[Closed] Kids and helmets

Teaching them to avoiding accidents - how prey tell??

This fixation with helmets is a bit ott IMO.

When I go to the bmx track or Jump spots, none of the kids wear helmets yet I am not stepping over piles of dead bodies. Riding on the pavement is not dangerous or difficult, the chances of falling are minimal.

If I go somewhere with my son that where the chances of falling are higher we will wear helmets, otherwise we wont bother as I have confidence in his ability not to fall over 😐

If your kids happily pootle along through the park and don't really mess around, I can see why you wouldn't bother. My boys always manage to find some way of crashing - running up banks, pulling skids, racing eachother, so I personally reinforce a no helmet no bike rule. And obviously we (parents) have to back it up by doing the same ourselves. And, let's face it, most crashes I've managed (wheel in train tracks, stuck cleat) have been slow speed keel-overs where I was pretty glad of a helmet.

I really hate this liability stuff around bike vs car accidents. All the onus should be on the contributory factor of piloting a large lump of metal without due care and attention, imho, the helmet's protection generally being an insignificant factor.

If I go somewhere with my son that where the chances of falling are higher we will wear helmets

Yeah but there can always be things you haven't forseen.

I know that's always true, but for me, simple rules and habits make things easy. Go outside, put on shoes. Go on bike, put on helmet. If you don't make it an option, it stops becoming an issue.

You don't think 'oh well, I don't think I'll encounter any broken glass on the way into town so I'll just leave my shoes off' do you?

you are a parent ffs you know best!

Lolz. This forum spends about two thirds of its time complaining about how crap other people are as parents.

The strange attitude I see locally is helmeted children with bare-headed parents on the ride to school.

Perhaps the parents realise that the children are still growing and learning to ride, so are more likely to fall off? My kids wear helmets on their bikes for this reason.

But, they're getting older now and might decide that they just don't want to wear a helmet. As I'd rather my kids rode a bike without helmets than didn't ride because I insisted "no helmet = no ride", I'd let them ride without.

Postman friend of ours riding along the road, car swerves, he swerves and hits the curb at walking speed - falls off bumps head, no helmet, lost 2 days of memory. Lesson wear helmet and it wouldn't have been as bad!!

Postman friend of ours riding along the road, car swerves, he swerves and hits the curb at walking speed - falls off bumps head, no helmet, lost 2 days of memory. Lesson wear helmet and it wouldn't have been as bad!!

A bumped head at walking speed? So, we should wear helmets for walking too?

Yeah but there can always be things you haven't forseen.

If we always wanted to be prepared for every eventuality then why stop at helmets? Should I not dress my son up like this for every trip to the pump track or session in the woods? "just in case"

[url= http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7250/7677455562_1170f35384.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7250/7677455562_1170f35384.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/37621241@N05/7677455562/ ]002[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/37621241@N05/ ]ianvincent[/url], on Flickr

If we always wanted to be prepared for every eventuality then why stop at helmets? Should I not dress my son up like this for every trip to the pump track or session in the woods? "just in case"

My kids dress like that for eating their breakfast. For going to the woods, it'd be full motorbike leathers and helmet.

It's up to you how you raise your children. But if it were me i wouldn't make them wear a helmet to ride a bike on the sort of journey described.

Our lads always wear theirs - I just want to get them into the habit of putting their helmets on when ever they get on a bike.

Always

I just want to get them into the habit of putting their helmets on when ever they get on a bike.

I don't want mine to think that cycling to school or the shops is dangerous.

Are you a parent or friend - if the former then toughen up! "none too keen" - you are a parent ffs you know best! It's attitudes like that which allow peer group pressure to build up so other kids don't want to wear them because yours don't!

Rob - I can make my own decisions about my childrens health & safety, feel free to do the same for yours but please don't give me grief for taking my own decisions. For example now being older & having passed their driving tests, I don't allow them to have free access to a car, my choice & certainly not swayed by the neighbours kids all having cars of their own.

Teaching them to avoiding accidents - how prey tell??

