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Hi,
Ive been thinking of getting one but my knowledge is limited. I’m lucky in that for the first time, budget is not really a factor. I’d rather not spaff a fortune, but I can talk myself into it.
What I do know:
I don’t want a carbon frame.
Something with between 140-170 travel.
Light(ish) but full power.
Mullet maybe but 29 would work.
It will be used mostly on natural trails, from mild to aggro.
I’ve been hard on bikes in the past so tough and reliable as possible. Not just motor but everything. Or has good backup
Not asking much am I?
Now here’s the tricky bit 😂 I’ll need a test ride so Canyon/YT and the like are out. Since CRC went pop there aren’t too many bike shops where I lived. I like the look of the new Levo but the nicer ones are carbon. There are two local dealers, neither of which have came back to me regarding size queries/test ride. I’m also 6.4. I don’t know anyone my size to try theirs out.
Any suggestions?
dont know where you are but YT do demo/hire from their surrey hills location and possibly others.
while alu ebikes certainly exist putting a big hole in the downtube is a structural application well suited to carbon especially if you also want "light"
I have a Lapierre, which is absolutely brilliant, but friends have the Amflow and I would give that a serious look. The support appears to be excellent and it’s a great package. As a set up, I would look at 170 mm forks and (definitely for you) an extra volume shock. They have a list for the latter that fit, as not all do. Places like Trailhead in Shrewsbury will do test rides for a cost, then knock that off if you purchase the bike. I think it was MBR who made theirs a mullet and highly recommended that… 🙂
How many kg is lightish?
Alu frame + full power ebike is unlikely to be my definition of lightish, so what's your definition.
I’ll need a test ride so Canyon/YT and the like are out.
Canyon have a couple of "partner stores" where you can demo the actual bikes. One in Sheffield, one in South London:
The Sheffield one is actually hosting a demo day this Saturday. I went to their opening weekend special thing where they had all sorts of demos and guided rides (and free pizza!), was very good. I have a Canyon road bike, I didn't just go for the pizza... 😉
But anyway, it's certainly possible to demo the bikes. I think they're due to open 2 more shops later this year.
Sorry I know light and e-bike without carbon is a misnomer. 23-24kg?
I almost impulse bought the Amflow, breaking my own rules so declined. If it has adjustable geo, and all the fancy bits of the carbon version on the Ali I’m might even just wing it. But even a cheap e-bike is a lot of money to by blind
Northern Ireland for location.
If I HAD to buy an e-bike now.... I would be looking very closely at the Nicolai Saturn MGU...
Fits your use case great, as to your requirements... its not light, and it is a fortune....
But I recon I could convince myself I would save a fortune on cassettes chains and maintenance....
Or the HiBike one that has just come out/been announced
But, its 1st gen pinion mgu tech, not widely available etc.
So me, I am planning on waiting for the dust to settle, see what the 2nd gen looks like....
Sorry I know light and e-bike without carbon is a misnomer. 23-24kg?
I do wonder if relative lightness - which is what we're talking here - really makes a huger difference once you get over 20k or so. I don't actually know the answer to that one, but given the choice, with an e-mtb, I'd rather have reassuringly robust components than fixate on saving a kilo or so. Also highly relative in this context is reliability. Fwiw, Specialized does have a great reputation for customer service, arguably because some of their earlier Brose motors were so prone to breaking.
I know it's counter intuitive, but it might be useful to just ride an e-mtb, any e-mtb, to get a better feel for what you're dealing with generally.
Why no Carbon?
In the spirit of recommending what you own, can I draw your attention to the 2025 Mondraker Crafty:
First Ride: Mondraker Crafty Carbon 2025 – New Motor, New Formula - Pinkbike
Check which motors have the best spares back up and reliability. This was Bosch when I bought mine. Get the bike with that motor
Why no Carbon?
I wouldn’t go carbon again , or maybe just not Orbea? They transmit every single slight bloody creak / rattle etc
IMO once you get through all the marketing BS e-bikes all weigh roughly the same depending on whether you want a light weight XC bike or a more DH orientated bike. Because your already carrying more weight ie battery and motor you may as well get sturdy kit
Demo day is a must, but I think many have been and gone this year
I do wonder if relative lightness - which is what we're talking here - really makes a huger difference once you get over 20k or so
Having just bought (hang on I'll get it from the blurb) yeah "the lightest full power mountain bike ever” - a Moterra SL and having something to directly compare it to (a Moterra non-SL) it does make a massive difference! BUT! Only really when moving the bike about in the garage, or putting it on the bike stand and working on it, or putting it in the car.. Not really when riding. The Moterra (non-SL) (is for sale! 😀 ) and is just as much fun (fun!) to ride. Just in a slightly different way.
And just to counter FunkyDunc - Get an Orbea Wild. I adore mine.
