[Closed] A new low?

I’m more thinking why someone would take an e-bike to possibly the flattest trail centre I can think of.

Sherwood Pines seems pretty crap for silent ebike assassins. A few times I’ve been and the first I’ve known they were there is when I hear them locking a rear wheel just behind me or even buzzing my tire before pushing past. Can see why that would rile those of fiery temperament. Not had that issue at other trail centres.

So the other rider was the instigator by abusing the e-biker.

I've never understood why folk don't just ignore this shit. Idiots shouting abuse are just that, idiots. If someone is a shit rider then why should that bother me?

Riding is for chilling out / scaring mysef lol not for other folks issues.

I had this riding at Thetford.

I was on a SS and had my tyre buzzed on a twisty single track section.

Not a single word from the rider behind.

They then sat on my wheel rather than drop back even a few cm.

They passed me again without a word (or ounce of effort 🤭) the proceeded to take the same tactic with the next person.

Bell.End.

There do seem to be loads around at the moment. I figured they allow you to go faster to make the flat bits more entertaining. I'm pretty sure many are derestricted. This chap came up behind me pretty sharpish and he was exactly built like Chris Frome if you know what I mean.

So the other rider was the instigator by abusing the e-biker.

Not in my opinion. He merely stated a, subsequently proven, fact!!

I remember 2 clowns squaring up to each other half way round the loop at gt7 a couple of years ago.

I remember thinking if they have enough energy to get off and have a fight, they clearly aren't putting in enough effort.

Not in my opinion.

But he was though, you can see that even if you think he was right ( which, as no one saw the incident, can know)

What do people expect to happen when they abuse others ?. They are instigating an exchange.

Had this at degla. The idiot knocked my 10year old son off his bike. My lad got revenge later on when he stopped mid trial as he wasn't sure about a short rocky descent. The two e bikers came flying up behind him, luckily panicked and rode off the trail and crashed. I was mortified until we clocked who it was. So we both just carried on without helping them.

If my son hadn't been in heap after the first incident I'd have been after them to let them know my feelings. At least this way I didn't have to be confrontational 🙂

My lad learned an important lesson. Some ebikers are ****s and not to stop in the middle of the trial, unless it results in said ebikers in a heap.

Some people are just idiots. Racing round a popular trail centre on motor bikes without due regard of others is not on.

Can I just ask, is this an e-bike hate thread, or an idiot hate thread ? I'm not sure.

They're the same ones that drive an inch of your bumper on the motorway.

Seems to be more prevalent lately though with the uptake in cycling by the general public.

@brads more like an idiots on ebikes thread.

I’d be interested to know what folk from the other side of the fence feel about this. On ebike forums are there lots of folk complaining about being held up by folk on regular bikes? That a quick love tap is fine and only dicks get angry about you ‘making progress’?

I do have an ebike, but ride it like a normal one, and slow down to the speed of the person in front of me, or hang back if I want to hit something quick. Tbh I’m almost sheepishly embarrassed overtaking someone with it.

I suspect this is more an idiot from Mansfield thing rather than exclusively an ebike thing. Same for the guy who called him a dick.

Having said that there was at least one punch up at the Glentress 7 last year. That was a weird race, there were a lot of mid pack have a go heroes taking it ridiculously seriously and tempers were a bit flary.

I hate this so much!

Just because you’re quicker, you have no right to ruin someone else’s ride. It isn’t an emergency, you’re not trying to get someone to hospital before they die, you’re out playing on your bike.

If you’re having a great run down a trail and catch someone up, just back off, give them some room, and enjoy the flow. And if you can’t do that then stop and wait. Or turn around and go back to the start and restart.

I love riding my ebike, it’s actually better on flat trails (especially muddy or rough ones that suck out your rolling speed) than my hardtail because it’s possible to ride them faster. But being faster due to a motor, greater fitness or superior skills doesn’t give you the right to be a ****.

Can I just ask, is this an e-bike hate thread, or an idiot hate thread ? I’m not sure.

