[Closed] Road bike tyres - 25 Vs 23?

It depends on the quality of the tyre. A good 23mm will feel better than a bad 25mm. I switched from 23 - 25mm on the same model and noticed very little difference. 23 to 28 is noticeable but in my case that might be due to them being on different bikes!

I doubt the "feel" of grip would change.

My recommendation for a good allrounder is the Continental GP 4 Season. Same rubber as the GP4000 race tyre but tougher carcass.

The only real way to tell if a 28mm would fit is to try one out. Althuogh the difference is actually tiny so if you photograph the frame/fork around the calipers then people on here would be able to guide you.

What wheels have you got. I used to find my RS80s very comfortable and switching between standard box section alu and deep aero rims makes the bike change too.

Have started using tubeless 28s and it has been a revelation (in comfort and grip) for me.
If they fit your frame and your rims aren't too narrow I would recommend them every time now.

Unless you're racing, go fatter! 28, or even 30, are great for grip and comfort on rubbish road surfaces.

I'd second the 'fatter is better' approach. Don't put too much air in them either as overinflation can make the bike feel skittish. FWIW, I'm 73 kg and ride 25s at 90 psi, more like 80 if it's wet and 'orrible.

Also just gone to road tubeless.. 28c schwalbe pro one. Faster and comfier.

The wheelset is a basic-ish Campag set - rather not have to change them if possible. Will photo the tightness of tyre to frame to get views if 28c would fit. Thanks

Don't think the GP4seasons and GP4000s are the same rubber are they (I have both and prefer the 4000s).

And as I understand it both the fast lads and the fat lads recommend big tyres these days - 25s anyway.

Raced for two and half hours over some pretty rough Surrey lanes yesterday. Rode with Mavic 25C as I have raced almost exclusively. Almost the entire bunch looked like thery were also on 25c's too.

I have the same tyres in 23c too and if I am honest, I don't see a huge difference on smooth roads. On the lanes it is a different matter. I run the 25c at 5psi lower to help smooth the ride and stay planted.

I thin 28c is over-doing it to be honest. A good supple tyre at the right (load-dependent) pressure is what you need. Latex tubes help with the ride too, but are an inconvenience to be honest.

Rim width can affect the ride as well. I've just gone from traditional road-narrow rims with 23mm tyres to 17mm internal width and 25mm tyres - the difference is remarkable. I can run slightly lower pressures (about 10psi less, 75 kg, 100psi in the 25's) and they are a revelation. Fast in a straight line and a nice ride and lots of grip in bumpy corners (Sheffield and the Peak District, I know my rough and bumpy roads!).

As well as the comfort, they also feel nice and confidence inspiring - they lean in nice and predictably in corners, for example.

Different tyres will feel different. Nice supple casing on a 23 will be comfier than a cheap and nasty 25. There are a lot of different Vredstein tyres, but I do remember having a pair that were not very grippy, particularly when new in the wet.

A larger tyre will grip more consistently on a less than perfect surface, and will allow you (all things being equal) to run a lower pressure for a given rolling resistance, which will help comfort.

To see if 28s will fit, your best bet is to see if there's an LBS with the ones you fancy in, or go somewhere online that will do free delivery on the returns. Different rim widths etc will all have an effect. Don't run them with too tight clearances or you'll get them rubbing a hole in your frame when they flex, particularly out of the saddle/during cornering.

thanks all, v helpful.

Any recommendations for a supple 25c tyre? I'm not racing, prob for nice weather, local lanes so not lovely smooth surfaces!

Been riding 25mm+ tyres since the venerable Michelin Axial Carbons came out in the late 90s - mainly ride on narrow country lanes covered in cr@p and full of potholes and don't know why anyone would ride rock-hard skinny tyres anymore. As well as the benefits of reduced rolling-resistance, improved grip and less impact punctures the more rounded profile gives more progressive handling when cornering - I can rail a 25mm tyre harder than a 23mm. In terms of the OPs question regarding fitting 28mm tyres - the rims will allow it, but whether there is sufficient clearance between the tyre and the brakes / fork crown can only be found by trying.

Vittoria Open Paves were £25 each from Evans Cycles. At that price it was rude not to - paid nearly double that for a previous pair! I raced a pair over the winter on damp Surrey roads and also at pan-smooth Hillingdon, liked them so much I bought the second pair and have ridden them on my nice bike over Dartmoor lanes during Spring (both with latex tubes). I don't feel the need to take them off the nice bike, to be honest. They are very good. Tread wear is not stellar but the ride is superb. I also have them in 27c (for Paris Roubaix last year), but again, not really a huge difference to the 25c all black version (no iconic green band) on country lanes.

I'll probably go to Vittoria Corsa G+ for the race bike now that the Mavic 25c rear is wearing thin, but after Saturday reminded me just how bad the lanes can be (average speed 42 km/h, so bumpy too), I think 25c will be the width (on wide carbon rims).

Schwalbe Ones in 25c are also a fine tyre, cheaper now, and come up wider than standard. Not as supple as the Vittorias, but faster rolling than the Paves. I haven't tried Michelin or Continental, but am thinking of GP4000s II for the TT bike. Those aren't really a great tyre for rough lanes though.

Road tyres are probably the single biggest incremental gain you can make on a bike, their development has been remarkable.