Only really when moving the bike about in the garage, or putting it on the bike stand and working on it, or putting it in the car.. Not really when riding.
This is so true. When i move mine around in the shed i'm thinking "christ this is heavy", but out on the trails it doesn't cross my mind other than it actually feels more planted and stable. So much so i take it to dyfi and prefer it to my LLS 140/150 trail bike.
Nobody ever rode around on a BMW GS1200 and said they wished they had a vespa cos its lighter.
I’m of the opinion that the battery and motor are so heavy that it’s (mostly) pointless to worry about weight.
get the bike that rides best, has the best motor/battery combo.
definitely consider the reliability issues, there are enough people who have had issues to make that essential. Although, I have one, and my wife is on her second one, with no issues whatsoever over a few thousand miles.
I, personally, wouldn’t be bothered about carbon, saving 1kg when a bike weighs 24kg is only going to be noticeable on a set of scales.
Sorry I know light and e-bike without carbon is a misnomer. 23-24kg?
I almost impulse bought the Amflow, breaking my own rules so declined. If it has adjustable geo, and all the fancy bits of the carbon version on the Ali I’m might even just wing it. But even a cheap e-bike is a lot of money to by blind
Northern Ireland for location.
You do know both version of the Amflow are Carbon (no Ali version) ?
I just took delivery of the lower spec version 2 weeks back and it's a lot of bike for the money. Only been out for one spin on it so far. Really impressed with it.
Lots of replies, thank you.
Location is Northern Ireland.
Id love a gearbox/belt drive bike. The likes of Geometron or Nicolai would be a dream. Getting test ride however…
Levo is a possibility but dealers seem reluctant to sell or even stock them in any size.
Ease of maintenance is a big plus, as is service/backup. Spesh tick another box.
No carbon due to not wanting to have to buy a new frame if it fell over, I dropped it and cracked the frame. I’m sure they ride nice.
Weight was more about lifting about rather than riding.
My mistake, I thought the cheaper amflow was alloy, with heavier parts. Only glanced a the pic. Odd to paint a carbon frame silver coloured tho 🧐
I think I should maybe move house 😆
I’ve ridden a lower end hardtail emtb before, was pretty grim apart from the motor. That may also have been poor, I just have no reference.
The e-bike shootouts all say the orbea is great, as are canyons, and pretty much all the big brands. But I really need test rides for fit and for comparisons.
Id not thought about noise/rattle etc.
A customer build perhaps, again test ride gaaah!!
What about Whyte? I hear they have a store in the country.
Only really when moving the bike about in the garage, or putting it on the bike stand and working on it, or putting it in the car.. Not really when riding.
Nobody ever rode around on a BMW GS1200 and said they wished they had a vespa cos its lighter.
Or even a BMW GS R1150..... me, old school.
Sorry, I’m googling anywhere here for shops. Seems there’s more mtb shops that I thought
HAIbike ? Allmtn range, a mix of engines, frame material. Never heard of the brand?
Lapier? Wide choice, mostly Bosch.
Scott too.
Must to check out some reviews. Rabbit hole here I come
I’m in NI, and I bought a Mondraker Neat from Norm’s bikes in belfast. Im not an expert, but I’d definitely recommend buying from a shop which you know can offer decent local support.
After a year of putting more miles on my Neat than any other bike I’ve ever owned, I’d buy exactly the same thing again. But that’s because I wanted a lightweight e-bike which rides and feels just like a normal bike. But I understand that many people want more power. In that case, I’d go for a Crafty. Mondraker also have a Sly, which is the new Bosch motor with a aluminium frame. And still lighter than many other e-bikes.
i know that we all tend to recommend that we have. But im about to head off on an uplift weekend in Wales. So there is absolutely no need to take my e-bike. But my obscenely expensive 150/160mm full susser will be staying at home because my 150-160mm Mondraker feels so much better than any other bike I’ve ever ridden - whether it has a motor or not.
Johnhe, were you able to test before buying. I know Niall, he services my bikes and I’d love to throw my wealth 😛 his way.
Been out of the local scene for a few years tho. Lots of the old roadie shops doing mtb now too. Maybe it’s cause CRC are away. Good news 😀
Merida e160 875? Alu frame.
I have a Whyte E160 RSX and can definitely recommend. Fantastic geometry, the weight actually makes it a better bike, Bosch motor, I have had over 5k trouble free miles out of mine since 2023. I just can't stop riding it!