I only mentioned the ebike as it explains why I was caught up on the trail 😉

I'm not even anti idiot, I'm anti people whose reaction to being called out for poor trail etiquette is to throw a punch. Regardless of whether on an ebike or a unicycle. If you act like a ****, someone pulls you up for it and then you decide the appropriate course of action is to try and lamp them then I am very much in the anti camp when it comes to you!!

So the other rider was the instigator by abusing the e-biker

We don't know what the ebiker did to trigger the abuse. If he rode into the other guy or cut him up, he was the instigator.

If someone is a shit rider then why should that bother me?

It wouldn't bother me unless their riding put me at risk. Which may or may have been the case here.

I'd be stopping if someone tapped by rear tyre. Stupid and dangerous. I've got no issue moving over for people that are quicker then me when it is safe to do so.

I had this problem at Whinlater. My partner was off looking at wild flowers just up the road, so I took my bike for potter round Whinlater. I am 67 have a controled heart condition and am a bit on the slow side up hill. I was grinding my way up the first climb and two people on Ebikes basicaly ran into my back wheel on the climb.
I am not anti Ebike I am anti rude and agressive behaviour.
If this sort of behaviour is considered acceptable, I despair of people.

I have not been to a trailcentre since.

I just think it’s so aggressive to be almost buzzing the rear tyre of a rider that you don’t know. On group rides it’s normal competitive fun with your mates, chasing one another down the single track. But if you do it to someone you don’t know it’s so unkind.

And it’s particularly offensive when the only reason that someone is able to be hassling a slower rider is because they’ve got a motor helping out. Ebikes get enough hate without ebikers asking for it!

I think chiefgrooveguru has it to a T here, absolutely spot on.
It doesn't matter what you're riding, show a bit of respect to others using the same trails.

The last time I rode at degla there were a group of ebikers right on my back wheel, trying to push me out of the way on a long section of narrow northshore that only has room for one bike. Not worth slagging them off though, I found that dabbing the brake was enough of a shock for them.

The most amusing ebike related incident I've seen was the first section of Follow The Dog on Cannock Chase. A group of us human powered riders started off from the car park to be over taken on the run up to the first bit of singletrack by 3 guys on ebikes. I'm guessing it may have been the firs time they'd ridden them though as they were all piled into each other & the trees on the first tight bend - obviously gone way too fast and couldn't control it.

I have no issues with ebikes, would love one myself and have had a play on a few, but if you're getting one learn to handle it properly and read the environment you're riding in.

I’d be stopping if someone tapped by rear tyre. Stupid and dangerous. I’ve got no issue moving over for people that are quicker then me when it is safe to do so.

I'm with you on this. If someone came up behind and started doing that it would definitely prompt a reaction from me.

I'm more than happy to try and be cooperative and not hold anyone up but I wouldn't do so if they tried that on.

If you deliberately "tap" my rear tyre (and I don't know you) I'll be going full mark renshaw on you when you pass.
On the flip side, I've had riders deliberately hold me up, literally looking over their shoulder and moving across in front of me. Some people are just ****s.

Most of my riding is natural and with covid I haven't been to a trail centre for over a year.
I can see with the growth of ebikes that this type of rude behaviour will inevitably increase as the difference in rider speeds (particularly up hill) becomes wider.
I'm no ebike hater, I'll probably on one myself in a few years, it just seems that we may need to rethink how trail centres are used for this new future.

In a biking trip to Chamonix many years ago. Had a bloke turn up with his girlfriend part way through the trip to do a few days guided riding with the group. Proceeded to buzz everyone’s tyres on every descent. Even when the guide told him to back off a little he kept doing it.

His girlfriend had never ridden off road before but still insisted on her trying to get down multiple alpine switch backs to the point where she was in tears and ended walking her bike all the way to the valley floor.

Anyway, towards the end of his first day he was obviously starting to get a little weary and had a big off in to a boulder. Big hole in his elbow, hospital and lots of stitches required. Never saw them again.

Moral of this story. Karma will get you in the end.

Thinking about this, the last time I suffered behaviour like this on my bike, I was on my way into work, and it was a car driver doing it! It didn’t go well for him because I was heading downhill at ~30 mph on a road that’s technically a 20 limit, so I was certainly going fast enough and because of parked cars on both sides (it’s a suburban dual carriageway) I was right in the middle of the single lane. He got really close, then beeped so I slowed to a halt, blocked his way and unleashed verbal fury.

