Demo rides - or the lack of them.

Why on earth would I spend money with Ribble???

As someone who's never demo'd a bike in his life - do you like the geometry, build, features, frame construction and price?

do you like the geometry, build, features, frame construction and price

But they don't tell the full story of how a bike feels when you ride it. When I got my trail bike I tested several bikes that had similar specs but they were all quite different in feel.

I'd compare it to the three other gravel cross bikes I've owned* and then decide based on spec.

Which is how I've owned a PX, and now a Vitus (from CRC) among those three.

The first was shop bought, I grant you and I had, ooh, maybe 5 mins in the carpark for sizing.

* Modern. I had a proper CX bitd but the less said the better, I have blanked those days out mainly 😉

Whereas I can't actually remember the last bike I bought without at least taking it up and down the street. Possibly the 2002 Turner RFX frame I bought secondhand in 2004...?

You can tell a lot from a geometry chart, but far from all. Things like do my heels catch on the stays. How does the whole package hang together. You can approximate handling from a chart, but that can change quite a bit depending on finishing kit dimensions and you certainly can't tell how it rides.

I can't tell how a frame is built remotely, or the fine detail of the construction.

(case in point - my last summer road bike, I demoed various things - PlanetX, Condor, Cannondale and eventually Enigma. By the time I was out the carpark I knew the Enigma was the one. It just felt RIGHT and 8 years later I still love it.)

Its also about how the company interacts with its customers. If they're willing to put some effort in to make a sale, it feels like they'll look after you afterwards. If they just want to shift units with minimal customer interaction, how's the post-sales back up going to be?

Would you buy a car without driving it first? I wouldn't.

thepurist
Full Member

But they don’t tell the full story of how a bike feels when you ride it. When I got my trail bike I tested several bikes that had similar specs but they were all quite different in feel.

Indeed. So that's why you weigh up what you know with the price you're willing to pay given that risk

Dunno if Ribble have sorted out that financial wobble with their late accounts, as to whether they are a risk to spend with.

But personally I've never warmed to their customer service approach and their recent aspirational pricing isn't convincing either, so I'd still say follow your instinct on that one.

If you have some flexibility in your requirements, there must be some good deals to be had at the mo?

Indeed. So that’s why you weigh up what you know with the price you’re willing to pay given that risk

...and given this is a couple of £k for a frameset, then risk is significantly outweighing knowledge. No thanks.

If you have some flexibility in your requirements, there must be some good deals to be had at the mo

Part of the problem is that I'm pretty pernickety with what I want:-
-Needs to take 700x45 bare minimum.
-Light and climbs nicely. (which my Fugio isn't/doesn't)
-Prefer slightly slacker HA (70-71)
-Kinda would prefer metal, but have never owned a carbon bike, so tempted - esp. as Ti can be a bit cracky and everyone
seems to weld internal cable ports into gravel frames at the point of highest stress.
-After a reach that's heading towards 400mm, actual stack around 600mm but a seat tube that's closer to 500mm to allow for
stand over and a dropper. A lot of frames are quite square in that ST length mirrors TT length. The 56 Stigmata I
borrowed felt AMAZING to ride, but 545 seat tube left the top tube very much too close and very little room for a
dropper.

Current favourite is a Salsa Warbird. 575mm TT, 510mm ST, 390mm reach, 603mm stack, 71 HA, 45mm tyres.
A Giant Revolt Advanced Pro was also on the list, but crossed off after the warranty debacle thread on here...

Cotic do demos from the door and I believe are gearing up to do tours with the demo fleet. Worth a look to see if an Escapade or Cascade would be a good fit.

I've done MANY Cotic demos - one of the reasons I own a lot of Cotics (and they're just over the hill from me).

I've tried a Cascade - I think they look great, but really didn't gel with it. Too much mountianbike bias, not enough roadbike, but you couldn't really get the full benefit of the ruftytuftiness of it without fitting a sus fork, and then you're into hardtail territory.

Escapade goes a little far the other way - great all-road bike, but not really gravel (compromised on 700C tyre clearance if nothing else). My winter roadie is a sample Escapadish variant frame, so I'm pretty familiar with them.

