I live in a fairly deprived area of the South East, and can get a dentist appointment within 2 days and a GP visit within 24 hours. Same applied when I used to live in a dinky town in Devon. So the system works for me. Where are you living that it doesn’t?

I suspect if they charged a small fee, say £5, for a GP appointment, you’d suddenly find there were a lot more free slots…..

What happens then is moderately affluent/comfortable people expect to be able to demand services – because they are paying for them (even though it doesn’t cover the admin cost of the appointment never mind the Doc’s time), and the genuinely unfortunate don’t go to see the dr. That might mean chronically ill people on low (or no) income don’t go to see dr as often, their treatment is compromised and we all pay for trying to sort our a mess in the end OR it might mean that the genuinely very sick put off going because either as an extra excuse (lets face it nobody was ever keen to get “that” lump checked anyway) or because they are a bit skint and ‘will go next week after I have been paid’.

As for the OP:

The rest of the NHS work shifts whats the GPs excuse ?

well they don’t really; a lot of hospital staff work M-F 9-5, in fact usually only where there is a compelling clinical need do they work 24/7.

And think of all the extra cash the GPs could earn in overtime…

Well, the pot is only so big so for the Dr to earn extra you’ll need to pay in more. Do you want to do that for someone who is already living a very comfortable lifestyle?

World would be a healthier place…

would it? there is already out of hours provisions where it is needed urgently. If you are sick enough to need a dr, then surely you are sick enough to miss some work time to do so?

I also think normal GP appointments should be available in the evening. The majority of folk work and getting to an appointment when you don’t work shifts is getting harder and harder.

franksinatra – Member

This may be a little controversial, but how about priority slots and quicker treatment for people who currently work?

What about older people who have worked all of their lives and are now drawing on the NHS that they have contributed to all of their lives?

Or genuinely ill people who would love to work but are unable to?

Kind of not getting my point. This is about current funding of the NHS and current contributions to make things better – not whatever has gone on in the past.

Pensioners no longer contribute anywhere near as much as people who currently work so by treating people who currently work (or of working age) faster to help them get back to work more quickly, then there would be more money in the NHS (and the UK) full stop since more hours worked = more tax paid. The resulting additional NHS funding would then benefit the said same pensioners and genuinely ill people who have previously contributed in the past or would like to contribute in the future.

I also think normal GP appointments should be available in the evening. The majority of folk work and getting to an appointment when you don’t work shifts is getting harder and harder.

But the majority of people who need to see the doctor don’t need to be at work. The vast majority of GP appointments are required for the elderly, the unemployed, people who are too ill to work and children.

So with the exception of children who are in full time childcare so their parents can work then is very little genuine demand for non 9 to 5, non emergency appointments. Therefore nobody is willing to pay the extra cost of this.

However this is changing, more and more GPs are offering late evenings, early mornings, and saturdays. If yours doesn’t, then switch GPs. They are business trying to make money and if the lose patients then they will change the service they offer.

what I don’t get is if so many people don’t turn up for appointments how come you still have to wait 30/40 minutes even if you arrive at the time specified, WHY do they over subscribe the appointments? I have never ever been to a GP’s appointment and been seen at the time the appointment is for. The same with vets but I really do get angry there because you’re paying directly for the service.

Ohhh I’ll have a grumble..

I asked for an appt at my local surgery, always very good service from the guys and gals there, 2 weeks I got told, erm.. but I’m ill now, no idea if I will be in 2 weeks.

I know quite a few Docs and nearly all of them are not in it for the money. 😉

If you are sick enough to need a dr, then surely you are sick enough to miss some work time to do so?

(lets face it nobody was ever keen to get “that” lump checked anyway)

ill people on low (or no) income don’t go to see dr as often, their treatment is compromised and we all pay for trying to sort our a mess in the end

🙄

You people asking for appointments – don’t they do open surgeries for you?

I never make an appointment, I just turn up at 9 and wait.

franksinatra & jfletch: click & scroll…

http://jobs.gponline.com/jobs/out-of-hours

I regularly speak with OOH GPs on those wages.

what I don’t get is if so many people don’t turn up for appointments how come you still have to wait 30/40 minutes even if you arrive at the time specified

Because you all talk for a lot longer than 10 minutes… 😉

Why dont GPs work shifts?

Short answer: Because they don’t have to.

There’s an even stronger case that hopsitals should have more doctors on staff over weekends – when death rates have been shown to rise among patients.

franksinatra & jfletch: click & scroll…

http://jobs.gponline.com/jobs/out-of-hours

I regularly speak with OOH GPs on those wages.

Yep, all of the £100 per hour posts are for locums/sessional GP’s. Proves my point exactly.

Ahh you got me on a technicality – it’s what i meant but didn’t say. Yes they’re locums – but they’re still GPs, no?

Still a shed load of money for a nights work!!!

Went into my local GPs a couple of weeks ago to make an appt. Was told that it would be at least a week, but they could do a Saturday appt if that suited me.