The same thing happened about a year before on the same road in the dark - and that driver didn’t have their headlights on. “If you’re going to beep at me, maybe switch your lights on as it’s dark!”
This is why I only ride bikes on the road for utility purposes. The last thing we need is this stupidity happening on the trails when we’re trying to get away from it al!

unleashed verbal fury.

Is this the same as "that look", from whathisname, 21?

If you deliberately “tap” my rear tyre (and I don’t know you) I’ll…

…hit the brakes.

I can't believe people find it acceptable to tap someone's tyre.

I’ve had XC riders pass me unannounced. Usually only a couple centimetres from my handlebars. They too are toss pots simply for not saying they’d like to pass - it’s not that hard.

Had this at Pines. My girlfriend has been knocked off by ebikers 4 times - twice at the marin, twice in the Peak. She's also been collided with at Degla.

It's happened to me on climbs at the Marin and an absolute 4rsehole at Penmachno, but I can shrug it off without losing confidence.

Thankfully, most of my riding isn't trail centre and very thankfully a long way away from large urban centres. I'm dreading lockdown ending because w@nkers on ebikes will be back invading north wales.

This has never been an issue for me in the 40 years I've been riding bikes offroad. It's absolutely a function of the motorbike being allowed on trails that are made for cyclists.

The people are the same - but access to motorised propulsion is the problem.

My utter hatred of ebikes, except in very specific circumstances, isn't anything I will hide. Why should I? They have made previously problem bikers into menaces, and they enable people who are too fat and lazy to get on a real bike under their own steam to rock up in places they've technically got a right to be, but shouldn't be anywhere near because they're dangerous.

I hate ebikes. I hate them for very good reasons. It's not a hatred born out of bitterness or technological resentment or jealousy. It's a hatred born out of bad things that never happened happening quite a lot and the only reason they happen is because motorbikes are now legal on offroad trails.

Apologies to the sensible ebike users out there. It sucks to be caught up in this. But there are way too many ****ers on ebikes and I would like to see them restricted to the road, for commutes, or for people with disabilities. Everyone else should have to earn their place on the trails.

Had this once but not on bikes, two guys racing round the green at swinley, overtaking my five year old at speed. Took him back to the car and went back to have a word, guys excuse was that he was there with his kid.......

I got very close to being Buzzed at Bedgebury by ebikes trying to overtake me, I was on my ebike towing my 4yr old on a tag along & they were trying to squeeze past, their front wheel trying to go past him I just carried on till end of trail section, also got told to move by faster rider to right on the trail a lady on her Levo trying to come past I was going slow as a family in front of me & again I had the tag along, some people just can’t wait!!

Everyone else should have to earn their place on the trails.

😂😂😂

Oh wait, you're serious?

I did my time on clockwork bikes, getting my tyre buzzed on the climbs by the racing snakes who didn't like being passed on the tech by the fat bloke. There's arseholes on ebikes and there's arseholes on clockwork bikes, they're all arseholes. Get over yourself and enjoy riding your bike.

@tomhoward

I’d be interested to know what folk from the other side of the fence feel about this. On ebike forums are there lots of folk complaining about being held up by folk on regular bikes? That a quick love tap is fine and only dicks get angry about you ‘making progress’?

Speaking for myself and the group I ride with the most, I try to ride courteously at all times. I hang back on climbs and wait until the slower rider indicates it's OK to pass. I then say thankyou. I tend to ride in all eeb groups, but occassionally go out with my local club who are all on clockwork bikes. I've become the official gate guy because I can hit boost and shoot ahead to open them and catch up after closing them again. A couple of them have used me for pace setting on long climbs and I'm more than happy to help.

I accept that not everyone is like that, but unlike some on here I also accept that ebikers aren't the only ones who can be dicks.

You won't see any threads complaining about being held up on EMTBForums.com but some of the FaceBook groups do seem to be full of dicks.

I did briefly visit some eMTB forums and groups and left fairly rapidly due to the derogatory comments and poor attitudes towards people riding normal MTBs. It did feel horribly Clarkson-esque...