Obviously not to do with kids but as example - guy I know refuses to ride point blank with anyone not wearing helmet but is quite happy to stop mid ride & have a swift couple of pints, his priorities don't match mine.

If something happend to one of our kids which could have been prevented or lessoned by wearing a helmet, surely nobody here would turn around and say hay ho i prefer to give my kids the freedom of choice and therefore its unfortunate but sh1t happens? There kids at the end of the day and until there adults its up to us to make sure there safe isnt it?

I make mine wear theirs at all times as i do with mine even though many rides have very little element of risk and no greater than walking.
I put my seatbe;t on to drive acroos a supermarket carpark at no more than 15 mph to the petrol station ...it is mainly habit tbh

The strange attitude I see locally is helmeted children with bare-headed parents on the ride to school

I don't want mine to think that cycling to school or the shops is dangerous

FWIW my school tried to make me sign a delcaration that my kids would always use a helmet. I asked about cars, MOT's,seatbelts and scooters and they were not interested in them nor the statistics that showed that walking was th emost likely way for them to get hurt due to being hit by a car crossing the road.

It is basic safety to do this but we should not be scared that cycling is dangerous

Mine have the "no helmet, no ride" thing drummed in and it's never a question, every ride. I'm the same - partly to set an example, before the kids I only wore helmets off road.

That said, I have no propblems with the OP's different conclusions on risk. I can see arguments on both sides, and at the end of the day I'd rather see kids riding to school sans helmet than driven there in a monster 4x4, alhough in absolute risk management terms, the big metal box beats the polystyrene hat.

I don't want mine to think that cycling to school or the shops is dangerous.

I don't think it sends that message.

I don't want them to think that getting in a car to drive to work is dangerous either. But I'll still make them buckle up.

My kids dress like that for eating their breakfast

But what do you do to protect against the possibility of them burning their lips on hot toast?

I'm just waiting till I can buy one of these in a size small, then I will be able to get a good nights sleep again. Safe in the knowledge that my little precious is totally prepared for any eventuality 🙂

[img] [/img]

If something happend to one of our kids which could have been prevented or lessoned by wearing a helmet, surely nobody here would turn around and say hay ho i prefer to give my kids the freedom of choice and therefore its unfortunate but sh1t happens? There kids at the end of the day and until there adults its up to us to make sure there safe isnt it?

I believe that the biggest killer of vehicle occupants is head injury. Do you make them wear a helmet in the car? If not, why not?

I don't think it sends that message.

Does it send the message that it's more dangerous than walking?

I don't want them to think that getting in a car to drive to work is dangerous either. But I'll still make them buckle up.

Do you make them wear a helmet in the car? If not, does that send the message that it's safer than cycling?

Always ends witht he same point being made over and over again

We each make a different risk assesment so why do this?

or i can reply with
Do you make them wear seatbelt in a car and a specail seat - it is like we have different protection equipment for different activities and you use one and not the other but we are in the wrong 😉

Do you have a stat proving head injury is the main cause BTW - never seen anything on this so what is your source?

Do you have a stat proving head injury is the main cause BTW - never seen anything on this so what is your source?

No. Hence, "I believe".

I've seen it stated in several places that we would save far more lives through compulsory car helmets than through compulsory bike helmets, which makes sense.

I believe that the biggest killer of vehicle occupants is head injury. Do you make them wear a helmet in the car? If not, why not?

Their car seats have head protectors. My seats have side airbags on all the pillars which are for my head.

The pavement has none of those things, hence helmets.

No-one things you're a nutter if you choose a car with good safety features. So why the scorn for choosing safety features for cycling? We can play this stupid game all day, coming up with twisted arguments that do nothing.

The bottom line is this. Skull on tarmac = owie, helmet on tarmac = less owie. Not ****ing rocket science is it?

Interesting article here
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/6203007/Children-under-16-should-be-forced-to-wear-cycle-helmets.html

The bottom line is this. Skull on tarmac = owie, helmet on tarmac = less owie. Not **** rocket science is it?

Do you wear one when running?

