DJI’s bike brand has significantly upped its game when comes to the bike attached its E. As for the motor? Blimey.
- Brand: Amflow
- Product: PX Carbon Pro
- Price: £8,999
- From: Amflow Bikes
- Tested by: Benji for 1 week
Why do I say “game over, man”? Well, apart from any old reason to feature Bill Paxton’s Aliens catchphrase on Singletrackworld, there’s a whole host of things that could be potentially done away with due to arrival of this bike. Or specifically, the Avinox M2S motor contained within it.
With a frankly ridiculous amount of power – 1,500 watts of peak power and 150Nm of peak torque – there will understandably be a lot of folk who will be worried about the future of e-bikes being classed in the same arena as pedal bikes. Although electric motorbikes, such as the much-despised Surrons, have quite a bit more power in terms of watts (around 6000 watts or more) some of the more popular ones ‘only’ have around 250Nm of torque. So in terms of where it counts offroad, the Avinox M2S motor is not a million miles away in torque.
Needless to say, we here are Singletrack are concerned. We don’t think that general trail access for acoustic bicycles is at risk at all. But it does feel like e-bikes are in danger of getting a clumsily imposed blanket ban if we’re not careful. I’m not going to go any more into the matter much in this review. We’ll be addressing the debate very shortly elsewhere.
What I will categorically state is that DJI didn’t have to do this. It already has by far the best ebike system out there, regardless of power. It has the best interface, the best rider response, the best range, the best weight. Some brands may equal certain aspects of DJI’s system but none better it, anywhere. Should any new regulations come in to limit ebike power, Avinox would still be the class leader. It does almost feel like it’s “game over, man” for DJI’s motor rivals. In riding terms, why would you opt for another system?
DJI really didn’t need to stick in the new ‘SuperMario mode’ 1500 peak power. Nothing being used as a bicycle really benefits from having such high levels of power. Tyres struggle for traction, trails get ripped to shreds, it can very hard to keep the front wheel down. Such power makes no sense on an off-road bicycle. The only place where the Avinox M2S’s top power was vaguely applicable was on tarmac or similar metalled surface.
Now, here’s the thing…
I think the Amflow PX Carbon Pro is the best off-road bicycle I’ve ever ridden. I almost wish that it wasn’t. It would be easier to have the aforementioned debate if the bike wasn’t up to snuff (which the MK1 Amflow PL wasn’t in my opinion).
After a couple of rides with the assistance left un-tweaked I was finding even the system’s ‘Auto’ level of assist to be shove-y and front wheel lifty. So via the Avinox Ride app (which is also undeniably brilliant by the way) I reduced the M2S motor’s top end power. I settled on limits of 800 watts and 100Nm of torque – coincidentally (ahem) the same sort of figures mooted to be followed in any future eeb regulations.
The result? Amazing. Simply amazing. As powerful as any rival system currently available but way, way, WAY more intuitive and unintrusive. Like the very best things in the history of bicycling technology, the motor felt like an extension of yourself. An amplification of you, not a replacement or interruption.
And it doesn’t really have much in the way of compromise in terms of the Holy Trinity of Eebs: power, range, weight. It has more power than you need, a battery with stunning range (even when not being ‘nursed’) and the bike seen here weighs 21.3kg. Yes, even with Schwalbe Gravity Pro tyres shod front and rear. As I’ve said before, mountain bikes that weigh around 20kg are the best handling mountain bikes. Loads more traction than sub-20kg bikes but still easily manouvrable and wholly without the scary running-away-from-you panic moments when things aren’t quite going the way you expected/want/need them to.
I need to stop talking about the e-stuff. What about the bike stuff of the bike?
For anyone familiar with the previous generation Amflow bikes, the new models are quite a step up in my opinion. Although the ‘stock’ geometry is relatively on the conservative side of things, the shortened seat tube length and improved dropper insertion are both extremely welcome changes that massively open up the capability of the bike. There’s also the move to a mixed wheelsize mullet layout, of which I am a big fan of (provided the chainstays aren’t too short).
The other two excellent aspects about the new Amflow PX are the suspension adjustment options and the improved rear suspension. Details are scarce on the precise details of the rear suspension changes but it feels way more sensitive and yet supportive than the previous layout (reduced anti-squat and a less hammocky leverage curve maybe?).
As for the geometry adjustment, Amflow has seemingly taken (yet another) page out of Specialized’s Stumpjumper recipe. You can mess about with three general dimensions. Firstly, head angle. Via +/- push-in headset upper cup you can slacken the head angle to 63.2°. Secondly, you can change the chainstay length via a set of flip chips offering four positions (0-10mm). Thirdly, it took me a while to find them, you can flip the chips in the shock yoke to run the BB at two different heights. And yes, through a combination of all the flip chips you can run a 29in wheel in the back should you wish.