You definitely get hardcore MTBers who are either really quick uphill, downhill or both, who bring a similar “I own the trails, get out of my way!” approach but there aren’t so many of them because it takes a lot of hard work and talent to get that quick.

EEEEEEEEEhhhhh. Took 4 hours for this thread to go full STW. I'm dissapointed in that. Must try harder and faster, people.

It’s not an bike thing its an idiot thing. I’m 55 been riding ebikes for a good few years now and have never had a bad word said. You can pass someone on the trail and they hate it but then they are probably the person that gets back to the car park and thinks its ok to park in a disabled bay. Idiots are idiots and they ride both ebikes and MTB’s its not exclusive to this sport, you only have to look at the local football match, it’s usually good for a punch up every other match or to, even saw it watching speedway once. They just need to grow the **** up.

I agree that it's not a bike thing but an idiot thing @Captain-Pugwash. I made that clear in my post.

The problem is that ebikes/motorbikes on cycling trails brings amplifies the idiocy because it gives the idiots much more capacity to bring their idiocy to many more people in one ride. And it also adds volume to the idiocy - because it brings idiots to the party that wouldn't have otherwise been there.

I consider those above two things to be utterly uncontroversial. They're just self-evident statements of fact.

@Scienceofficer - it's not intolerance. It's a reaction to bad things happening that didn't previously happen. If the bad things weren't happening, nobody would be blinking. But they are.

Yeah. He thought he was in the right too.

You single out ebikes as the route cause, when ****s are the route cause. Zeroing in on the wrong thing is always a problem for binary thinkers.

Also, I didn't compare you to Hitler - best you brush up on your comprehension.

It is a new low.

If I had someone that wasn't my pal/kids tyre tapping me, I would pull over promptly. Like hit the brakes quickly. That's why you keep some distance, no?

Seen a lot of ebikes at Sherwood, riding my Five around there trying to keep up with a mate on a single speed and failing. Only heard of one incident which was on that same ride, a guy swearing at everyone in his way, even families. He was not on an ebike though. He also was seen later about to get into fisticuffs with someone, no doubt due to his behaviour. My mate tried to calm both parties down, ended up with sweary guy riding off, shouting obscenities of course. I am also an ebike owner, own it for fun and it does make Sherwood much more fun as it is a pedal fest.

To even out my ebike ownership card, I also ride my road/gravel bike in the mudfest currently surrounding where I live. I do fall into the out of shape ebike owner though, but I don't behave like a complete *expletive*. I'll never understand that mindset.

Didn't tyre buzzing on descents at trail centres happen before E-bikes?

I'd only ride them in the week after work or first thing/last thing at the weekends.

Same as popular walks.

Godwin's law? The thread is only two pages in.

Ha Ha, great stuff.

Everyone else should have to earn their place on the trails.

Statements like this mark you out as a bit of a bellend.
Along with confusing Ebikes with motorbikes.

The problem is that, in the general population, a certain number of people are idiots.
This also applies to any given sub-grouping of the general population.
MTB riders are not exempt from this.
A rider buzzing your back tyre would probably do it, regardless of whether they were riding an e-bike or not.
They probably drive their car in the same, inconsiderate, way.

Don't blame to mode of transport - it is merely an idiot amplifier

It'll be the same type of idiots who ruined it for everyone else to be able to wild camp around Loch Lomond.

Idiots are a minority but a major pain in the arse for everyone else.

MOre times than not it’s a rider using every e power that buzzes my tyre at sherwood. IS there something about the place that causes riders of those bikes being to check manners in at the door?

its because they dont know they are idiots
or have been brought up so badly they dont know how rude they are
Ebikes allow access to areas and speeds that used to be the domain of the competant or advanced mtber
Now every tom, dick an harry with a credit card can whizz up climbs out in the middle of nowhere . Pre ebikes if you were an hour from a car park and a rider came up at a rate of knots you knew , for sure they were tasty , would be past you safely when its safe for both riders and say 'thanks , have great day'
Not any more , 20 marlboros a day and 6 pints of Stella the night before and paddy the plasterer can beat Julian Absolon up to the mast at GT
I dont get the need for buzzing a tyre tho , words would be had if you try that stuff on me .Ask for a gap when its safe and im not off into a nettlebed or brambles then no worries

and dont get me started on trail errosion , braking late and skiddin into uphill corners just because you have a turbo button . your in the wrong sport if thats you.
my ebikes faster than your ebike . no . one . cares .

