Which frame is better?
I think the Chameleon comes in about 1-1.5kg lighter?
better is very subjective.
how tall are you???
Not that much difference in weight, I own a stiffee and two friends own chameleons. Both of them love the chameleons, but i think the stiffee is alot smoother. I dont think you'll be disappointed either way!
flip a coin, you'll get a good un either way
I got the Cove and it is a great ride, if shoddy finishing
Chameleon is better finish, costs bit more, and when I bought mine, still had horizontal drop-outs
I look at changing now, but can't quite bring myself to get rid of the Cove for some reason, even after riding a mates chameleon with similar setup
Cove is a lot slacker.
having ridden Mr. PJ266's Cove, i have to agree its smoother. however i love the stiffness of the chameleon, i think it makes for a really good ride and i've never found the slightly less smooth ride to be noticable or a problem. horizontal dropouts are cool aswell if you like singlespeeding
I do think the chameleon is the nicer looking of the two.
ton, I'm about 5"7
I like singlespeeding, but horizontals and discs were faff, now with the ebb, much more appealing to me
do you fancy a cove, one careful owner?
then I can have a chameleon
Had both and prefer the chameleon.I found the sizing of the chameleon more to my liking.At 6ft the large cove felt a bit big and clumsy with a high bottom bracket whereas the large chameleon feels perfect.I also think any difference in ride harshness is more likely to come down to the bike build.The seatpost and tyres affect the harshness of the ride far more than frame design.
Chameleons just feel harsher, same seatpost (thomson) same tyres (2.35 high roller) same pressures. trust me 😉
Come on theres only one choice
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I have to say you people have been down right useless.
Why cant you all agree on just one???
😀
Although I think I'm leaning towards the santa cruz.. but then again, the cove does look very nice as well..
Dont know if it has a name, but the angle the top tube makes with the seat stays, how does that affect what the bike rides like? The chameleon almost looks like a bmx frame, the angle is so big.
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I havent ridden the cove, but a mate has a 16 inch chameleon, with pikes, and it is one of the best handling bikes i have ever ridden. I'd buy one tomorow if i had the money. but then ive heard alot of good things about the stiffee. plus it has a mildly amusing name...
Don't know if it affects the ride of the bike at all against if you used the same angles and joined it conventionally. In my opinion it is just santa cruz showing off there fancy new hydro-forming machine. so from the side profile you get a nice/nasty curve from front to back
[url= http://www.santacruzmtb.com/chameleon/index.php?geometry=1 ]santa cruz geo[/url]
[url= http://www.covebike.com/bikes/stiffee.html ]cove geo[/url]
In my opinion its down to looks really there both gonna ride good, but then i rarely find a component I really dislike and normally get used to new bits inside 2 weeks. I 'd always go santa cruz but then i'm a chameleon fanboy
I've considered both but at the moment I am seeing what comes out for 2010 as it's more for fun than a need, unless a deal comes up on ebay or on the classifieds.
I don't think there is much between them performance wise comes down to looks and colours 🙂
I am seeing what comes out for 2010...
I wonder how the mmmBop will compare to the Stiffee and Chameleon..?
Do you think either would be better suited to run a 100-120-140mm fork like [url= http://www.foxracingshox.com/bike/10/forks/32_TALAS/140_FIT_RLC ]fox talas 32[/url]?
Cove is a lot slacker.
I'd like the cove then 😀
househusband if that's all that's coming in 2010 then it will be the Santa or the Cove 🙂
Wouldnt swap our 3 for any thing else, not even for a stiffee
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Tracey
Both good bikes, my money's on the Cove though
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Cham.
Without a doubt the best hardtail I've ridden.
I think I'm now leaning towards the stiffee, because the santa cruz comes fitted with an EBB, and if I understand correctly, you cant take that out and fit a normal BB, and EBB's are a load of trouble?
have you seen my frame for sale..... ❓
RealMan - MemberI think I'm now leaning towards the stiffee, because the santa cruz comes fitted with an EBB, and if I understand correctly, you cant take that out and fit a normal BB, and EBB's are a load of trouble?
A normal BB fits into the EBB. It's just like a BB shell that rotates to take up chain tension.
santa with 130mm fox...hardcore
A normal BB fits into the EBB. It's just like a BB shell that rotates to take up chain tension.
Yes, I know. But what I'm saying is that even when you put a normal BB in there, you still have the EBB shell as well, and I hear they dont work very well.
I know you hear all these things about EBBs but the one on my santa cruz has been silent and faultless. there are also other great bikes in this bracket to check out including transitions transAM, mike up ^ there has some nice bikes. brants bikes old and new look a good bet as do cotic, chromag, kona, commencal, scott?? there really are not many duds out there. also have a look on ebay etc for your SC or cove, i picked up a mint condition chameleon on pink bike for £350.
ahem...Chumba HX1 🙂
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ffs simon, ssshhhh 😉
Ton, don't worry, your's is the only gay i mean 29er in the village 😉
[i]EBB's are a load of trouble? [/i]
[i]Some[/i] EBBs are shite, the one on the Cham is faultless
That chumba looks mint, and if im right in thinking this, youre a lucky guy ton! although 29er?? waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaank 😉
On the other hand, Stiffee's the best hardtail I've ever ridden 😉
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never ridden a stiffee but the chameleon is a wonderful bike. I've never ridden another bike that is so keen to be thrown off rocks, jumps and cars as the chameleon. Stiff as hell mind and will play with your back over proper long rides but it's worth the massive shit-eating grin that my chameleon can give me on every single ride.
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god, I love that bike.
'Would you like to see my 19" Chameleon?' just doesn't have the same ring to it!
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si what travel does that Chumba take up front?
Ok. Cove Stiffee it is. No more changing my mind. Now, what fork shall I run with it.. Thinking of something that can give 100-140mm of travel?
Pike.
si what travel does that Chumba take up front?
The HX1 will take 140mm, i have even seen them with 160mm, but 140mm is the sweet spot.
cheers Si just sent you a mail
Whoops double post 🙂
cheers Si just sent you a mail
Not received yet mate?
just resent!!
something adjustable and stiff, can wind it down to stop it wandering on climbs and let it all out to hooligan the descents.
I run pikes now and feels so much tougher than the vanillas, bolt thru helps match up the stiffness
did run psylos when I first had it, great travel, but were too flexy
I faced the very same frame dilema last year, got the chammy and no turning back - best hardtail I have ever ridden, set up a bit burley with a Pike and some tough wheels. light enough to ride all day, tough and agile enough to worry a lot of full sussers.
If you like mainly DH action, get the cove... if you ride up and down all day you need the santa cruz, it climbs better with the steeper angles - it is slightly more nervous on descents than the cove but this makes it more fun IMO - it just feels alive and loves to be flicked about.
Other deciding factor is size - the chammy has a short top tube.
To sum up... I think the chammy is like an xc bike thats had a 6 pack of red bull, the stiffee is like a DH bike that had it's rear shock conviscated!
Ok. Cove Stiffee it is. No more changing my mind.
Yeah I've changed my mind again, going to get a chameleon. 99.9% sure of it.
I've had a Cove Stiffee and loved it. (69er ltd edt.)
It saved me a few times with it's handling. It's due an update soon.
Loved it in Orange/red but now it has shoddy paint.
The Chameleon looks nice but isn't it a jump bike?
Nahh, more XC than the Cove.