I've bought at least three bikes that I had lusted after only to find they were horrible to ride.
Each time it's that sinking feeling that I've made a mistake, followed by the build up to having to explain to the wife that another bike needs to be bought and the frustration of losing hundreds selling the old bike second hand.
I find I can tell pretty much instantly if I like a bike just riding it up and down the road.

Annoyingly I'm in the same situation now looking at a jump bike.
I could love it, I could hate it, it might be the same as my current bike, just a different colour.
Only spend £100's will tell me!

Demo on a Sonder last week. My old RX9 is more fun and lighter so saved some cash!

One of the other options is a Ribble Gravel Ti. I’ve just been in contact with them (no email address, no phone number – Whatsapp or live chat only), and they don’t offer demos, only a sit on a bike jig if I visit them.

Why on earth would I spend money with Ribble???

I'm guessing that (from reading comments about lead times) they are making to order

I’m guessing that (from reading comments about lead times) they are making to order

Nope. They have a Gravel Ti, in the right size, built up and in the Clitheroe showroom, but I'm not allowed to ride it up and down the street.

I would certainly recommend a test ride on a CGR Ti. I'm bang in the middle of the size range for my frame size, but I think it's too big. I have a short stem on it and there is not as much seatpost showing as I would expect, plus I have little stand over room.

Really need to be on top of your geometry if not doing a test ride. Bought a second hand rigid bike with a top tube 5mm longer than my main bike, turns out it's too long as the seat tube is 2deg slacker - had to buy a Thomson bent seatpost and bit it backwards to reduce the saddle-bar distance.

When I bought my main bike I "demoed" an Orbea Occam via a trail centre hire, presumably this avenue isn't available for gravel/road bikes.

Also had Bird and Cotic demos. Found it really valuable if it's been so long since last buying a bike that things have moved on so much that geometry and suspension tech is incomparable, or when trying a different class of bike like gravel having not ridden a drop bar before.

in over 40 years of cycling, and more bikes than i care or dare to remember, i have never had a test ride.

do you like the look of the bike ? is it your size ? job done.

Cyclist Magazine are running some track days again this year. Demo rides from Ribble (amongst others).

15th and 16th April 2023, Lee Valley VeloPark, London

4th June 2023, Castle Combe Race Circuit, Wiltshire

I went to one at York Cycle Circuit a few years ago (pre-Covid), it was a good day out. Loads of stuff there to ride, quite a few tech reps on hand as well to talk through it all, ensure decent set-up etc. They obviously stopped them all during Covid, it's only now that they're back up and running. I guess the supply issues within the industry didn't help with getting test fleets sorted either.

https://cyclisttrackdays.com/trackdays/en/page/home

Would you buy a car without driving it first? I wouldn’t.

Yes, happily, I have test driven both cars and bikes, but I've also bought them with no test ride and it's been just fine. (with cars it's making sure they're not a lemon!)

I'm also not convinced it makes much difference- with bikes, by the time you've set the suspension, gears, saddle, bars, brake levers etc set up how you want them, bikes can feel completely different.

Certain things like sizing are important, but you can figure that out sitting on one on the shop floor.

Certain things like sizing are important, but you can figure that out sitting on one on the shop floor.

Aye so ye can.

That explains how I ended up with a bike that was too big for me and put me off drop bars after trying it for size and taking it round the block for a half mile test ride. Wasn't until I started properly using it that I realised how wrong it was for me.

Weirdly enough, in the last five years the only bike i demo'ed before buying is the only one I decided I didn't like and sold it.

Maybe the crash I had on the demo ride should have warned me off.

Just going back to Cotic for a second, just what is it that makes the Cascade so rufftytuffty? Would a change of wheel and narrower tyres maybe the carbon fork option make it more suitable?

Have wondered just how nimble and narrow a tyre it would get away with. Is this something @cy has tried? Or does it drop the whole bike down too low?

I haven't run anything 45c ish on the Cascade because that's getting into Escapade territory, and on my personal Cascade I like the proper 2.4 tyres. I tried some WTB 36c slicks during development, but the combo of 51mm offset carbon fork (at the time), the 69 deg head angle and the very rounded, small tyres made for some 'excfiting' handling characteristics. The 'flop' effect was quite marked when cornering. It was better with the Cotic 44mm offset fork, but really, tyres that small don't work. Baybutt has run Nanos on his Cascade and likes them, and I am actually getting some 45c Raddler's to zip the bike up a bit for the upcoming North London Dirt ride I'm doing, but I haven't tried them yet.

