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“Why didn’t i think of that… i’ll just got 50% faster next time…
Jeez.”
What we’re meaning is don’t slow down as much before a corner. Then you will run out of grip. Then you will notice the difference between tyres!
I could tell straight away if I liked a tyre or not. Some only lasted one ride before being chucked on the tyre pile at the back of the shed! 🙂
Tell me you're a bimbler workout telling me you're a bimbler.
What we’re meaning is don’t slow down as much before a corner. Then you will run out of grip. Then you will notice the difference between tyres!
For someone who spends so much time racing you would think this information was unnecessary.
DHF vs MM leaning right over in the corner? These are both popular and very good tyres but feel very different indeed on their edges.
Having ridden FOD with Weeksy once before he’s not a bimbler (unless I am - some may argue I am) - on the straight / rocky / rooty bits he was fast in a straight line (e.g parts of Sheepskull) - but perhaps braked a bit hard for the corners so could carry a little more speed there. But I think that was last year or the year before (pre Fuel Ex / Slayer / Fuel Ex) and it sounds like he’s going faster now!
I was reading a bit about what pressures the Enduro racers were running and they were all higher than my 20/22, so thought i’d experiment with higher pressures.
Never follow the pros in an area like this. They are hitting everything at twice the speed of mere mortals and are therefore forced to run higher pressures to stop the sidewalls collapsing (and the associated punctures, tyres rolling off the rim, etc). See also - pro suspension setup.
If you've got spare time, go out and play with the extremes. Do a short run/section with really low pressures, then another with really high. At least one of them will be absolutely terrifying
I think I’ve broadly settled on around 23 psi at both ends for tyre pressures on both my bikes. If I’m going somewhere like Dyfi I bump it up a couple of psi, if I’m riding somewhere steeper / slower and muddy / slippery then I’m down to 18 front / 20 rear to sniff out some more grip. That 18 psi on the front on something like a magic Mary or hillbilly really makes a difference.
Yes, to an extent.
Things like "feel", rolling resistance, weight are easy enough to have an objective opinion on, they're things you can get an handle on on any ride in any weather.
Grip is more subjective, it's either there under those conditions (trail, speed, angles, torque, etc) or it's not. So most opinions are "it's rubbish's at ......." and whether some one agrees or not is probably down to whether they've ridden the same tyre, in the same way, in the same conditions on the same trails. And unless you're either a pro getting fresh tyres every week, your slightly fuzzy recollection of how a Nobby Nick worked in October probably isn't that comparable now after a month of it being fairly worn out, to the Assegai you replaced it with in Febuary.
The answer is I think that you’ve never really pushed it, otherwise you’d know…
I think the reality is some people are more sensitive to tyres than others. I have mates who can ride round the quirks of particular tyres without really thinking about it, because, well, they don't really think about it. and they're good, instinctive riders Others who will notice the smallest nuances of particular tyres and get really het up about them.
As for grip, as with motorcycles, I'd rather have a tyre that gives way predictably and signals that it's about to do that rather than one that's actually outright grippier, but when it does go, does it suddenly and without any warning.
sounds like he’s going faster now
Yea, but alpin says he's a bimbler, so....
Never follow the pros in an area like this. They are hitting everything at twice the speed of mere mortals and are therefore forced to run higher pressures to stop the sidewalls collapsing
We were talking about this yesterday.
Steve Peat was running 40psi at Steel City.
My mate, who got 4th in the vets at the same race said that would feel awful to him
fast in a straight line
Maybe there's a correlation to not going round corners quickly and not noticing a difference in tyres..
I know it's an out there concept but there may be something in it.
I can't tell much difference between tyres.
I'm pretty sure that most people who claim to be able to tell the difference - can't.
If you think about it - claiming you can tell the difference is a form of humble-brag.
It implies that the speaker is a more capable rider than the listener. That the speaker can detect the minor variations simply because they are more finely tuned than the listener. Hence people love to claim they can tell.
I work in the automotive industry and I'm surrounded by people like this - they make me mad/sad and disrespectful all at the same time :o)
Tell me you’re a bimbler workout telling me you’re a bimbler.
This comment plus the 'ride harder' comment all just prove my point - humble-braggers!!!!!
If you think about it – claiming you can tell the difference is a form of humble-brag.
Or it could just mean you can tell the difference? You know, like different foods taste different. Personally I notice big differences - you know, like I can work out that a Racing Ralph and a DHR 2 have different levels of rolling resistance and grip or a Rock Razor is less good at braking on steep stuff than a Minion, but I'm less sensitive to the difference in outright grip between more similar tyres. I can tell that if you stick a Dissector on the front of bike, it lurches disconcertingly as you transition from the centre to the side knobs, particularly on firm surfaces, but it's really obvious. I'm not particularly sure any of that is 'humble bragging'.
I’m pretty sure that most people who claim to be able to tell the difference – can’t.
If you think about it – claiming you can tell the difference is a form of humble-brag.
What a load of old pony.
Being able to tell whether your tyre is gripping or not is a basic MTB skill. You don't even have to be travelling that fast, it can be just as evident in slimy technical woodlands as it is railing super fast corners
I’m pretty sure that most people who claim to be able to tell the difference – can’t.