I arrived on the Saturday about 10 mins early, got called straight way and was out of the building before the actual original appt time 🙂

Ahh you got me on a technicality – it’s what i meant but didn’t say. Yes they’re locums – but they’re still GPs, no?

Yep, but same in a lot of industries. If you need temporary staff, at short notice, you pay premium rates for them. This is silly money though.

Still a shed load of money for a nights work!!!

It is, but it’s market forces (which our current Government love so much) in action.

franksinatra & jfletch: click & scroll…

http://jobs.gponline.com/jobs/out-of-hours

I regularly speak with OOH GPs on those wages.

They aren’t on those “wages”. They are contractor rates for a single days work (and even then you probably only get that in very specific circumstances). The GP doing this will have a load of expenses related to being able to work as a locum such as insurance, memebership fees, equipment, accountants fees, taxes etc.

When you compare that to £1000/day for an IT contractor it seems cheap really!

t is, but it’s market forces (which our current Government love so much) in action.

That, and poor management by local trusts / OOH providers that mean they have poor recruitment and retention of staff resulting in big gaps in rota that have to filled, at any cost.

Gp’s deserve every penny, can you imagine having to deal with all those old ladies and their problems? eugh! *shiver*

That, and poor management by local trusts / OOH providers that mean they have poor recruitment and retention of staff resulting in big gaps in rota that have to filled, at any cost.

Yep – if you want to stop some people getting paid £1000/day then you need to pay the rest more money so those oportunties when a gap needs to be filled don’t arrise.

Same scenario as outsourcing IT expertise. It might seem obscene to pay someone £1000/day but it works out cheaper than having more expensive staff all year round, with the associated costs of emplying someone who may become surplus to requirements in the future.

But people on here don’t see the issue with a private business paying through the nose for an IT contractor but do have an issue with the government using the same reasoning with a doctor. Madness.

Turn up and wait at 9:00am? I’d still be sat there next week!
I’ve just been to get my emergency prescription (great work by my new surgery) and a lady was having a right rant because she’d turned up for appointment 20 minutes after it was set for and the GP couldn’t now see her. Some people’s sense of entitlement is astonishing.

Gp’s deserve every penny, can you imagine having to deal with all those old ladies and their problems? eugh! *shiver*

This.

Next time you speak to a GP, don’t ask what they get paid, ask how many old ladies fannies and diseased todgers they have seen that day and how many bums they have had their finger up.

Perks of the job Shirley? 😛

Speaking to patients who think they know best. Patients demanding anti biotics for a virus or a piffly sniffle. Patients who demand everything right now. Speaking to druggies, speaking to people willing killing themselves by choosing not to diet or give up the booze/fags. Having the constant worry that someone who wants something for nothing will complain about you as you’ve not referred them for an MRI for their stubbed toe

The general public are ***** and I’d hate to be a GP.

I struggle with long sentences

However – phoned my GP surgery at 12.42 and have an appointment for my daughter at 14.50.

This suggests it’s, as many things, down to where you live.

Houns gets it.

The public, particularly those who think they are educated have certain expectations from primary care, in other words they think they know best.

This weekend i had somebody instruct me i had to take his wife away as she was mad and as her husband he felt he had the power to request this (he didnt and she was fine)….it didnt stop him causing a scene, spouting some old tosh about legal rights etc etc, eventually the police got rid of this gonad.

I had a mother worried about the fever and croupy cough her child had, the hospital had seen her the day before and given her the steroids used for croup and advice on use of Calpol for temperature control….needless to say mum knew best and decided that ‘she doesnt like giving her children medication’ and was now demanding that something be done for her poorly child….she was told to stop playing silly buggers and start using the meds she’d been given for the croup, she didnt like this and was sure something else could be done…(a shotgun to her face seemed the kindest thing frankly).

Dealing with patients who are grateful for the care and willing to listen to advice is hugely satisfying, its why a lot of us work in health care….but there seems to be a small but growing percentage of the population who walk into the patient-clinician interaction with pre conceived ideas that they will not deviate from.

I wouldnt choose to work weekends either if i had the choice, weekdays are bad enough but once the weekend comes and people start with their social, family and alcohol problems it starts to become a very tedious job….my trust doesnt seem to want to back me when i proposed we start telling people to ‘harden the **** up’….

Have you considered a change of career Deviant?

Dave Hinde might be hiring customer service staff?

From my very limited knowledge and experience of GPs, i have never had an issue getting an appointment, nether has the SO.

But most people who use GPs are old, old people who don’t work. How many appointments do you actually need outside 9-5 working hours? On the basis of cost/benefit, does it actually make sense????

You people asking for appointments – don’t they do open surgeries for you?

I never make an appointment, I just turn up at 9 and wait.

I have a job; I can’t just not turn up because I’m sat in a GP waiting room.

But most people who use GPs are old, old people who don’t work. How many appointments do you actually need outside 9-5 working hours? On the basis of cost/benefit, does it actually make sense????