For those of you more familiar with my review rantings, it will come as no surprise that I ended up running the geometry in the slackest, lowest and longest settings possible. With a super low BB height (sub 330mm by my eye) I still never had an issue with pedal strikes. That’ll be partly due top the 155mm length cranks (M and L frame sizes, 160mm on XL and XXL).
Which brings us to the specification. I can’t remember a bike with a better chosen spec than this one. Even the cockpit is great (35mm stem, 40mm rise bars, actually nice grips). The Magura Gustav Pro brakes are excellent. The Schwalbe Radial tyres are fabulous. Amflow’s own carbon wheels are something of an unknown in terms of reliability but so far, so fast. And I get on well with the Fox 36 and Float X suspension combo. Amflow’s own saddle was fine. The one and only thing I would change is the dropper and that’s because I could fit a 210mm travel dropper in there (instead of the 190mm supplied).
Overall
Whilst more time on the bike is required before I come out with an overall verdict and star rating, there’s no getting away from the fact that the new Amflow PX is a significant bike. I imagine the first batch have all been sold by the time you finish reading this. As well as being a significant bike in terms of the headline-grabbing hand-wringing levels of power – that is entirely needless and (dare I say) potentially reckless – the Amflow PX is just a fantastic thing to do mountain biking on. For me, it’s at its best once it’s been tweaked: turn the power down, flip those geometry chips and prepare to have the time of your life out there.
Amflow PX Carbon: £6,499
Amflow PX Carbon Pro: £8,999
P.S. there’s also the Amflow PR Carbon…
Also announced today is the Amflow PR Carbon model which is estimated to be available later this year. The PR Carbon has an Avinox M2 motor and a removable 800Wh battery. It weighs around 2kg more than the equivalent Amflow PX Carbon. The M2 motor gives out a peak power of 1,100W and peak torque of 125Nm. A 600Wh battery option is also available which can either be run on its own in the downtube or be mounted externally on the bike frame as a range extender. The geometry of the Amflow PR Carbon is slightly different to the PX (slightly shorter reach, higher BB, slacker seat angle etc). Which we’ll cover in tomorrow’s Fresh Goods Friday.
Amflow PR Carbon: £3,999
Amflow PR Carbon Pro: £5,399
Amflow PX Carbon Pro specification
- Frame // Carbon, 150mm
- Shock // Fox Float X Factory, 210x55mm
- Fork // Fox Float 36 Factory GRIP X2, 160mm
- Wheels // Amflow XMC-30 Carbon w/ alloy hubs
- Front Tyre // Schwalbe Magic Mary Radial Gravity Pro 29×2.5
- Rear Tyre // Schwalbe Albert Radial Gravity Pro 27.5×2.5
- Chainset // Avinox SL, 155mm (Large), 38T
- Brakes // Magura Gustav Pro, 203/203mm
- Drivetrain // SRAM Eagle XO Transmission
- Stem // Amflow Mountain Bike Split 35, 35mm
- Handlebars // Amflow Enduro Carbon 35, 800x40mm
- Grips // Amflow Enduro Grip 2 Lock-on
- Seat Post // Amflow dropper, 31.6mm, 190mm (Large)
- Saddle // Amflow Mountain Saddle Titanium
- Sizes Available // M, L, XL, XXL
- Size Tested // L
- Weight // 21.3kg
Geometry of our size Large
- Head angle // 63.2-65.2°
- Effective seat angle // 78°
- Seat tube length // 427mm
- Head tube length // 120mm
- Chainstay // 438-451mm
- Wheelbase // 1,259mm
- Effective top tube // 619mm
- BB height // 333-345mm
- Reach // 478mm
Is one person on an ebike doing 5 laps worse than 5 people doing 1 lap?
Or five people doing five laps?
You are being deliberately disingenuous with that comparison. Multiple ebikers will be easily able to do massively more laps than an equivalent number of riders without motors.
It is pretty clear in my local woods where this has happened as the erosion is getting more and more significant as the number of ebikes increase. Amusingly the more techy trails don’t seem to be touched as much though, wonder why?
They’re rubbish trails? The techy stuff around here sees just as much traffic from both human and electric powered bikes.
“Massively" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there. So should people on ebikes be limited to a set number of laps?