Its a simple matter of etiquette and respect and some e-bikers are just arseholes, barging past like its a Redbull foxhunt, just hang back and pick your moment to overtake and be friendly and vocal about it, like we do on the descents, I wouldn't dream of riding up a weaker riders arse unannounced then almost scrape elbows as I pass by but some e-bikers think having a battery gives them a special privilege.
Its a bit like those joggers on the pavement who for some reason think its acceptable to silently come up from behind and miss you by inches even when 1000 people a day are dying of covid, I always end up shouting dickhead at them and totally justified in doing so.

My question is, are normal bikes now called 'clockwork bikes' by ebikers? And if so why, as that would surely indicate they are 'wind up'?

and dont get me started on trail errosion , braking late and skiddin into uphill corners just because you have a turbo button . your in the wrong sport if thats you.

Or see every Joe Barnes/Dudes of Hazzard video when exactly the same thing is happening on every downhill.

I do sympathise with anyone who has been knocked off by ANY faster/inconsiderate riders, but this has always happened since trail centres became popular. Human beings are @r$eholes.
Do the ebike haters also think that enduro bikes should be banned from trail centres? By similar logic they allow less skilled people to go faster on downhills and ride trails they wouldn’t other wise be able to handle.

As a responsible ebiker I hope that we are just in a state of adjustment. It is easy to forget the speed differential on climbs especially if the ebike rider has never been to a trail centre on a normal MTB. Also, for future trail building do the builders need to factor more passing opportunities into climbs?

Just wow! The only time I've had anybody tyre buzz me was in a race and that wound me up as there was plenty of room to pass, they just didn't want to get on the slightly slower grass to do it.
I think if a stranger did that to me on ride without numberboards there'd be a reaction which would depend on how much energy I had left and what sort of day I'd had.

Very rarely have issues with ebikes, there was a chap that clipped me on the way past as he misjudged the speed difference on the climb and a chap who block passed me at the bottom of a fire road climb so I lost all my momentum from the descent.

To the OP, totally ridiculous example of stupidity you witnessed.
I do get the feeling that some riders on e bikes feel you should just get out of their way, either on road or the trails. It is easy to go fast with a motor (some seem to have them deregulated, certainly on the road side), I am not saying there are not fast talented riders on ebikes. However some clearly lack a lot including any decency.
As pointed out earlier in the thread an idiot is an idiot no matter what they are doing.

Wow, i best be careful Sherwood pines is my local, I ride an ebike and I live in Mansfield.
When I catch a slower rider I wait behind till they acknowledge me and let me past, what is the proper etiquette ? I don’t have a bell so can’t ring that, do I shout excuse me please ? In the past I’ve tried the good morning can I pass when you’re ready but I’ve had replies from no, to **** off to yeah no problem. So now I don’t ask in case it’s someone aggressive, maybe it just proves there are idiots on all sorts of bikes. It can be a problem as pines is very suited to an ebike and fast in places and clockwork bikes are always slower, but idiots will be idiots it’s not related to the bike they’re on.

Yep @singletrackmind.

Personally I feel that if the reason you’re catching up with someone on a trail that was built for MTBs, is that you have a motor, then you should slow down and give them space, unless they’re so kind that they wave you by as soon as they hear you coming.

If not, every non-E MTBer is going to end up getting annoyed with motorised bikes turning up and interrupting their flow by asking to overtake. And as someone who likes his ebike as much as his non-E hardtail, I don’t want that happening.

and clockwork bikes are always slower, but idiots will be idiots it’s not related to the bike they’re on.

In the same way a car is faster than walking.

In all the years I've been riding, all over the country nobody has ever reacted badly to being asked if I can pass. So either it's a reaction to the ebike or its you or its bs.

Must try harder and faster, people.

It's not an e-thread this is human powered.

