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“you can still pump and generate speed on a 26er”
For sure, I’m just surprised at how better the 29” wheels carry speed over those bits whilst still pumping well, and that’s vs 27.5”.
“we need to have a ‘techy bit’ amnesty in stanmer and re-instate all teh rooty bits on trails and cover up the (many) ride-arounds that now appear to be the main line.”
Yes! Although the alternate lines down Tea & Cake made for an excellent overtake last night!
You've inspired me to a Friday moxie ride. Lovely!
I too went from a (2013, 16") Soul to mine. Although via a year or so of not much hardtail riding. I loved the Soul very much and rode the same trails but it was of a different time. And to be fair it's not really like for like in their intended purposes. I've kept the frame, the bit of give in it was just such a joy, also its lightness.
Yeah, I had a similar vintage Soul, was a lovely thing, I have that pointless regret about selling it despite knowing I'd never ride it now because it was too small and wheels have moved on.
Tea & Cake - i've still never ridden down this! in 25yrs of biking locally you would have thought i'd have given it a go by now! haha! have walked up/down it loads with teh kids.
“Tea & Cake – i’ve still never ridden down this! in 25yrs of biking locally you would have thought i’d have given it a go by now!”
Sacrilege! It’s 50% tight twisty singletrack, 50% memory test. If you can get to the bottom at full speed without ending up in the historic water catcher, out on the road or deep into the undergrowth then you’re doing well!
Missed last night's ride but I should get a photo of my "new" bike with your Moxie. It's pretty far away from your Moxie on the SSpectrum
“ Missed last night’s ride but I should get a photo of my “new” bike with your Moxie. It’s pretty far away from your Moxie on the SSpectrum”
I spotted it on Strava - looks fast uphill and “exciting” downhill! Sadly I won’t be out tomorrow because my wife has the audacity to have a social life…
What an excellent bike!
at last! better pics pls, and more musings - was following with interest - front too high with 160 or ok?
I’ve had some great rides on the Moxie in the last few weeks: Surrey Hills singletrack, South Downs XC and a frozen ground night ride in Stanmer’s Singletrack.
I really really like this bike!
Took a volume spacer out of the fork so it now has none, and I’m using plenty of the 160mm travel. I was thinking about how ride it and I really do stay pretty central much of the time and then it’s just a case of pushing and pulling with the arms and pushing with the feet as needed. With all that travel up front there’s still quite a lot of travel at my feet, even when the back is smacking into stuff.
It’s very happy just pedalling places, cruising the trails or being ragged round the turns and getting air to the best of my ability. And being a singlespeed, attacking the climbs like I want them over as soon as possible!
I guess the ideal climbing position would involve lower bars - I’m running 40mm rise and one spacer under the stem - but I’ve got used to that standing hauling repeated single-leg deadlift max torque climbing position. And with the grips where they are it feels like it works on trails of all gradients, both down and up.
Got out to Friston Forest which is lots of nice singletrack that’s mostly flowy with some steep bombholes. Proper greasy now the frost has gone but so much fun!
I know these big forked hardtails (especially singlespeed) are never the fastest bike in any situation but they really are fun. I was saying to a mate on the ride that they’re a bit like old V8 muscle cars - unsubtle, not slow, often sideways, and require the pilot to do plenty of work to keep them pointed in the right direction. And these modern ones with their LLS geometry are so confidence inspiring and easy to drift.
Also, I’d like to celebrate the Hillbilly front tyre (I have a new T9 one on this bike and a T7 on the other bike) and I’ve been using these as my front tyres for years, apart from the odd stint with a Magic Mary. I’ve never come across a tyre that is so good at catching itself when the front wheel has stepped out sideways.
Continuing my diary of life with a deeply illogical but brilliantly fun bike, rather than start a thread of fork musings…
So during that trip to the bombholes I wound on more fork LSC to stop it plunging on the g-outs. And then this spring/summer I firmed up the suspension on my Levo to help me jump better, more support and pop - the Levo has a basic shock so I upped the pressure and added LSC and HSC (and maybe some air) to the fork too.
