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Had to have a swap of a ebike on the last day of a Lakes trip last week, 80 miles and 12,600ft/3840m climbing over 5 days from pretty much nothing over the entire winter - well on the last climb of the last day (a proper push up) my thighs were hurting badly and on the verge of cramping up so one of the group let me swap with his whyte E150...
Jesus Christ.
Some day. Not right now, as I'd need to have one alongside my FS and hardtail, and another 5k+ bike just can't be justified. But I will replace the FS with one of the lightweight ebikes at some point, maybe 5-10 years from now.
Good for sessioning a few downhill runs in a fixed amount of time but a potential liability on a proper day out.
People are getting some pretty dire range & elevation on their bikes here.
I have a Rail with the 625wh battery and Bosch CX4 motor & if I ride it in Eco I can easily get 2000+ M of climbing in a 60+ KM day. Generally that’s how I use it, unless we’re blatting out with friends or doing power laps, all of which it’s great for.
In terms of ride, I think ultimately like a normal bike you can ride ones that feel agile, others that feel like big, long, sluggish gravity bikes. The weight doesn’t significantly change riding style IMO, mostly braking points, but that’s it.
nice to see a conversation about e-bikes that hasn't got all "judgey" and some interesting points made.
for what it's worth, my 2p after having my rail for a year now:
- i ended up riding the e-bike more than i thought i would, prob 2/3 vs 1/3 of rides on the bronson, some of that is time related, but at weekends i often go for big rides on the rail as it provides more all round "fun" and i think thats one of the big selling points for e-bikes - the whole ride turns into fun. not just parts of it interspersed with suffering
- the e-bikes open up different more varied routes or combinations of trails than my normal bike. even when i was pretty fit i would never think 'oh, i'll just do another lap of jacobs ladder' or 'i'll just pop up that massive hill as there's a couple of short sections i like on the other side and then carry on with the planned ride' - none of that's an issue on the rail
- you do have to haul them around more and be more physical with them due to the extra weight. however that extra weight also means they feel incredibly planted on techy / rocky descents and i'm pretty convinced it also helps the suspension work better
- when you ride your normal bikes, it feels like a rocket ship downhill and so light & nimble, the flip side being it feels like your riding with your rear brake stuck on for the first part of the ride on the ups
- with a 625wh battery and the newer more efficient motors, range anxiety isn't an issue (for me at least). after c 20 miles of winch and plummet riding in the peak, i'm normally knackered and ready to go home before the bike is
- e-bikes are brilliant if you are time short, i a quick 90 minutes blast after work i can get a decent ride in which just wouldn't be possible on the bronson
i can see a point in the next couple of years as e-bikes become lighter and more efficient that i'll likely end up ditching the normal bike and end up going e-bike only, especially as more and more of my riding buddies are riding e-bikes more of the time
I have a Rail with the 625wh battery and Bosch CX4 motor & if I ride it in Eco I can easily get 2000+ M of climbing in a 60+ KM day. Generally that’s how I use it
really, if i ride my rail in eco on anything other than the road or flattish hard pack trails it feels pretty much the same effort as riding my normal bike, which seems to defeat the point! saying that i am using DD casing on the rear which i wouldn't do on my bronson
nice to see a conversation about e-bikes that hasn’t got all “judgey” and some interesting points made
Absolutely this.
@Hob-nob what tyres are you using on the ebike? I'm kinda looking just now, something that will be tough enough on the rear with the extra weight without sucking the range too much. I picked up a cheap aggressor WT DD last week, I'll probably go Mary 2.6 on the front again.
nice to see a conversation about e-bikes that hasn’t got all “judgey” and some interesting points made
As someone whose only contact with ebikes so far is being overtaken on uphill bridleways (my line being "please tell me that thing's turned on") but v much not a hater, I get that the riding will feel different, particularly the going faster and tech lines uphill sounding like fun, and that you must be averaging higher speeds, but just a bit surprised to see these overall routes lengths and particularly climbing are same as you'd do on a regular bike? I guess I'd thought the point was more self uplift/laps of descents hence high proportion seen in euro mountains (also a slight concern re my most local riding).
and that you must be averaging higher speeds, but just a bit surprised to see these overall routes lengths and particularly climbing are same as you’d do on a regular bike?
Suspect most people doing 'normal bike' length rides are with people on normal bikes.
If i'm on my own or only with ebikes then the ride will end up being 2 x longer/higher than on normal bikes if I onluy have a short time available, If I've got longer then they will be 3x longer/higher.
Most of the time I'm with someone on a normal bike and it is a bit annoying- although sometimes I will zoom off uphill and get a cheeky bonus downhill in while waiting for them to come up.
really, if i ride my rail in eco on anything other than the road or flattish hard pack trails it feels pretty much the same effort as riding my normal bike, which seems to defeat the point!