I have to say, if someone I didn't know deliberately buzzed my rear wheel (If I knew them I'd know it was just for a laugh) there would be some serious words exchanged. They'd be left in no doubt what I thought of them. And I'd feel better with myself for having done it rather than just fuming under my breath. That said, in close on 20 yrs of biking I've never had any such incident (commuting aside 🙂 ).

I always keep an ear\eye out for faster riders (regardless of bike type) and pull aside where possible to let them pass. Will just politely ask to pass if I come up on a slower rider who hasn't noticed me.

People referring to buzzing...is this literal or metaphorical?

I refuse to believe that so many people are actually making tyre to tyre contact as mentioned in this thread. Surely not.

As for the guy who mentioned it downhill.... double refuse to believe it.

I always keep an ear\eye out for faster riders (regardless of bike type) and pull aside where possible to let them pass

Yep, always keep an ear out too and in all honesty if I look at the bike on its way past, my ego is much happier if I see a motor.

In the same way a car is faster than walking.

In all the years I’ve been riding, all over the country nobody has ever reacted badly to being asked if I can pass. So either it’s a reaction to the ebike or its you or its bs.

You only have to look at replies here some folk really hate an ebike, I don’t care tbh I just ride my bike and I’m always polite. If someone has a problem with me or my bike it’s just that it’s their problem, they won’t get a reaction from me.

Just like with dangerous dogs, its usually the owner that's the problem not the bike, if you are respectful and friendly on an ebike nobody has an issue with you or the bike.

I suppose you're going to be passing more people so will have higher odds of meeting a ****, the world is full of them.
The only way to know for sure is to get an e-bike and see if people get upset when I ask to pass or play a whirring sound like a false exhaust note in a modern car.

There’s plenty of slow folk on ebikes too, when I drag a friend round on his human bike we pass plenty of ebikes as he’s one of the quickest human riders and he likes the challenge of chasing me on my ebike. The look of confusion on some ebike riders faces as an XC bike passes them is ace, no aggression though.
Maybe they’re confused riders on both bikes can be friends 🤣

I don't ride trail centres for various reasons, just personal choice mainly.

On the natural trails I ride I get overtaken a fair amount which is fine by me and most riders do give me a heads up.... probably as I'm wobbling all over the place mainly.

If someone buzzed my rear wheel my instinct would probably be to slam the anchors on right away as I'd assume I'd just broken the bike.Lol

In summary, probably best not to buzz my tyre, not because I'm a trail warrior but because I'll likely have us both face down in the dirt.😁

I had a situation like this on the blue trail at QE Park. Me and my son were taking 4 new riders round the blue trail, my lad was at the front, I was at the back. Prick came up behind pissing and moaning about how slow we were going. I told him why we were slow and to **** off to the red trail if he didn't like it. He still pissed and moaned, so I called him a few names and told the lads to pull over so the **** could pass. If he'd been so inclined it probably could have resulted in fisty-cuffs... though I didn't really fancy his chances cos the 4 new riders were all 17 year old rugby players, a couple of em quite large lads 😆
ebikes were not involved in this incident, just ****s. Yeah, I'm one, so don't piss me off 😀

Just like with dangerous dogs, its usually the owner that’s the problem not the bike, if you are respectful and friendly on an ebike nobody has an issue with you or the bike.

Very much this.

That being said ebikes have grown the sport in ways a bit more suspension travel, an extra gear or two or different wheel size have never done.  Rule of averages states that some of those new riders will be pricks. It’s just now you will come into contact with them as they are probably passing you on a climb.

Sherwood and Cannock are my local trail centres and I have had loads of interactions with ebikes most are fine but as with all user groups, some interactions are unpleasant.

I’ve got nothing against ebikes, but how the hell do people afford them? I’d never buy one because I’m extremely shallow (and could never justify the price) when it comes to how a bike looks and they all, without exception, look ****ing terrible.

Can I just ask, is this an e-bike hate thread, or an idiot hate thread ? I’m not sure.

I don't think it's either, it's a basic etiquette thread, I've caught up with other riders on trails before (no really), depending on whether we're towards the start of say a fun Red or nearing the end of a trail I will either shout "Rider" / "on your Right" if the opportunity presents itself or just hang back a tad and give them some space... If I do get past always give a "cheers" or "thanks" shout.