So that’s led me to experimenting more with the Moxie’s Lyrik and last week in the dry (hurrah!) conditions trying to go fast on the singletrack I ended up with the LSC all the way on, so max support when pumping and popping, holding up better when loading the fork in turns, but the HSC fully open so it could use the travel when hitting anything hard or landing bigger. Felt really good!
The week before it was very greasy, fresh and continuous rain on the same trails made for v slippery roots so I had the tyres a few psi lower and the LSC about halfway open. Nice to be able to just click the LSC back and forth to find the grip/support balance for slippery or not trails.
Looking at the psi chart for the Lyrik I’m running it about where they recommend (80psi-ish vs 105 in the Levo but it’s C1 vs B2 air spring) which is giving about 20-25% sag (so hard to measure on a long slack hardtail) but as it’s a 160mm fork that’s pretty plush compared to other hardtails.
So I’m thinking this approach of softer air spring plus firm LSC and soft HSC should mean decent flat and uphill geometry (less slackening) and less pedal bob, less steepening when pointed downhill or pumping a corner, but good use of travel when you need to use it. Almost like the inputs from your hands are resisted but once your feet add more load then the platform opens up to take out the sting on landing.
One other musing - I see a lot of XC bikes are now moving to 120mm forks, including some XC hardtails. I know there’s a school of thought that believes longer travel hardtails don’t make sense because of the fluctuations in geometry through the travel - but if an XC bike has 120mm of travel, is 30 or 40mm or even 50mm more travel on a long slack burly hardtail so strange?
120 to 160 is only 33% more travel and you’re probably running more % sag (say 25 vs 20%) so the actual extra travel vs the sag point is maybe 25mm more.
I have spent this season messing about with softer springs and firmer low speed compression, but it's not for me.
I find it feels really good for smoother, dare I say -built- trails. But it suffers from reduced compliance and thus grip in the natural, unpredictable stuff that I mostly ride.
I found myself gravitating back to a fork and shock with a firmer spring, faster rebound, reasonable high speed compression and not very much low speed compression.
Within that generally, my shocks are slower and a bit softer than my forks. I do find on steeper, steppier descents, my set up does dive a bit. That's when I crank up the low speed compression.
I also have a new skool HT with longish forks at 150mm. I agree with the geometry change concept, but it's an overstated factor in my
How are you managing the diving on the steeps? Have you set your forks up with decent ramp up?
Having been quite ignorant of them in the past, I'm also a massive fan of new school/hardcore hardtails.
They're just so versatile. I've taken mine to a bike park, touring and riding enduro trails in Scotland and am planning on doing the Great North Trail on mine. It's not perfect for any of them, but it's great fun on all of them.
I've got 140mm forks on my Ragley Marley and it's pretty confidence inspiring down most things. I've not found dive to be a particular problem.
“I found myself gravitating back to a fork and shock with a firmer spring, faster rebound, reasonable high speed compression and not very much low speed compression.”
Are you using a coil fork? Which one?
I’m on a Lyrik RC2 with Charger 2.1 and C1 air spring. I’ve taken out all the tokens but being a 160mm air Lyrik it still ramps. I don’t find the tokens do much to stop diving as that’s more of a mid than end stroke thing.
Although I’m rarely riding on official trails I guess they’re a mix of natural stuff and DIY trails plus many smaller jumps /drops and the odd berm.
What I’ve noticed with the increased LSC is that I can load the front harder to find grip, but how hard I go with the LSC and how forward I get depends on how grippy the trails are that day.
It's tricky because we're different riders riding different places in different ways. So it's always going to be apples/oranges.
I ride alot of rooty, slippery limestone with clay and place a premium on small bump traction because it's difficult to get it back once it's gone and moving.
I'm running a Fox 36 grip2 at 150mm. Back with an air spring equipped with a trutune flow after trying a Push coil kit. That certainly felt nice on the little stuff but wasn't really much different hauling ass when it mattered, and was harder to manage dive/ bottom out without the flexibility of an air spring.
I think you're right about loading the fork. I'm fairly heavy, so I should think that exacerbates dive when riding like that. I have a 38 on the big bike and that's a brilliantly supportive fork compared to the 36, but its a bit too much for the HT!