It’s obvious that a heavier, more powerful bike, usually with bigger, chunkier tyres, will transmit more force to the ground and therefore cause more erosion. It’s simple physics. I’m not anti-ebike per se, but don’t claim that they don’t cause more wear and tear, even on a single run.
Having watched a few vids now, for the avg rider there is no other bike to look at.
The features to price is so good and it looks ok as well.
23kg weight and removable battery is nuts. The fact you can take the battery out is a major selling point in itself let alone everything else
I wonder if some companies will go bust? Just proves how over charged we have all been in the past for emtbs
Having spoken to a few people who ride Amflows the power is a first ‘gimmick’ but then after a while they don’t use all the power day to day.
Use all the power and they do drain the battery quickly but that’s common sense ?
I don’t think these types of bike attract Surron type people. However at £4K they are going to attract people who get their first emtb.
That could mean lots of trail damage as people use full power and do lots of damage going uphill
Llandegla say they are seeing more and more damage to trails from e-bikes. This can be seen on sections of boardwalk with chicken wire and the wire is completely ruined due to powerful e-bikes , yet they themselves have started selling Amflows!
I help maintain some local steep trails and we’re all on ebikes. What we’ve noticed is theres more people turning up every few weeks in vans with their ebikes, lapping out the tralis on boost, then presumably going off somewhere else to do the same. This was trickier before, the trails were so steep you’d hardly get any laps in, plus you’d need to get to know them too which is tricky if you’re having to ride/push up each time to explore.I guess if you can do multiple laps easily you get bored more quicky of local stuff than before. I don’t think the overall weight matters much, its only 8kg or so difference, compared to 100kg or whatever for bike+rider.I think its just the extra use.
Are you even a mountain biker if you don’t make MX noises when you ride?
A mate of mine who partakes in ebike made a salient point that they take some of the fun out of riding. You are constantly just bashing uphill as quickly as possible to get to the next downhill adrenaline hit that it takes the fun out the uphills & pedalling generally.
Not all of us. I like to find technical climbs to see if I can clean them, which doesn’t necessarily meaning going full beans. I also enjoy long boring fireroad climbs now, which again don’t have to be at full pelt.
I’d argue a more salient point is fun means different things to different people.
Techy climbs that are too long and/or steep to get up on the Hightower, I’ve never had any interest in climbing other than as a way of accessing downhill trails. Since buying the ebike (which is heavy at over 27kg) I regularly do climbs that I’d have avoided or used a longer/easier way up and have actually enjoyed doing so. Having said that, I don’t really see the need to jump from my current bikes 750w/ 85nm output to the latest high powered Avinox bikes to hit the market as I think the power of mine is more than enough and I’ve seen a few reviews so far that imply the Avinox motor performs better/ more efficiently when the power is turned down
I wouldn’t agree that it’s the “fun" taken out.. there’s a certain amount of reward that goes with eMTBing. I didn’t like the feeling after my first few rides, but once I’d adapted my mindset, there are different aspects of ebiking that are rewarding. And there’s definitely fun. Oh no-one ever mentions FUN when it comes to talking about ebikes do they?! lol
Also, ebike threads .. this isn’t even an ebike thread! its a STW (p)review of the new Amflow Bikes and goes on to turn into the usual debate about why ride ebikes, what damage they do, why they’re fun, why they’re not fun…. can’t we just have a sticky thread that goes round and round and round discussing the same old stuff..??
I find statements like this bizarre.
the singular point of a e-bike is to reduce or replace the effort required to propel a bicycle forwards.
within that framework, there is choice on much or how little assistance to utilise.
your mate is the master of how much enjoyment he can get from uphill and pedalling.
I have the (old) Amflow PL and 90% of the time I am in Auto mode, mixed with Eco mode if I am on my own. Trail gets used a little and Turbo even less. I have never found the need to use the Boost mode, I’m actual nervous that I’ll injure myself with that power.I can easily get 30km+ and 1000m+ of climb and use less than 50% of the battery on my average spin.
@Theomen Its post like that the people need more of , just a simple headsup why they are good for what they are , get out have a ride ,enjoy yourself .. nowt else matters .
I find that ‘power hour’ culture odd. You can go full beans turbo everywhere, theres no need to get your breath back at the top of a climb as there is on an analogue. If you’re squeezing a ride in between family/work/other commitments I kind of get it – you can burn a battery on Sunday morning and get home for lunch. But I like riding all day. Stopping, chatting, taking in the view is all part of pleasure of being out on a bike (which is probably why I’ve always been happy on a ‘half fat’ bike, though tempted by a full so that I can keep up with the no-stops crew. I suspect on an Amflow I’d end up having a pootle mode that lasted all day though.