Continental Grand Prix GT have impressed me and sound like they might be the kind of thing you're after, I did a review here...
http://unduro.co.uk/road/review-continental-grand-prix-gt-tyres/

https://flic.kr/p/FFKKFD

@jonba

GP4000 II use Conti's "Black Chilli" compound with 1 vectran breaker

4 Seasons use "Max Grip Silica" compound with 2 vectran breakers

very different feeling tires; I find the 4 seasons too slippy for aggressive riding, but fine for commuting if you want a fast "race type" tire with adequate puncture resistance - much more secure in the wet than the hard compound / stiff carcass Gator line of tires

if you want a really good performance tire, try Vittoria's new 'Corsa G+', the 25c has a generous volume, its stupidly grippy even in foul weather, very fast rolling and much better wear resistance than the old Open Corsa and Pave

[img] [/img]

my first set of G+ lasted 4 months including 150km of weekly commuting in London, I'm on my second set now which are the "anthracite" colour option with a grey sidewall as opposed to the more common gumwall colour option

in comparison I'd get about 4-5 weeks out of the old Pave or Corsa which would be square topped and cut to shreds

thanks all, really helpful for me.

Am currently running vredestein fortezza tricomp 23 c.

Here's a couple of pics of tyre/frame for anyone who might be able to judge 28c feasibility, albeit sounds like 25c will do the job well for me

[url= https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1469/26378158730_c115702aa4_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1469/26378158730_c115702aa4_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/GbWXAb ]Tyre[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/46083140@N06/ ]aus23[/url], on Flickr

[url= https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1532/26047792943_cc59d555e8_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1532/26047792943_cc59d555e8_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/FFKKmk ]Tyre[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/46083140@N06/ ]aus23[/url], on Flickr

[url= https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1535/26047797613_1a65811fa0_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1535/26047797613_1a65811fa0_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/FFKLJR ]Tyre[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/46083140@N06/ ]aus23[/url], on Flickr

Remember 23>>25 is 18% bigger*, while 23>>28 is 48% bigger.

It's quite a change.

*roughly

I have 23c Conti 4000 on my summer bike - used a lot around Pilgrims and other North Downs-type routes and they've been fine.
My winter bike has 25c Conti 4 seasons and they do feel like they have a little more grip for wet roads, although I would say there's very little difference in feel really
However when I went from 25c Conti Grand Prix GT to 28c Conti 4 seasons on my commuter the increase in comfort and grip (especially when leaning the bike over) felt quite significant.

100psi in all tyres and I weigh 73kg.

Vittoria Open Corsas are superb tyres but my understanding is that they are now made in Taiwan. The family-owned factory in Italy still makes some Vittorias but they also make Veloflex tyres and my son, my cycling buddy and I have all fallen in love with Veloflex Open Corsas, which are a similarly luxurious tyre to the original Vittorias. They cost around £54 for a pair from Ribble Cycles. The ride is supremely smooth in 23mm or 25mm and they are even better with latex inners. Best of all is the incredible grip; the bike feels really planted and the cornering is excellent. Last Saturday we held a race at the road track in Nelson to celebrate my 60th birthday and the only way I could make up any ground was by out-cornering round the outside of the rest of the pack, meaning that I have actually ground a chamfer on the outside edge of my left-hand Keo because I needed to keep the power on while everybody else freewheeled. Even pedalling hard while leaned over the Veloflex felt superbly secure and they are also excellent on wet tarmac.

Had been using 25mm for decades while friends stuck with 23mm.

Recent purchases came with 23mm tyres and felt quite harsh and a quick swap to 25mm changed the ride for the better.

The top end Vittoria and Continental (and probably the new Michelin) tyres will all be good, just a matter of finding the best compromise between puncture resistance/rolling resistance/carcass feel/wear/grip out of these.

I'd go for the fastest personally based on the fact it doesn't really take that long to change a puncture and nothing will avoid all punctures.

@globalti

all the Vittoria tires have been made in Thailand for some years including their tubs and clinchers; they have an excellent manufacturing plant (Lion Tires) making 7 million tires / 900,000 tubs and open tubs a year

Veloflex was founded by previous employees of Vittoria when Vittoria moved production from Italy to Thailand in 1990, and make all their tires in Italy

Challenge tires are also made in Thailand, started in 2003 when they bought the old Clement / Brewo factory and created the 'Challenge' brand name following a dispute with Pirelli over the Clement trademark

Here's a couple of pics of tyre/frame for anyone who might be able to judge 28c feasibility, albeit sounds like 25c will do the job well for me

Looks a bit tight at the chainstays to get away with a 28.

I've preferred bigger tyres, managed to squeeze 28's onto my Giant Defy only to find the following day the tyres had 'stretched' overnight and now touched the top of the fork so have to settle for 25's. On my disc bike with more clearance I prefer 28's and find they roll well on the rough normal roads nowadays.

Currently on GP4000 but also quite liked the much cheaper Conti Ultra Sports when I had those.

I've preferred bigger tyres, managed to squeeze 28's onto my Giant Defy only to find the following day the tyres had 'stretched' overnight and now touched the top of the fork so have to settle for 25's. On my disc bike with more clearance I prefer 28's and find they roll well on the rough normal roads nowadays.

Currently on GP4000 but also quite liked the much cheaper Conti Ultra Sports when I had those.

An interesting article in the April/May 2016 edition of Cycle (The Cycling UK/CTC mag) on this very subject.