Their car seats have head protectors. My seats have side airbags on all the pillars which are for my head.

The pavement has none of those things, hence helmets.

No-one things you're a nutter if you choose a car with good safety features. So why the scorn for choosing safety features for cycling? We can play this stupid game all day, coming up with twisted arguments that do nothing.

The bottom line is this. Skull on tarmac = owie, helmet on tarmac = less owie. Not **** rocket science is it?

So would you only choose the safest car on the market, in bright yellow? If not, why not?

If i start falling when running [ or stop crashing when cycling] i will give it some though 😕

You are TJ and I see little point continuing 😛

It is a reasonable point to make that there are inconsitencies in approach to helmet wearing. I am not sure this will prove that it is not sensible to not wear one when cycling though it may prove we should wear them more often. I doubt that is your point though and I doubt anyone thinks this "debate" will chnage minds
Out of this thread

^^^^^ the attempt to suggest there is no middle ground in approaches to safety whereby you either must wear a helmet at all times or drive in a brightly coloured car or you are ....in fact i dont even know what you are trying to suggest tbh

they always end like this even without TJ - who I still miss

I fear we may end up in a situation where the majority of people think like this...
http://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/s/2092837_boy_hurt_after_becoming_impaled_on_bike
"He was very lucky – he's not going on the ramps anymore. We've bought him a PlayStation 3 so he doesn't go out.”

The fact is, children will live longer if they cycle without a helmet than if they don't cycle at all. Unlike driving, there is a health benefit to cycling.

So many of my friends seem to view exercise as a chore and not something to be enjoyed.

Bought my 6 year old a new helmet last week after the old one did its job.

And I put myself in hospital for a week with a cycling head injury when I was ten (before helmets were common place).

I'll let you guess my views on this one...

children will live longer if they cycle without a helmet than if they don't cycle at all.

It may be beter for society that more people cycle and helmet compulsion may deter them from cycling.

That point has no impact on whether it is safer for me/others/children to wear a helmet or not when cycling.
That point is also debatable as we have done many times

Ok work calls thankfullly ...must ressit

Same as me igm. I had a massive off a couple of years ago. Smashed my face up, and ended my lucrative modelling career, with all the stitches. The surgeon who glued my face back together said that had I not had a helmet on I'd have probably be in with serious head injuries, a fractured skull or worse

I have no reason to think he was being overly melodramatic. So I would think my opinion on the subject is similar to yours

So would you only choose the safest car on the market, in bright yellow? If not, why not?

I did choose a 5* car yes, yellow was not available but colour is a consideration.

This whole 'yeah but..' thing is just clutching at straws. It's just not an issue in our house. We wear helmets, that's what we do. One day it might save our lives, that's good enough for me.

My kids are so young that they're now conditioned to it - so there's absolutely no issue at all.

Last week threr was all that fuss about kids climbing trees,how they should be allowed and how it was a symptom of the nanny state that they were not. Do you make your kids wear helmets and harnesses every time they climb trees, they might fall out and land on their head.

The answer is probably not if they are only 5 or 6 ft up (like riding on the footpath to school) but yes if they are 20ft up (like riding something where you might crash and hurt yourself). Its this weird double standard that gets me.

If i start falling when running [ or stop crashing when cycling] i will give it some though

To be fair, for adults, if you ride down a flat road, you're probably no more likely to fall off a bike than you are to trip over when running.

I'd usually wear one because I'm a baldy and it avoids sunburn and keeps my head warmer in winter. If I forgot it I wouldn't skip the ride though (and I'd happily ride a Boris Bike or a Paris Velib without one).

Our daughter wears a helmet when cycling, because she is a)more likely to fall over than me anyway, and b)more likely to do jump her bike off something mentalist without considering the consequences or her skill level. We've seen a few helmet whacks already, she's crashed hard on mud and going off kerbs, and her best friend had a comedy crash where she hammered down a steep bit of singletrack completely out of control and crashed straight into a tree.

'I don't want mine to think that cycling to school or the shops is dangerous.'

