull? Is he going to be doing more docu-series, or are they still covering events outside the UCI series.
I imagine that RedBull will be increasing their involvment/investment in events like Crankworx, possibly expanding the scope of the events to a level that almost competes with the WC DH. They already have all the staff and equipment ready to go, if whoever owns the Crankworx franchise is willing I can see it expanding quickly to incorporate XC as well, possibly even drawing riders away from the WC's.
On a related note, I saw a Pinkbike video about the formation of a riders union, mostly, it seems in response to the complete black hole of information regarding the setup next year and there was something that Greg Minaar said in that video that I didn't know. He implied that the Discovery running of DH and XC was being run by Chris Ball.?? Is that right.? Seems like a lot to take on but possible given the tie in between Discovery and EWS already in place.
sharkattack
Even the riders are in the dark about next year. No dates, no venues and no word about an updated race format. It’s a shocking state of affairs really.
Well, half of them don't need to worry as the field is being cut to 30
nickc
Yeah there’s rumours of price hikes (from $3000 to $20000) next year for team registrations.
Agreed the lack of news or updates is really worrying, I’ve got to say, I thought Discovery would be a bit more organised than this.
Yeah, normally with Discovery they show you everything that's going to happen before it starts.
from reading the pinkbike comments, most of them would be happy if it's only the top15 🙁
Red Bull DH world series!! (I wish, I shan't be watching the UCI one again from the sounds of things)
Well, half of them don’t need to worry as the field is being cut to 30
That's the (much) bigger concern here really. Yeah Rob's role is irreplacable but if this (is it 100% confirmed?) happens that's stuffing up DH bigtime.
Where TF's the logic in cutting the number of riders in the finals by over half? That can only be to make it easier to broadcast a shorter race I assume. Must be hugely disappointing for developing riders.
Even the riders are in the dark about next year. No dates, no venues and no word about an updated race format. It’s a shocking state of affairs really.
Well, half of them don’t need to worry as the field is being cut to 30
rumours of price hikes (from $3000 to $20000) next year for team registrations.
It does seem ripe for an independent series under RedBull or someone else to find opportunity...
On a related note, I saw a Pinkbike video about the formation of a riders union, mostly, it seems in response to the complete black hole of information regarding the setup next year
This union seems to be spearheaded by Bruni and Iles. Now I don't mean to suggest that they are unable to empathize with other riders issues, but the two of them have had as far as I can tell a charmed/lucky career - never had a job other than pro-rider, grew up in a riding paradise with emotionally and financially supporting parents. The plight of the van dwelling privateer is not exactly known to them.
They are however both paid by redbull and specialized, probably two of the deepest pockets in the sport. As well as being charesmatic and liked personalities in the paddock and with the fans.
Could they be gathering the riders to be able to respond en-mass to Discovery?
Where TF’s the logic in cutting the number of riders in the finals by over half? That can only be to make it easier to broadcast a shorter race I assume. Must be hugely disappointing for developing riders.
DH is quite unusual in how many people turn up for qualifying and the race. But what it doesn’t have at the moment is a decent feeder series for the second tier riders. Something like a proper European series, a North American series and so on.
As much as the UCI deserve it, I can’t really see a rival series happening. It’d take around 5mins for the UCI to announce that anyone doing it would be banned from all UCI (E.g. BDS) races, leaving riders in a horrible position
It’d take around 5mins for the UCI to announce that anyone doing it would be banned from all UCI (E.g. BDS) races, leaving riders in a horrible position
And a further 10 minutes for a riders union to announce that they were going to do the Redbull series anyway because thats the one everyone is watching, and therefore the reason they are getting paid.