The one thing I would never do is buzz some poor bugger's rear tyre, that's unmistakable ****tery...

You don't know the person, their ability, fatigue level or temperament and you're basically giving them a little suprise punt that could have you both off depending on their reaction... FFS!

Is this really a thing people do at trailcentres now? I've not been to one in a while...

On reflection, I can't tell if it's an ebike rider behind me asking to get past or a good rider asking to get past, until they are close enough to see or hear the motor/belly.

So I don't buy people resenting ebikes trying to get past.

I’ve got nothing against ebikes, but how the hell do people afford them?

I'm partly on [b]chevychase[/b]'s side, and partly not. E-bikes are absolutely an amplifier of crap behaviour, and allow people access to locations they wouldn't have otherwise been able to.

On the other hand, without one my other half wouldn't be able to, or even want to come riding with me, and it wouldn't have re-ignited her love for cycling. She's courteous and polite on the trails, and only uses enough assist that we're going the same speed uphill. So I'm conflicted.

I’ll likely have us both face down in the dirt.😁

It's your special skill, why not share it? 😀

I clearly don't visit trail centres enough to have this happen to me. All my interactions with ebikes in the real world have been pleasant enough. I'm always delighted to see the bottom bracket lump when someone charges past me on a climb, because it means that I wasn't just ground into the dirt by a non-powered rider!

Anyone else's reaction on being overtaken to have a glance at the crank area? 🙂

I'd just like to observe that I can only remember ebikers being courteous or even apologetic when passing me. Perhaps people are more friendly in the north?

And the only tyre buzzing that's acceptable in my book is to wind your friends up.

But is conflict between ebikers and MTBers inevitable when we're using the same trail network (thinking of trail centres here) and have very different speeds on climbs, and sometimes on the flat?

Just like we see tension between cyclists and walkers or sometimes horseriders on RoWs.

There are a lot of newcomers on both eebs and MTBs, and I know there's been discussion about the need for more education on etiquette. We may see something to that end this year, but personally I wonder if the "be nice, say hi" messaging via social media is perhaps more effective than a list of "rules".

Here's the thing some people don't need E Bikes to act like a dick it just comes naturally to them regardless 🙄

Are there maybe two issues about Ebikes that people are mainly thinking about? Does it encourage some normally (fairly) considerate people to get carried away and ride a bit more aggressively? Secondly, do Ebikes mean that a subset of plonkers who would never normally ride mountain bikes are now on the trails?

The former may well apply to an extent and often does with cars. I like to think I’m fairly logical and have pretty good self control but I’m still a flawed human being. I drive our van or our slower car and being a steady, very courteous driver is simple. Take the bonkers car out and it takes a real conscious effort to be a nice human being 100% of the time. Coming from a car background, lots of trackdays, sprints, hill climbs etc, lots of my friends are the same. Could it apply to Ebikes too? And clearly it’s not everyone.

For the latter, there may be lots of new plonkers but who knows? Impressions and individual experiences probably won’t give us any concrete answers. By far the largest proportion of bell ends I come across on bikes are of the E variety but then again I’ve chatted to lots of really nice Ebike owners 🙂

Personally, I think we need a lot more emphasis on etiquette for all trail users, not just bikers, whatever the persuasion. Same as in general society, behavioural frameworks can help us all get along that much better and avoid needless conflict.

Christ. If this is what popular riding spots and trail centres have become then I'll never go back to one.
E-bikes will attract all different kinds of riders, but some will be the lazy gits that want a dirt bike buzz without the effort and won't give a c**p about anyone or anything than themselves.
Too many of them will be the death of trail centres, too many of them on public rights of way could be the end of cycling on bridleways.

“ I’ve got nothing against ebikes, but how the hell do people afford them?”

This comment would make a lot more sense if people were having problems with super yacht owners buzzing their rear tyre, and pondering where they get the money for their multimillion pound boat.

But when the price difference between an alloy full-sus and the same in carbon is as much as the cost of adding a motor and battery, then...

A ebike costs less than the first year depreciation on an average new car.