Ok so I’ve narrowed it down to maybe 10 🤣
Once Ive narrowed it by who will let me at least sit on one, or at least replies to my comms I’ll report back. TBH, the Haibike shop is in Lisburn. They’re off the list already thanks to their nazi traffic wardens 🤣
As someone who has recently gone through your decision making pain, I can highly recommend the Whyte Evo Elyte Stag (in red). Hands down the best bike I have ever owned for overall fun. I will have to take a different view than those that say weight doesn't matter as I had the opportunity to do a side by side with a Alu whyte e160, and the difference was significant. A friend has also done a direct comparison with his Trek Rail, I think it was a rail, big thing anyway, and said the same thing.
It might not tick the travel box that you are looking for, but I also ride a BIRD AM9 with 160 Zeb and coil, and the Whyte more than manages the same BPW and FoD hammering that the BIRD gets.
I bought the Whyte based on reviews and, erm, reviews, but I did test ride a YT Decoy SN prior to buying the Whyte, and actually placed an order for it. The order fell through, and I am so glad. The YT was a lovely bike, but the addition of the CX motor on the Whyte and the light frame, plus the range extender option, means I have a bike that can flex between solo power hours without the extender, and keep up with full fat mates with the addition of the extender.
I am not sure there are many bad ebikes out there from the big brands, but the Whyte just seems to deliver in all areas. I love it.
@feed was it hard getting hold of the Amflow. A mate paid for one in February and is still waiting. I assume you are in the uk
Take the comments that weight is weight is weight where ebikes are concerned with a pinch of salt...
My Kenevo in current guise is around 28kgs - started off around 25kgs, but now has Fox 38's, Hope Fortus 30's, big Eddy Current tyres (2.8 rear) with meaty tubes and a range extender. The weight has never really bothered me - tricky stiles can be a pig, but always coped. And on the trail, as many have said, you don't really notice it - and it totally plows downhill.
But I decided I wanted something a bit more trailsy, so got a Levo 160/150 travel vs 180 on the Kenevo - 22kg claimed, 23kg with my pedals and Cushcore.
There's a big difference - even compared to the Kenevo's original 25kg. So much more playful and as fast if not faster on most of the stuff I ride - that's not to mention getting it over stiles and gates. I still ride the Kenevo and enjoy it - I'm sure on the rockiest descents and biggest drops it would still trump the Levo. For 95% of my riding, I'd take the Levo every time though - and that's not just the newness factor.
Don't buy a Haibike Allmtn - as heavy as the Kenevo and a million times fuglier. Great spec though
HAIbike ? Allmtn range, a mix of engines, frame material. Never heard of the brand?
Been doing ebikes for the european market for a long time
@minus-6: Yes, Niall let me try a bike for a few days. But, to be fair, it was his old bike. So it wasn’t a brand new bike. I’m not sure if he has demo bikes.
Myself and Norm are similar sized, how was his for fit? (assuming you too are a lanky git).
What size was he riding and what did you go for? I’ve generally sized down in the past but my most newest bike is old in terms to reach/slackness.
I’ve seen quite a few ugly bikes this evening, bottom of the USP barrel and in gentleman’s colours too boot.
@feed was it hard getting hold of the Amflow. A mate paid for one in February and is still waiting. I assume you are in the uk
I'm in Dublin (ROI), there aren't any dealers stocking them in ROI but this crowd ship from Germany www.ebike24.com, When I ordered it (about 6 weeks back) the site said it'd ship in 5 business weeks, maybe someone cancelled an order but it arrived 2 weeks after I ordered it.
My buying strategy for my first E-bike would be
1. Locate a local (as it close enough that taking a bike back there isn't going to be a chore) bike shop that you can trust. Either known to you or recommended by riding buddies.
2. See what brands they offer or can get through their distributers (sometimes they don't stock brands although they may be able to source them for you)
3. Personally I would be looking for a bike first and foremost with a Bosch motor and battery system.
4. Size of battery not a big issue with Bosch system as you will be able to use a range extender. So don't be put off by new range of bikes with "only" 600W batteries.
5. Avoid bikes with known issues or propreitry hardware. Easy to service with as standard componentry as possible is king.
If you do folow these steps you may find the choice is made for you lol. No idea what but have fun looking. And unless you are a absolute shredder than there are probably no really bad E-bike choices out there anyway.
You can get an alloy Levo in the newest version. I’m still on a second gen alloy one, it’s been great and having LBS support has been reassuring, although it’s only had one motor/electrics issue in over six years.
You can normally try-before-you-buy ebikes from Decathlon, might be worth a look if there's a store nearby
I know Niall, he services my bikes and I’d love to throw my wealth 😛 his way.
Came here to recommend you speak to Niall (who is equally lanky if not more so!) and get your leg over a Mondraker...
Don't worry about the front triangle (on the latest Crafty) being carbon... It's a non issue. More than strong enough.
Loving mine... Absolutely epic bike!
Find the most local Gen3 Levo Comp Alloy in the sale. I don't doubt the Gen4 is more excellent, but the Gen 3 is excellent and at very good prices.