As much as the UCI deserve it, I can’t really see a rival series happening. It’d take around 5mins for the UCI to announce that anyone doing it would be banned from all UCI (E.g. BDS) races, leaving riders in a horrible position
Surely, if there's a high paying, well funded and widely broadcast competing series then this would be a hollow threat for anyone outside of XC.? The only power the UCI holds over the MTB disciplines are for Olympic eligibility and that only covers (and is only ever likely to cover) XC.? Unless the UCI gets DH and Enduro into the Olympics then surely their ability to dictate to the riders is limited.?
And a further 10 minutes for a riders union to announce that they were going to do the Redbull series anyway because thats the one everyone is watching, and therefore the reason they are getting paid.
At the expense of only having 6 (for arguments sake) races available to enter a year. As I said, a horrible position to be forced into. Then you've got the added complexity of the manufacturer teams all being UCI linked through the different disciplines they do, the team may therefore have to choose between supporting the DH riders or everyone else - DH is unlikely to come out of that well
I only watch the XCO and for all of Rob Warner enthusiasm he does come across as ****ing clueless at times on the XCO, especially in the women's racing. It really does need someone with his enthusiasm along with Bart Brentjens knowledge.
Not a clue about DH riders but a lot of the XC riders also do other races including marathon and stage races, not sure if these other races fall under the UCI ruling?
At the expense of only having 6 (for arguments sake) races available to enter a year. As I said, a horrible position to be forced into. Then you’ve got the added complexity of the manufacturer teams all being UCI linked through the different disciplines they do, the team may therefore have to choose between supporting the DH riders or everyone else – DH is unlikely to come out of that well
But once again though, isn't that driven from the other direction with DH.? The local and national series are under UCI jurisdiction in order to attract riders looking to gain UCI points to be able to go to the WC and international events.? If the big name riders and sponsors and looking elsewhere and the UCI blocks them from UCI events then surely the likely result is the local and national events dropping their UCI status.? Seems like a probably game of russian roulette for both sides.
It sounds like they are looking to focus on the elite riders and make the series more exclusive, whilst there is a certain business logic to this it certainly removes something from the sport that , I think , fans like and that’s the underdog privateer story .
If these moves stop people like all the Aussies and kiwis , Adam brayton , Taylor vernon , the denim destroyer , Phil Atwell etc etc then I think the sport will be much poorer for it . Also , I’m only guessing but I’d imagine that a lot of the smaller teams such as propain , the union , pink bike racing etc would struggle to pay the extra fees without dropping riders .
Im just not sure that you will ever get none mtbers watching downhill racing, I love watching it but I just don’t see people I know who don’t ride sitting down for 3 hours and watch dh world cups .
Its far easier to organise your smaller event if operating under the rules, procedures and insurances of British Cycling. So yes they could breakaway too, but it'd be really messy as the whole world would have to do something similar all in support of a new series that may or may not survive the test of time. Russian Roulette is probably fitting, just look at what's happening in golf right now. The UCI would be at least that arsey about it
I'm still not sure if it's clear whether it was a UCI decision, Redbull got outbid for it or if Redbull just decided it's time to move on but whatever, this is BAD for the sport.
very reminiscent of the dodgy deal the UCI did with some sponsor that no one had ever heard of that ended up not delivering on any of their promises. I forget the name but it was embarrassing in the extreme.
Fingers crossed it's better than everyone expects it will be but the UCI have form for making ****ing awful decisions where DH is concerned.
I only watch the XCO and for all of Rob Warner enthusiasm he does come across as **** clueless at times on the XCO
He may have a few gaffes usually on identifying riders from the same team in the middle of a pack or dust cloud (although he seemed oblivious to the reason that the muslim woman was covreing her arms and legs in the 30+ degree heat).
But most of the time he seems to be feigning ignorance when asking a question, to prompt Bart to answer.
Well if he's feigning ignorance he must have a degree in it he's doing it that well.
I spotted Chris Ball and Dan Jarvis deep in conversation in the Canyon pits, Lenzerheide this year.
