[Closed] carbon orange five

randomjeremy - Member

If you base your buying decisions on things that are used for fun on the length of their warranty you need to take a long hard look in the mirror and have a word with yourself.

Sure, if you're choosing it solely on warranty. But are you saying it shouldn't be a consideration at all? Seems daft to me, after all, you're paying for it.

Dont own a merc either 🙁

Think NW gets my drift.

Aye, tell that to the boy who was posting on here about his broken Five last week- 3 years old, falling apart, and a year out of warranty...

That'll be me then!

With regards to the price of them, back when I bought it (2008), it was good value. The frame was about £1100, and the full bike was just over £2200 (pro model). Now, I struggle to see much value in the majority of mountain bikes, let alone Orange's. A new Five frame is £1400! Chuck in a Maxle rear end and custom paint job, and you're looking at £1600! However, there is a Yeti in Wheelbase for £4k. No stupidly fancy bits, mainly XT throughout. £4k, for what is essentially a toy!

But I digress. A carbon Five you say? Nah, don't see the point in it myself and I can't see it happening either. Orange's speciality is steel and aluminium. Wouldn't make sense for them to do carbon. You could argue that the market is heading that way, but then again the full suspension market has been heading towards linkages for a while and Orange are still using a single pivot (not saying that one is right over the other, just commenting).

More than likely you saw a bike with a vinyl carbon effect wrap.

[i]More than likely you saw a bike with a vinyl carbon effect wrap[/i]
& if it was a 5 wrapped up in carbon sticky stuff then the bloke probably was a tool after all!
Back to square one.

Justinbieber - it's always been like that for frames vs whole bikes. You're best off buying the complete bike then flogging all the spare kit.

there is a Yeti in Wheelbase

A Yeti ASR5 frame is £1799. Funny how there are no threads with peeps bleating how expensive they are. Especially when they are about 60% of that in the country of their origin.

I want to see more bamboo frames!

[i]A Yeti ASR5 frame is £1799. Funny how there are no threads with peeps bleating how expensive they are. Especially when they are about 60% of that in the country of their origin.[/i]

+ 1 (& plenty of other frames besides)

I already knew that when I bought my 5, didn't & still don't care & I'd have another.

ScottChegg - Member

A Yeti ASR5 frame is £1799. Funny how there are no threads with peeps bleating how expensive they are

No bugger buys them! And the price has a lot to do with it, since they're really nice. People vote with their wallets.

Cant see it in a hurry. But then who would have thought Intense would be playing with the black stuff when their whole history is being good at welding.

Heckler £899-2 year warranty
Orange 5 £1400-3 year warranty
Nicolai Helius £1700- 5 year warranty
Yeta ASR5 £1799- 5 year warranty
Intense Tracer £1550.00 - 2 year warranty

Never ridden any of them but you pays your money, you take your choice... although I am drawn to the Heckler.
From what I hear anecdotally the more expensive brands tend to offer better support when things go wrong both pre and also post warranty when they are not obliged to..perhaps that's why they cost more in the first place?

Pretty sure it wasn't carbon vinyl wrapped ,cant find anything on any other forums either

jam bo - Member
Warranty length has **** all to do with quality. It's a marketing tool

If you base your buying decisions on things that are used for fun on the length of their warranty you need to take a long hard look in the mirror and have a word with yourself.

I actually look at my bank balance and realise being left with some aluminium only fit for recycling and having to potentially fund a new £1,400 frame after a few years isn't that appealing when plenty of other manufacturers sell stuff capable of being just as much fun backed with a lifetime warranty

From what I hear anecdotally the more expensive brands tend to offer better support when things go wrong both pre and also post warranty when they are not obliged to..perhaps that's why they cost more in the first place?

anecdotally Orange will stick to the letter of the warranty at the time of sale regardless of what is being offered for new frames

Surely its the cost of British labour that makes the orange more expensive to produce than other manufactures who use the far east.

Heckler £899-2 year warranty
Orange 5 £1400-3 year warranty
Nicolai Helius £1700- 5 year warranty
Yeta ASR5 £1799- 5 year warranty
Intense Tracer £1550.00 - 2 year warranty

Specialized Pitch £1400 for full bike - lifetime warranty

I have a 1998 K2/proflex Carbon 5500c and an orange 5 -- the K2 carbon frame looks similar to the Orange 5 (same single pivot point) but the shock sits behind the seatpost on the k2.

I would not be surprised if Orange do this - the K2 frame is a super thin aluminium skeleton with two halves of carbon wrapped round the skeleton. That's tech from 13 years ago; nowadays the process is much cheaper and does away with any nasty ridges and join marks (that the K2 has). back in the day, I sold aftermarket disk brake kits for this frame - a lot of work was put into to make sure that the heat generated from a disk brake (they were 140mm back then!) didn't transfer along the frame and melt the glue holding the CF together.

Specialized Pitch £1400 for full bike - lifetime warranty

£1800? And its 5 year front, 2 year rear, 1 year parts IIRC.