Having spoken to Jon at length about the Cascade, it's definitely not what he's looking for though.

Wheelbase in Staveley are having a road and gravel demo day on the 20th of May.

Given Ribble's issues with supply lead times last year I'm guessing they can sell every bike they make several times over. So in that regard having to invest in a demo fleet would actually cost them money (and further delay existing customers orders).

Ribble have just done 3 demo days for gravel bikes so they must have some

If Ribble won't do a demo/hire then ignore them and look elsewhere.

I can recommend a Freeranger, and you'll get an entire bike for less than the price of 'high-end' frames which means plenty of spare to change stuff you don't like - for me it was wheels, tyres and bars.

in over 40 years of cycling, and more bikes than i care or dare to remember, i have never had a test ride.

do you like the look of the bike ? is it your size ? job done

...and how many of those have you then sold less than a month later ;-). Personally any bike/frame that I want to move on in less than 3 or 4 years I feel was a bad purchase.

Yes, happily, I have test driven both cars and bikes, but I’ve also bought them with no test ride and it’s been just fine. (with cars it’s making sure they’re not a lemon!)

Whereas some years ago, I was really keen on a Jag X-type estate 2.2D until drove one. Then I discovered nowhere to put your left foot that wasn't the clutch pedal; and the powerband was "nothing, nothing, WALLLOP, nothing" which would have sent me batty to live with long term. Neither of which I would have spotted just sitting in it. (I still have the BMW I bought instead, 13 years and 110k miles later)

Having spoken to Jon at length about the Cascade, it’s definitely not what he’s looking for though.

Which still annoys me, as I still think they look rad as, and on paper are perfect. However huge thanks for being everything that Ribble aren't!

I can recommend a Freeranger,

They're another one of those square frames I've been talking about. A large would have a fractionally shorter TT than my current bike (which already runs a 110mm stem), but the seat tube is 30mm longer than current (which is OK, but borderline), so standover and dropper capability are both compromised. It's "road bike with big clearance" geometry, rather than true gravel bike IMO. A shame as the price is very attractive!

Agree, whilst in not a gravel bike rider, given how expensive bikes have become then Im extremely reluctant to replace my current one without been able to have a test ride / demo. There is only so much you can get from a geo chart and review articles. I guess Covid stopped them and for many they can sell what they have so why bother?

I've just bought a Ribble gravel bike and had no problems but the Facebook group is full of tales of people ordering, being given delivery dates and then having them put back and back with no explanation given. This apparently happens even when they have been told that the item is in stock.

I went to the showroom. It was a bit odd. you can't sit on any of the display bikes which are bolted down. There is a bike jig thing for fittings but I like to have an impression of the bike beneath me and I don't find a jig does that. For example, I like to see the handlebars obscuring the front axle. You can't do that without wheels

JonEdwards

Why on earth would I spend money with Ribble on a new, pretty high end, gravel frame???

FTFY

Never demo'd a bike in my life. The only thing I've not got on with was a Santa Cruz Heckler but that took months to figure that out. It takes a while to get used to new things and figure out if they're right for you. Someone getting off a 10 y/o mtb and on to a LLS grarpoon would find it rather a strange thing initially and it probably wouldn't pass a demo ride.

They’re another one of those square frames I’ve been talking about. A large would have a fractionally shorter TT than my current bike (which already runs a 110mm stem), but the seat tube is 30mm longer than current (which is OK, but borderline), so standover and dropper capability are both compromised. It’s “road bike with big clearance” geometry, rather than true gravel bike IMO. A shame as the price is very attractive!

XL for me, but luckily I'm over-legged so have about 10" of seatpost poking out. Did swap to an 80mm stem though and shallower drops (Ritchey Beacons). A pal who's the same height as me but shorter in the leg went for the large.

Where I live it's rough so I've a HT for the trails, but with 50c tyres on the Freeranger is well rapid (and safe) down fast & long fire-road descents.