Speeder
Full MemberI’m still not sure if it’s clear whether it was a UCI decision, Redbull got outbid for it or if Redbull just decided it’s time to move on but whatever, this is BAD for the sport.
Outbid I believe. Which is troubling in other ways, did Discovery go too high (you could imagine the dollar signs in the UCI's eyes) or does Red Bull not actually value mountain biking that highly?
But most of the time he seems to be feigning ignorance when asking a question, to prompt Bart to answer.
That's how it comes across to me, he's playing the first time viewer and asking the expert basic questions about what's happening to get an explanation for the viewer, kinda like those annoying exposition bits in TV and movies where they explain stuff that's obvious to 90% of the viewership.
Got to agree though that his gaffe regarding the muslim rider was pretty cringe-worthy. He did correct himself fairly quickly though.
Outbid I believe. Which is troubling in other ways, did Discover go too high (you could imagine the dollar signs in the UCI’s eyes) or does Red Bull not actually value mountain biking that highly?
I seem to recall reading that Red Bull walked away from the bidding process once it was clear they were going to have to compete to hold onto the rights, could be misremembering that though.
Is it possible that Red Bull saw the writing on the wall and decided to either cut their losses or do their own thing.? I'm not aware of how their investment in various sports differs but they seem to have a decent level of investment in MTB, presumably in terms of actual cash it's a tiny fraction of F1, WRC and their MotoGP feeder series but possibly higher than most of their other interests.?!?
Given the number of RedBull helmets on display at WC DH, not to mention EWS and XC, I could see Red Bull being at least as arsey as the UCI if they chose to be (preventing their athletes from competing in UCI events.?), I get the feeling the the Red Bull helmeted riders are looked after pretty well.
very reminiscent of the dodgy deal the UCI did with some sponsor that no one had ever heard of that ended up not delivering on any of their promises. I forget the name but it was embarrassing in the extreme.
Ah yes, Rocky Roads dot net. The worlds largest cycling website with millions of unique visitors every month which no one had ever heard of. Obviously totally legit.
It's hard to find any info about them now... www.cyclingnews.com/news/uci-ends-world-cup-partnership-with-title-sponsor-rockyroads/
and decided to either cut their losses or do their own thing.?
I can't imagine that a sponsorship organisation as good as Red Bull clearly is is going to do anything as misguided as creating a rival series that would clearly influence any relationship that the have now, or want to have in the future with an organisation like the UCI
He implied that the Discovery running of DH and XC was being run by Chris Ball.?? Is that right.?
Nothing to imply really, it's factual.
ESO, the rebranded organising bit of the EWS, now has responsibility for UCI DH, XC etc
Rocky Roads! Of course - must have expunged them form my mind. Wonder if it was anything to do with Rich Energy/William Storey?
Nothing to imply really, it’s factual.
ESO, the rebranded organising bit of the EWS, now has responsibility for UCI DH, XC etc
Right, that's the bit of info I was missing. So does that make us more or less nervous about what's going to happen next year then.? I mean the EWS has gone from nothing to a huge series in a very short time so clearly they have some talent for organising events and series.? Add to that, the integration of PlaySports Network (GCN) with Eurosport cycling coverage has been largely successful, admittedly that's been mostly about incorporating the new organisation and staff into an already experienced broadcaster whereas the DH/XC situation involves a complete replacement. This year's EWS/GMBN coverage however is definitely cause for concern as it seems to have been a bit of a step backwards, although they do seem to be improving quite quickly.
It's been enjoyable having it to watch all these years for free. But how is WC DH doing? Has it grown in the last few years? Outside of our niche interest it's small fry.
It's great that a privateer can get a point and compete, but should an elite level sport be held back to cater for privateers?
Why are there only 6 or so races year? Can't help but think the exposure for companies is relatively poor. 1 min or so to see your rider on TV.
F1/MotoGP have 20 or so entries over 20 races a year. Juniors and up and comers get through junior/lower series and get promoted. It's a huge risk but they need to go balls deep.