I'm curious whether you do much technical riding, especially in the wet?
Modern MTB tyres are so good and there are real differences between a dry conditions tyre and one designed to handle a bit of mud.
As others have said, changing the front tyre is really one of the most effective ways to change your bike's performance.
That's kind-of the opposite of us claiming to be super-discerning and sophisticated. It's obvious.
If you think about it – claiming you can tell the difference is a form of humble-brag.
That swings both ways. I've met plenty quick "I just put some air in the tyres and ride, don't even know what I've got on" type folks
I’m curious whether you do much technical riding, especially in the wet?
I don't know how to equate the statement, i ride local, FoD, BPW, Pontpool, Hopton, Bringewood, woods, trails, whatever the conditions, at least once, twice maybe 3-4 times a week. What i class as technical, you may class as simple.
I'm too unfit to notice any difference in tyres. Well, except for the spare one 😳
I don’t know how to equate the statement, i ride local, FoD, BPW, Pontpool, Hopton, Bringewood, woods, trails, whatever the conditions, at least once, twice maybe 3-4 times a week. What i class as technical, you may class as simple.
I'm sure you're riding technical trails.
I was responding to JAG's hot take that we're all just bullshitting about tyres.
@JAG - not about tyres, but about other things in mountain biking I agree.
I'm yet to be convinced that one particularly frame material feels different to another. Similarly bar diameter and material making much of a difference when I'm running a suspension fork.
When it comes to tyres on mountain bikes as others have said, it depends on circumstances.
Loads of people just pump their tyres up hard, don't check pressures and generally ride on grippy armoured surfaces. I'm not implying that this is you BTW. But yeah, those people aren't going to notice much difference between one tyre and another.
I think that in the media when they've got to create a story about products that are mostly basically good, it's very hard to differentiate one from another as long as it's not terrible, and this leads to some creative prose.
I’m pretty sure that most people who claim to be able to tell the difference – can’t.
Yep it's defo a humble brag from me that in the wet I really struggle on some trails with certain tyres but find life much easier with other tyres on the same trail.
It's probably me getting confused and it's more to do with if I'm wearing my lucky socks rather than the tyres making things better.
“If you think about it – claiming you can tell the difference is a form of humble-brag.”
I’m horribly good at noticing pretty tiny differences with any gear I use - not just MTBs but musical instruments, audio gear, cooking stuff, tools, anything I do a fair bit of. It is both infuriating and also very useful because my musical instrument equipment business came about from that ability to notice things and then design better stuff.
But OMFG it is so annoying when something isn’t quite right on my bikes. And I have plenty of friends who either don’t notice or don’t care about their bikes having these issues and will corner faster, ride steep tech better and jump further than me despite that. And I think a lot of pros are like that - they’re so good at riding they can compensate for gear deficiencies.
I’ll never forget following a fast friend down a twisty muddy trail in filthy conditions and being pleased that I was just about keeping up with him. When we got to the end I noticed that he was riding on worn out summer tyres but I was on fresh sticky cut spikes…
Being able to tell whether your tyre is gripping or not is a basic MTB skill. You don’t even have to be travelling that fast, it can be just as evident in slimy technical woodlands as it is railing super fast corners
I'd agree, but then there's both the issue of knowing / interpreting what went wrong. And also some people are happier sliding around than others. A lot of people ride
e.g. I found fat bikes in general were incredibly predictable once sliding in mud, and would slide almost from walking pace. But when they went completely, they really went and threw you into the undergrowth at mach 1.
And some people are more comfortable with sliding around than others. If you live in the Peak then riding on gritstone is a very binary experience in terms of grip. If your local riding is some hillside in Sourthern England you're potentially far more used to sliding about in slop, chalk and roots.
I’m yet to be convinced that one particularly frame material feels different to another. Similarly bar diameter and material making much of a difference when I’m running a suspension fork.
A fork is just one part of the chain going from the ground to your arms. Pinkbike huck to flat videos are a great illustration of the how the forces go through the different parts involved, it's not as straightforward are you might expect and sooner or later those forces are transmitted through the bars (and the grips) and onto the rider.
BITD I used various combo's of Purgatory, Butcher, Fire XC, High Roller, Mountain King and my favourite Kenda Nevegal. Didn't really notice that much difference.
Then I got a pair of wheels that came with a Magic Mary and Hans Dampf. Game changer, miles more grip leading to more confidence in what I could do and what the bike could. After years of using them my only complaint was the Dampf could be quite draggy out back but that was rectified by the STW brains trust earlier this year and I now run a Nobby Nic. It's the Mary that makes the difference, superb tyre.
Just got an XC bike with less aggressive tyres and have had some hairy moments when I've pushed them a bit too far!
So yeah, even though I'm a pretty steady rider I can certainly tell a great tyre from a good one and realise it's horses for courses.