I’m fairly fit, not very heavy & work as hard as I would do on a normal bike for those sorts of rides, so it’s just a quicker experience. Got a couple of super fit locals (UK elite XC racers) who like riding tech who come out as it’s a beasting for them against my effort for comparisons sake.
what tyres are you using on the ebike? I’m kinda looking just now, something that will be tough enough on the rear with the extra weight without sucking the range too much
I keep my tyres exactly the same across both bikes to be fair, 2.5 Assegai EXO+ MaxxGrip on the front & 2.4DHR2 DD MaxxTerra on the rear. They give me enough puncture protection on the eeb and for normal bike riding & racing (when it happens!)
I guess I’d thought the point was more self uplift/laps of descents
Most of my riding buds and me are doing about x3 the elevation gain that we used to on mtbs on an 'average' eeb ride.
Fun.
Suspect most people doing ‘normal bike’ length rides are with people on normal bikes.
Ah! 💡
I’m fairly fit, not very heavy & work as hard as I would do on a normal bike
that would be three no's form me and suddenly all makes sense!
I did both rides with weeksy on my whyte E150S. We can get a 5 hour ride out with a 625wh battery fairly easily. To get more means riding as slow as a manual bike and not hitting the steep climbs that aren't really possible on a normal bike. For me that's the point of an ebike to go places I can't on a normal bike, and go for longer doing them. I did try weeksy's wifes ebike and compared to my whyte it's a bit of a barge with a really heavy front end. Not at all playful and welded to the ground 🙂 My whyte by comparison is in a different league. Rather controversially I do run mine derestricted at times on quiet trails when I'm alone. It turns what would otherwise be flat and boring 15mph runs into 25mph runs and makes them much more exciting. TBH it's then a similar speed to the very quickest normal bike riders. But for longer rides in the peaks etc 15mph is more than enough. As with any bike you have to pick your ebike carefully and preferably demo first.
As for fitness and how hard you work that's all down to how hard you try same as any other bike. On the peaks ride 5 of us were ebikers and weeksy was the normal rider. There was no fitness difference between any of us which I think was an eye opener for weeksy 🙂
Have to say places like the Peaks and Exmoor would be good areas for Ebikes not that I have one my sort of Ebike is a KTM250F freeride.
Most of my riding buds and me are doing about x3 the elevation gain that we used to on mtbs on an ‘average’ eeb ride.
Out of interest, roughly what elevation gain are we talking about?
I am quite interested to try an ebike at some point particularly having seen a lot of talk of this type. However, this thread seems to suggest that most ebikes would struggle to make it through my 'normal' weekly bigger rides. For reference I regularly ride 1500m / 5000ft+ of elevation over five hours or so in the Tweed Valley, Dunkeld etc.
Out of interest, roughly what elevation gain are we talking about?
Well, the other day for example I rode at Hopton and did 4600 feet of ascent over 21 miles on a 625 battery.
I still had a little left, but you have to make the call to stop sometimes as pedalling unassisted if you run out completely is treacle. Also, I was with a mate who only had a 500 battery in his Marin. He's lighter though and so actually had a little left too.
I actually have a second battery, a 500. So sometimes our rides will be over two batteries and a lunch stop and be 6.5k ish of ascent.
That's not running the battery until dead though. Having two batteries, while eye-wateringly expensive allows you to go flat out until your physical energy runs out which is normally before two batteries are done.
Ebiking is closer to how you feel after a full day of uplift, riding rough downhill at your limit. You defo feel it, but it's a bit different.
For reference I regularly ride 1500m / 5000ft+ of elevation over five hours or so in the Tweed Valley, Dunkeld etc.
It’s not just the elevation, it’s also the time it takes.
I’ve done over 1000m of elevation on local trails in an hour when going for it (EMTB mode, near max efforts).
I can do 1500m local loops comfortably in under 2 hours with a few of us. On normal bikes 1500m is more like 3.5/4 hours.
FWIW, the most I have got out of a 625 battery in Eco on a warm summers day (BPW for reference) was 2458m. I’ve done many a 2000m day when racing & whilst I wasn’t as fried as that, I was mentally done by that point.
can do 1500m local loops comfortably in under 2 hours
regularly ride 1500m / 5000ft+
Lol, I did a local off road ride the other day and averaged 26ft or 8 metres of ascent per mile!
For reference I regularly ride 1500m / 5000ft+ of elevation over five hours or so in the Tweed Valley, Dunkeld etc.
Last week over the Golfie I did 1586M in just over 20 miles, took 2.5 hours and still had around a third of my battery left.
Was a bit moist to which didn't help battery life.
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I did a lap of Llandegla last week with my mates on normal bikes so I kept my Rail in ECO for most of it. Think it was around 13 miles ish.
Only used 25% of the battery so I reckon a 50 mile day out is possible with a reasonable amount of climbing.
Yesterday I used 2 dots out of 5 for 500m of elevation and 28km. So yeah in the right terrain you can get plenty of miles and height.
I used 50% going up and back down snowdon at the weekend, so that 3300 feet of climbing over 9 miles, on a bosch gen4 bike with 625 Wh battery.
What ebike are you getting Nobeer??
I did 18 miles and 3300feet of climbing at Mortimer/Bringewood on my new one at the weekend and had some battery left.
I was in tour for most of it though as was a first ride for a while 😃