Amazing chaps, thanks muchly for the advice/opinions.
Am I being silly not wanting a carbon frame? The lower spec bikes (with alu or carbon/alu combo frameset) all have parts I’d prefer not to buy. And I don’t want to be stripping/selling parts to upgrade straight away.
Eg Whyte Kado - I want the top spec but with alu frame - nope!
Levo - ditto, sworks but in alu - nope!
Etc.
I need beefy forks and strong wheels.
It’s severely limiting my options.
Niall is too busy selling, riding and raising children - his website has cobwebs 🤣
Also, some brands offer lifetime warranty on carbon frames. Would that cover the bike falling and hitting a rock and getting damaged. Or is it just manu defects?
Amazing chaps, thanks muchly for the advice/opinions.
Am I being silly not wanting a carbon frame? The lower spec bikes (with alu or carbon/alu combo frameset) all have parts I’d prefer not to buy. And I don’t want to be stripping/selling parts to upgrade straight away.
Eg Whyte Kado - I want the top spec but with alu frame - nope!
Levo - ditto, sworks but in alu - nope!
Etc.
I need beefy forks and strong wheels.
It’s severely limiting my options.
Niall is too busy selling, riding and raising children - his website has cobwebs 🤣
Carbons fine for a frame IMO, and as you say if you want a complete bike with high end parts sometimes you have no choice but to get the carbon framed version,so by excluding carbon frame you will end up ruling out a lot of choices.
I've had more Alu frames fail than carbon ones.
Have you thought about second hand. Our latest gen 3 Turbo Levos have been. You can transfer the Specialized warranty between owners. All our bikes are carbon and get alot of abuse. I wouldn't go back to alloy
Just get the best carbon Gen 3 Levo you can find. You won't be disappointed.
That said, I seem to think some of the Alu models have a better spec than some of the carbons
I bagged my S-Works at a £5k discount but I don't think there are many about now
Cotic e-rocket?
Ticks all your boxes, any build you like, brilliant back up, not American for those of us with principles and if you don't like it return it within 30 days for a full refund.
I’ve got a manual Cotic, my type of frame material, love how it rides. It’s pre longshot geo, would definitely buy another.
However, and this applies to end of line bargains and second hand, I need a test ride if I’m spending this much. Bought a large Spesh secondhand, I thought it was a perfect fit, until I bought a new Rocketmax xl.
It’s too much to spend without at least sitting on the blooming thing 😆
Ps the 30 day return thing is great if you live on the same island. Cy was charging 100 delivery last time and that was before recent inflation.
I had a day on an SL and was convinced that was the answer. 6 months later I had a morning on my mates old Whyte 160 and couldn't believe how little the weight mattered (riding wise).
Like you, I have chosen alloy, as I have witnessed a lad write his brand new carbon Stumpy rear end off after a little tumble into some rocks. It seems to me that the added weight makes this scenario more likely.
I have followed the rules and bought one from a shop I can return it to and chosen a brand with a good rep for warranty. The added plus being that the e-bike repair centres can buy all the parts to keep it going and do a full rebuild, better than new for less than £400.
Personally, whereas I can really appreciate a beautiful hardtail, I struggle to find any passion for e-bikes so looks were irrelevant.
So I chose an alloy Gen 3 Levo as they had a discount and enough adjustment that as long I got the right size I knew it would ride just fine.
2 1/2 months later and I don't regret my decision one bit. Its an ugly old thing but boy does it add a lot of pleasure to my life.
I have carried on riding my Airdrop and my hardtail but I now love going for 2 - 3hr ride then coming home to walk the dog, grab some food, than do it all again on the Levo 🙂
My only regret so far is that I haven't found the time to bob over to Wharncliffe or Win Hill, life keeps conspiring against me one way or the other but I have lots of fun within riding distance so life ain't bad.
So, I say, don't overthink it, follow the basic rules and get one bought but don't stop riding your riding your old bike, you might regret that.
Just to add, from a battery, power perspective, your bodyweight and fitness it seems are just as important.
On the days that we hired SL's up the Golfie. I started with 150% battery (range extender). By 1pm the first big lad on his full fat was down to 1 bar and heading back to his van. The other one went into the red around 3pm when mine was reading 42%.
I also recently had the pleasure of showing a friend my local trails, me on the Levo, him on his Amflow. We didn't hang around, the pace was fast and by the end of it the scores on the doors were Levo 20%, Amflow 11%. He had his in Auto. For reference, he is heavier than me and needs an e-bike due to a lung issue.
He could have put in Super Turbo and left me behind at any point but that 11% wouldn't last long...
I say all this, not in the I'm fitter than you sense, more in the bear this in mind.
He loves his Amflow by the way, I don't think you'd regret one of those either 🙂