If you think about it – claiming you can tell the difference is a form of humble-brag.
soft compounds grip better than hard compounds on wet roots and greasy surfaces. mud tyres grip better in mud. the old supergravity casings were very uncomfortable. stronger casings can be run at lower pressures. semislicks give away a lot of braking traction.
these are things i’ve noticed. some of them could be placebo, some could be having confidence in the compound or tread to not slow down as much.
claiming that you can’t tell a difference between tyres is also a humble brag. “i’m so good i can ride any tyre fast” sort of thing. the only way to really tell is with timing data, but then you’d need to be the kind of rider who can ride consistently. some days i ride very badly and it has nothing to do with the tyres.
Just been out on the new spesh tyres, better in the mud, less gliding over more bite and they dig in quicker. Butcher t9 draggy on back but pretty good for braking/cornering in the filth so worth the trade off plus it will get me fitter. Even if it is just a placebo my tiny brain thinks it was worth the £80 spent.
I found tyres were all much of a muchness in the past. There was the too soft Specialized on the rear, which squirmed like a horrible squirmy thing and the Bontrager MudX 1.8 which really worked in the wet, I mean even gripped on wet roots!
Then one day I was in an Evans and noticed a FAT square knobbed thing, like some shrunk-down MX tyre on the front wheel of a display bike... checked it... "Schwalbe Magic Mary" eh? Must try one of those. Now that was a revelation, even the noise it made hitting berms was different and lovely shrrrllppp (I think that's how you spell it). But the confidence in grip when leaning the bike at speed was like nothing else. A few tyres have almost caught up, but you can't beat a Mary on the front. Well, I've yet to try a Dinosaur themed one that that Bristol fella started a thread about.
Am I really that passionate about a tyre?? Crazy, man.
I’m yet to be convinced that one particularly frame material feels different to another. Similarly bar diameter and material making much of a difference when I’m running a suspension fork.
I can't agree with a word of that.
As for tyres... all depends where you ride... in some places the difference between compounds with a front tyre, even in the same tyre pattern and size from the same manufacturer, is bloody huge. And if you can't tell the difference between a semi-sick and full tread rear tyre on your local trails when the weather changes... well, time to buy a gravel bike.
Agree that for general trail riding in the dry, I'd not be able to really tell the difference with some tyres, especially when you add tyre pressures, rim widths and whether an insert was fitted into the equation.
Some folk just don't feel anything IME, my pal swapped from Marathons to slicks and didn't notice the difference 🤷♂️
Sometimes it’s subtle, sometimes it’s not.
<br />In the dry, DHF or DHR I’m not too fussed either way. When it gets softer and wetter, I notice a big difference and it’s DHR all the way. <br />Assegai vs Magic Mary and I’d be hard pressed to choose a favourite. <br /><br />
Maxxis Aggressor in 2.3 is crap, while in 2.5 I found it a great 3 season tyre. <br /><br />
Exo and Exo+ I can’t tell any difference but I don’t like DD casings as I think they are very dead feeling. I’d rather run a lighter casing at a bit higher pressure. <br /><br />
well, time to buy a gravel bike.
burn! /wink
I kind of get what you're saying, but I don't believe you can't feel the difference.
It depends on how much you're expecting a change - a move from a super soft component to a soft component is minimal, likewise going from a Hans Damf to a HR2, it's likely that you won't notice it either. The same with changing the pressure by a couple psi - 23 vs 25 doesn't make a world of difference.
BUT, and it's a big BUT, you'd 100% be able to tell the difference between riding on an Aspen vs a DHF. Or running 18psi vs 30psi.
The place I notice the biggest difference is in cornering and braking. That's where they are 'grippier' or go over easier or let me throw on the anchors later, and I'd say all of those are pretty big and obvious ride traits.
Conti vert pros, everything ever since has just been marketing hype.
BUT, and it’s a big BUT, you’d 100% be able to tell the difference between riding on an Aspen vs a DHF. Or running 18psi vs 30psi.
Well yes... i expect/would hope so 🙂
But we're talking more 'basis on a theme' with say 2 Enduro based tyres and 2 sets of pressures very close to one another.
@weeksy so what you’re saying is that similar tyres from different brands ride more or less the same?
In which case I agree.
I’m sure in couldn’t tell 2 tyres with the same intended use from each other
But the OP started with I can’t tell the difference between tyres as a general statement
Going from the original Forkaster to a High Roller in the winter slop round here is night and day. It’s not a humble brag. Pedal and the bike moves forward, turn the bars and the bike turns a corner. With the summer tyres it was straight lines only really
so what you’re saying is that similar tyres from different brands ride more or less the same?
Kinda, so I've got the Bontrager SE5 fitted, which if you ignore the logo, is a DHR, I've tried a MM, Assegai, probably a few others and I can't notice one being better over another.
Or say an Exo over a maxxterra, probably even a maxxgrip
Current Trek came with some Bontrager xr5, 2.5. Not awful, but not great either. Tried for a few weeks now. The normal Mary front (u/soft) and Betty rear (soft) will be going on sharpish. Almost cheat like grip levels in comparison.
This:
“But we’re talking more ‘basis on a theme’ with say 2 Enduro based tyres and 2 sets of pressures very close to one another.”
Does not mean the same as this:
“Anyone else not able to notice any difference in tyres ?”
Not at all.
Is your day job writing clickbait headlines for the Daily Mail?!!