So, that’s even easier to provide. Just one evening a week and all those people with minor niggles can get seen before they turn into expensive complex issues.

And just because some patients are ****, doesn’t mean a lot of GP surgeries couldn’t be run a hell of a lot better.

Mine’s pretty good tbh, but recently made the town’s old folk queue down the street in the cold and rain to have their flu jabs instead of giving them individual appointments.

🙄

I have a job; I can’t just not turn up because I’m sat in a GP waiting room.

So you are fundamentally opposed to teachers altering their working paterns to suit modern working paterns but GPs should be permanently available 😕

Maybe you should go to the doctors in one of your 13 weeks of holiday? Unless you are ill, in which case why are you at work?

The public, particularly those who think they are educated have certain expectations from primary care, in other words they think they know best.

This weekend i had somebody instruct me i had to take his wife away as she was mad and as her husband he felt he had the power to request this (he didnt and she was fine)….it didnt stop him causing a scene, spouting some old tosh about legal rights etc etc, eventually the police got rid of this gonad.

I had a mother worried about the fever and croupy cough her child had, the hospital had seen her the day before and given her the steroids used for croup and advice on use of Calpol for temperature control….needless to say mum knew best and decided that ‘she doesnt like giving her children medication’ and was now demanding that something be done for her poorly child….she was told to stop playing silly buggers and start using the meds she’d been given for the croup, she didnt like this and was sure something else could be done…(a shotgun to her face seemed the kindest thing frankly).

Dealing with patients who are grateful for the care and willing to listen to advice is hugely satisfying, its why a lot of us work in health care….but there seems to be a small but growing percentage of the population who walk into the patient-clinician interaction with pre conceived ideas that they will not deviate from.

I wouldnt choose to work weekends either if i had the choice, weekdays are bad enough but once the weekend comes and people start with their social, family and alcohol problems it starts to become a very tedious job….my trust doesnt seem to want to back me when i proposed we start telling people to ‘harden the **** up’….

It cuts both ways. Imo there are GPs who need to stop 🙄 at their customers and realise that some do actually have intelligence and, indeed, may actually know more about their condition than their GP. I despise arrogance from the NHS. 😐

Let’s be honest CG. It would seem from your posts that you despise the NHS completely (for reasons you feel are valid).
Deviant – you should be running the country :-).

I have a job; I can’t just not turn up because I’m sat in a GP waiting room.

I find this a bit weird: surely you should be allowed to leave work for a couple of hours to visit the doctor? It’s not like you’re heading off to the pub for a quick pint!

So you are fundamentally opposed to teachers altering their working paterns to suit modern working paterns but GPs should be permanently available

No, I disagreed with your suggestion. I am happy for changes to be made in a considered way, but disagreed with your “I reckon” back-of-a-fag-packet suggestions that would have entailed fundamental changes to the entire way education was carried out, to enable people go take a cheap package holiday.

On this topic, I think it’d be quite helpful for many people if GP appointments could be made a couple of hours later one night a week. I’m quite happy for any GPs to tell me why this isn’t possible.

Maybe you should go to the doctors in one of your 13 weeks of holiday? Unless you are ill, in which case why are you at work?

I got an asthma check-up letter at the start of a ten week half-term; I’m not going to miss work just to go and blow into a tube a few times so had to leave it for ten weeks before I could go.

I find this a bit weird: surely you should be allowed to leave work for a couple of hours to visit the doctor? It’s not like you’re heading off to the pub for a quick pint!

Sadly, I have to be here when timetabled.

The real reason is because there is no such thing as an NHS GP. They are and always have been private sector providers who happen to have a contract to provide services to the NHS.

As a result they have no interest in extending their hours of provision as that would increase costs and reduce profits. It would of course be far better if GPs worked for the NHS rather than in the private sector but I dont think we are liekly to have a government of either colour prepared to take on the GP’s and their trade union as they are too well embedded in the establishment

On this topic, I think it’d be quite helpful for many people if GP appointments could be made a couple of hours later one night a week. I’m quite happy for any GPs to tell me why this isn’t possible.

Its perfectly possible, someone just needs to pay for it.

I got an asthma check-up letter at the start of a ten week half-term; I’m not going to miss work just to go and blow into a tube a few times so had to leave it for ten weeks before I could go.

So you delayed an non-urgent appointment until when it was convienient for you to go. I fail to see what the issue is.

Also as a teacher you may be timetabled for 10 weeks but that normally includes some free periods and your timetabled hours finish around 4pm. Plenty of time to go to the doctors who don’t finish till 6pm.

So really you are just being obstanate.

They are and always have been private sector providers who happen to have a contract to provide services to the NHS.

IIRC only since GPs resigned from the NHS en masse in 1966, but otherwise this is correct.

Although I can see the motive, I hate it when I phone for an appointment for the same day and get asked “is it a medical emergency?”
Obviously if it was an “emergency” I’d be in an ambulance on the way to hospital.
I made the mistake of saying “no” once and then got told the next available appointment would be in a week’s time.