It isn't dangerous, but it is potentially dangerous. I want my kids to be able to assess risk for themselves eventually.

Being able to manage risk is one of the attractions of mountaineering, rock climbing, winter climbing and MTBing for me - all about safely and stylishly travelling through a potentially dangerous environment or situation. I could do all these without a helmet on, but for most of them there is enough risk to manage without adding to it. (I have two trashed cycling and one trashed climbing helmets at home which would back this up - one of the cycling helmets trashed while on a ride to the shops.)

As my lads seem to be keen to get involved in adventurous activities I think it's important to foster good habits - don't climb / ride without a helmet, doen't get in our canoe without a boyancy aid etc. When they can assess real risk for themselves, (research shows this is often as late as late teens due to brain development,) they can start to choose the precautions they wish to take based on an informed decision, (maybe climbing with / without a rope in certain cercumstances for instance.)

I see just as much risk to spines and collar bones although I am biased by a family member being paralysed MTBing. I am beginning to wonder if lightweight back/collar bone protection is not as important as a helmet. Caught a bit of Badminton HT over the weekend and started looking at lightweight horse riding back protection. Has not got rip-off MTB pricing but hard to see if it is fit for purpose.

Completely illogical given the hits my head has taken MTBing but I still love the odd ride with the wind in the hair!

Odd how skateboarding has gone from you must wrap your kids up completely to no protection at all these days?

The answer is probably not if they are only 5 or 6 ft up (like riding on the footpath to school) but yes if they are 20ft up (like riding something where you might crash and hurt yourself).

Mm yeah but there usually aren't any other tree-users over which you don't have control.

I see just as much risk to spines and collar bones although I am biased by a family member being paralysed MTBing.

I think I'd rather have spine trauma than severe head trauma, and I'd definitely trade a broken collarbone for a brain injury.

I am beginning to wonder if lightweight back/collar bone protection is not as important as a helmet.

Possibly. If I were heading out to the Alps proper I'd look seriously at some back protection. They also do camelbaks with some spine protection, which seems very sensible to me as you're usually wearing one anyway.

The closest I have seen to date is the pod version. But atomic do a ski one that was very light.

I did choose a 5* car yes, yellow was not available but colour is a consideration.

This whole 'yeah but..' thing is just clutching at straws. It's just not an issue in our house. We wear helmets, that's what we do. One day it might save our lives, that's good enough for me.

There are all sorts of precautions you can take that *might* save your life. Evidence that a helmet will do so is mixed to say the least.

I've no problem with helmet wearing (I do and so will my daughter) but the idea that not doing so is irresponsible is utter guff.

It is a reasonable point to make that there are inconsitencies in approach to helmet wearing. I am not sure this will prove that it is not sensible to not wear one when cycling though it may prove we should wear them more often. I doubt that is your point though and I doubt anyone thinks this "debate" will chnage minds

I think people might get a little annoyed that allowing children to ride a bike without a helmet is described as "criminal" and then in terms of not caring about children. So, the debates don't often go well.

I say debates, but it can hardly be classed as such.

There are all sorts of precautions you can take that *might* save your life.

I take many of them too. My life is worth saving I feel.

I don't consider it a major problem to wear a helmet. And by having my kids wear them automatically, they won't think twice about it either.

All pro and no con, in my view.

Mm yeah but there usually aren't any other tree-users over which you don't have control.

You could get attacked by an evil squirrel, you never know! gotta be prepared.

I say debates, but it can hardly be classed as such.

.
Personally I think they work best in stopping a bad injury being a really bad injury rather than saving your life - like binners eg above of which i have one myself.

FWIW I dont expect it to save my kids lifes at the speed they ride currently but it may stop a bad injury being a terrible one and yes we could say that about lots of things.

Be the change you want to see rather than be dragged down to their level

Perhaps by linking to [url= http://www.cyclehelmets.org/1236.html ]a whole load of referenced data which seems to indicate that there is no evidence of any reduction in serious injuries despite a large increase in helmet wearing by cyclists since the mid 1980s[/url]?