Dave at Orange has just confirmed there's not a Carbon Five going around, nor will there be for be the foreseeable future.

so the guy in the OP's original post is clearly just some KNOB WITH A CARBON BIKE WHO LIKES TO SKID AND SLIDE......so thats that then! thread over!

£1800? And its 5 year front, 2 year rear, 1 year parts IIRC.

OK yeah it is now but it was £1400 when I bought mine, and I thought it was lifetime warranty on the frame, 5 years on the seat/chain stays?

I have a 5 and I like it, hate me all you want. I bought it secondhand too from a nice skinny bloke on here.

😳

they ruined them when they went to bendy top tubes, i had one of the last with the straight tube , lovely bike, awful Manitou SPV 3 way shock
[url= http://farm1.static.flickr.com/196/475828369_1839356888_o.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm1.static.flickr.com/196/475828369_1839356888_o.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/rocketdog/475828369/ ]DSCF0013[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/rocketdog/ ]rOcKeTdOgUk[/url], on Flickr

they ruined them when they went to bendy top tubes

Funny you should say that because it's almost exactly what I've heard from someone closely involved in the design of Orange bikes. He didn't say it ruined the bike, but he did say that in order to make the tube strong enough to accommodate the bend, they had to make the tube weigh twice as much as the straight one and it's still only as strong as the straight one.

The decision was apparently driven by marketing; there was a demand from us, the buying public, for kinked top tubes because we believe they look modern and give more standover clearance, which maybe they do, maybe they don't. But that kinked top tube definitely adds quite a bit of uneccessary weight. He felt the same way about tapered head tubes. They are a nightmare to make so add cost, are heavy and don't add anything that a straight 1.5 HT doesn't offer.

there was a demand from us, the buying public, for kinked top tubes because we believe they look modern and give more standover clearance

Ignore me

nows thats ****ed up, if the public want something thast doesn't make functional sense the manufacturers should tell JoeP to stick it

Funny you should say that because [s]it's almost[/s] [i]that is[/i] exactly what I've heard from someone closely involved in the design of Orange bikes. 😆

Apart from being able to use 'standard' stems

EDIT

Ignore me

OK, but actually the point still stands:

The point being made was that a straight 1.5" HT allows you to run anything and everything with the appropriate reducer cups so why limit your options with a system that is harder and thus more costly to make as with tapered?

I should imagine there's a marginal weight saving geetee but only really an issue on xc bikes (where tapered forks [i]may[/i] be overkill anyway) rufty tufty bikes like the 5 should get 1.5 i agree....or is it actually a pretty big weight difference?

I like how this thread has one group saying how outdated the orange design is and another saying most design tweeks are done for marketing reasons. From seeing the videos of the new patriot I would say there is not much wrong with the basic single pivot design, it is not holding the rider back much. I think the orange single pivot bikes look great. Could not afford one though and got a prophet.

Yes I think i read that tapered offers a marginal weight saving but it's in the weight of the top cup of the headset rather than the tube. And from memory it's pretty marginal.

geda I don't think I said most design tweaks are marketing Kona and others have been doing more nads clearance dropped top tubes for 20+ years no need to fanny about with the tubing just slope it down and run more seatpost, if you can do curved tubes with little or no strength/weight compromise (carbon?) go for it. Tapered headtubes seem a bit of a half measure, OK for weightweenies but the 5 certainly aint that - definitley not with that new top tube, 1.5 is much more versatile, or hey just stick with 1.125" eh?

Edit - I've nowt (much) against marketing btw but it shouldn't adversly affect the product and extra weight is adverse on a mountain bike you pedal, less of an issue on the gravity brigade

DONK absolutely. Not sure the 1 1/8th needed fixing much anyway. The larger formats were developed to address the design challenges of 180mm single crown forks anyway.

The thing with the 5 is that it has evolved over the years but remained close to the original concept. When changes have been made they may have been made for marketing rather than engineering reasons. And before any one gets over excited I am not an engineer!
The change to a kinked top tube was probably marketing lead but subsequent changes to a thicker 30.9 seat tube and tapered head tube seem more about increasing strength. They may just be putting the strength back that they lost with the kinked top tube but these latest changes coincided with the increase from 2 to 3 years warranty on the frame.
It would seem that Orange 5's are the ultimate Marmite bike, you either love them or hate them. I love mine as it does every thing that I want it to do and it is British made. Multi pivot bikes may suit others better but for me it's a case of if it ain't broke don't fix it, just upgrade it.
One last thing. A good few years ago I bought a brand new sports car. A few years later a new model came out but I still preferred the original although I then had to sell it. Fast forward another few years to the point where I no longer own or have an emotional attachment to the original model, I now think I prefer the later one.

Matt24k - Member
...but subsequent changes to a thicker 30.9 seat tube and tapered head tube seem more about increasing strength.

I think the thicker seat tube is mainly to accommodate people who want a rufty tufty dropper seatpost. 30.9 gives them more choice.

The only carbon orange are doing is a road bike........ 29er five and 29er hardtail

https://twitter.com/chipps/status/108818264708231168

Also if you look on biketarts Facebook page then there is a teaser photo.