Where is the fee from discovery going? In F1, Football etc TV rights money (a lot of) go to the teams.
Where is the fee from discovery going? In F1, Football etc TV rights money (a lot of) go to the teams.
A good question, which leads to wondering how common is it to hand over the running of a global sporting event to a broadcaster.? Does this happen anywhere else.? I mean in F!, MotoGP, football etc. there is an organisation that sells the broadcasting rights for best advantage to the sport (theoratically!). I can't think of any other event that hands over the entire running of the series to a broadcaster.??
Where is the fee from discovery going?
As far as I'm aware (happy to be corrected) they are paying the UCI for the right to broadcast the race.
The towns/resorts also have to pay the UCI (6 figure sums) for the priviledge of hosting a race.
Elite teams pay for the abilty to enter their riders. Individuals pay for the ability to enter. They arent getting money for showing up.
So I guess this will mean paying to view the DH series next year?, how much will that cost?
The UCI can do what they like and everyone just has to get on with it. For historical reasons (that's I don't claim to know) they have the unilateral exclusive right to be the governing body (ie in charge) of any cycling event they like. Despite what anyone on here may think, being a World Champ and those rainbow stripes matter, both to riders and sponsors.
You just need to look back at snowboarding. The ski world didn't give a crap about snowboarding until it was going to be included in the Olympics. Then they could make money out of it and the FIS (ski federation) took control of Olympic qualifying and the older ISF (snowboard tour) basically folded and now snowboarding is ruled by the skiers. (ok it's an oversimplification , but the gist of it is correct) At the time the sport's biggest star Terje Haakonsen boycotted the Olympics over it, and is still revered for his decision amongst older riders, but is probably unknown to the younger generation who idolise the Olympic medal winners.
Same will happen in DH racing. I can't see any of the riders walking away from an officially recognised World Series to race a breakaway one, even for more money.
I can’t see any of the riders walking away from an officially recognised World Series to race a breakaway one, even for more money
anyone here a cricket fan? quite a few parallels to be drawn
So I guess this will mean paying to view the DH series next year?, how much will that cost?
Have been wondering this.. Will it be rolled into the GCN+ sub or will you need a Discovery+ sub.? Who knows but if you are only interested in DH and XC and not road/CX racing or the big pile of other Discovery content then it'll be a tough sell.
GCN+ is £39.99 pa, Discovery+ is £59.99 to get the sports coverage.!
GCN+ is £39.99 pa
£40 for 8 DH races, 8 XCO races, 8 XCC. Thats £1.67 a race. or 83p if you consider the mens and womens to be separate events.
More importantly can you pay by the month?
The UCI can do what they like and everyone just has to get on with it. For historical reasons (that’s I don’t claim to know) they have the unilateral exclusive right to be the governing body (ie in charge) of any cycling event they like. Despite what anyone on here may think, being a World Champ and those rainbow stripes matter, both to riders and sponsors.
So this comes down to the Olympics doesn't it.? The Olympic committee will only allow sports that are governed by a recognised body, for cycling this is the UCI.If you want your cycling discipline in the Olympics, it needs to be a UCI governed discipline. This is the point at which the UCI got control of MTB, XC racing wanted to get into the Olympics and so had to become a UCI sanctioned series with a World Cup and World Championship as well as the various national championships and series that go with it. I believe that DH was dragged along with it as it didn't make sense for it to be left on it's own, throwing in with the national cycling body which is backed by the UCI carries a lot of benefits in terms of costs, insurance etc.
However, as has been mentioned earlier by someone else, DH isn't ever getting into the Olympics, does that weaken the UCI's hold on it if this new deal turns out to be ruining the sport and Red Bull are waiting in the wings to pick up the pieces with a non UCI series and unofficial world championships .? Only time will tell but potentially their position isn't as strong as they are used to without the ability to hold the Olympics over everyone's head.
