Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 117 total)
  • Why dont GPs work shifts and open all day Mon-Sat 8to8
  • unfitgeezer
    Free Member

    The rest of the NHS work shifts whats the GPs excuse ? Rest of the NHS got families so that cant be it, enlighten me ? And think of all the extra cash the GPs could earn in overtime…

    World would be a healthier place…

    I fully expect to get shouted at abused etc…. But I “could” be sitting on the fence and just starting a debate…

    MSP
    Full Member

    Most decent practices will have some early morning and evening cover.

    However if your just a bit ill, then get down there in office hours if its an emergency get down to a&e, don’t see what is so complicated about it.

    monksie
    Free Member

    I’ve just come off the repeated engaged tone from my GP’s for half an hour. Finally got through and no appointments left this week even though I was told on Thursday of last week I couldn’t book in advance and I have to call on Monday morning. Next appointment is next Monday and I run out of meds tomorrow.
    GP (according to the phone answer’er) won’t write a script without a consultation even though it’s repeat meds, albeit from a different GP’s.
    I need to go to psychie nurse for a script now or things are going to get ‘exciting’.
    I’m not complaining as such. There has to be a better way though. I appreciate I get a lot more than my money’s worth out of the NHS and I am very grateful for it (the NHS).
    MSP – there is quite a gulf between a bit ill and emergency which will probably see you out on your ear at A&E if you turned up there. There’s quite a government information campaign about it at the moment.

    Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middling Edition

    Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middlin...
    Latest Singletrack Videos
    MSP
    Full Member

    Well putting GP’s on shifts doesn’t mean there will be more GP’s and more appointments. That’s a completely different question.

    Next appointment is next Monday and I run out of meds tomorrow.
    GP (according to the phone answer’er) won’t write a script without a consultation even though it’s repeat meds, albeit from a different GP’s.

    You knew you needed meds, but left it to the last minute, what do you expect the GP to do about your lack of forsight?

    footflaps
    Full Member

    I suspect if they charged a small fee, say £5, for a GP appointment, you’d suddenly find there were a lot more free slots…..

    geoffj
    Full Member

    Edit – sorry MSP 😳

    Combination of GPs losing a relatively small % of their income a few years back to give up out of hours services and a more expectant patient base I suspect.

    If you can’t get an appointment for the week, when ringing on a Monday though, something is broken.

    With ours you have to call at 8am to get an appointment that day – although they actually start answering the phone at 7:50, so sometimes all the slots have gone before they officially start answering.

    I quite like the £5 appointment idea.

    MSP
    Full Member

    FFS he’s trying to get an appointment for this week sometime. How much notice should we have to have to be ill?

    No he is trying to get a prescription for meds he knew ran out tomorrow.

    MSP
    Full Member

    I suspect if they charged a small fee, say £5, for a GP appointment, you’d suddenly find there were a lot more free slots….

    They did that in Germany, it put more genuinely ill but poor and vulnerable people off than it did timewasters.

    monksie
    Free Member

    Sadly MSP, my registration at the new GP’s took 22 days to be processed (for which they have apologised) and my previous GP wouldn’t write up some meds as I was no longer registered at their practice. Sorry and all that. No moaning, would just hope for a better way.
    If GP’s worked shifts, those of us who are working could probably get appointments outside of office hours (I don’t work in an office) which would free up demand for those unable to work.
    I’m going to work really hard on being more forsight full now that you’ve pointed that out to me. Thankyouverymuch.
    Quick footnote for MSP. As I noted, I was told last week to phone on Monday morning. I have. It’s gone wrong. I registered weeks ago when I had loads. Now I have very little. I seem to be coping. This surprises me. I value greatly the NHS and doctors and nurses. I even married one. She’s lovely.

    mogrim
    Full Member

    You knew you needed meds, but left it to the last minute, what do you expect the GP to do about your lack of forsight?

    Did you actually bother to read the post? Specifically, this bit:

    Finally got through and no appointments left this week even though I was told on Thursday of last week I couldn’t book in advance and I have to call on Monday morning.

    Houns
    Full Member

    Phone 111 out of hours (after 18:30) go through an assessment and if needs be we can then book you an out of hours appointment.

    Monksie, call 111 they can pass a repeat prescription request through and get someone to call you back

    MSP. So e meds are only given a few at a time, especially ones to help with things like anxiety/depressions etc. so it is common for people to run out. Again that’s where 111 can help but not many folk know this

    dragon
    Free Member

    There used to be GP cover 24 hours, now it seems to be more like 8-5. And people seem surprised we are seeing an increased load on A&E.

    if its an emergency get down to a&e

    How many ordinary people have the medical knowledge to know whether it is or not? Even trained medical people get it wrong occasionally.

    monksie
    Free Member

    Thanks Houns. I didn’t know that. Nice lady at the surgery has just rung. If I can take the packaging for my meds in.GP will get me a few days worth and give me the first cancelled app. they get.
    I agree with the OP’s post although I reckon the medical professionals get scant thanks as it is.

    Houns
    Full Member

    Gp’s (ok maybe not your own) do cover out of hours. There are some walk in centres that are open 24/7 however most out of hours Drs you need an appointment, so call 111 to get one (only after 18:30)

    MSP
    Full Member

    Working shifts by itself would still not create more “doctor hours”, for that you just need more doctors.

    It is not like a factory where manning machines 24 hours a a day increases productivity.

    geoffj
    Full Member

    Working shifts by itself would still not create more “doctor hours”, for that you just need more doctors.

    True, but there may be more opportunities for access outwith the 8-5 hours for those who would otherwise have to take time off work.

    MSP
    Full Member

    There used to be GP cover 24 hours, now it seems to be more like 8-5. And people seem surprised we are seeing an increased load on A&E.

    The whole medical world has changed a lot, old systems just wouldn’t work anymore, unfortunately the Government completely **** up the out of hours changes when they changed it.

    ratherbeintobago
    Full Member

    Working shifts by itself would still not create more “doctor hours”, for that you just need more doctors.

    This. There’s not enough spare capacity to create evening/weekend appointments without reducing capacity elsewhere.

    And think of all the extra cash the GPs could earn in overtime…

    Just out of interest, how do you think GPs are paid?

    DOI Not a GP.

    legolam
    Free Member

    I am a hospital doctor and I work shifts. However, I am not working 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. My colleagues and I share the workload so I work Mon-Fri 9-5 as well as 1 in 9 weekends, evenings and nights. Therefore, there is cover every hour of every day, just not by the same people. There are fewer people working my job during the nights and weekends than there are during the working week.

    GPs do the same. You can contact a GP 24 hours a day, 7 days a week – it might just not be “your” GP. If “your” GP was available 24/7, he would never sleep and would soon be dead (speaking as the daughter of a GP who used to do a 1 in 2 rota ie my dad worked every working day plus every second night and weekend when I was a child, and is now retired due to ill health and didn’t see his kids growing up…)

    Oh, and we don’t get overtime to work out of hours as doctors. We get paid a proportion of our salary on top to work the extra hours. In the “old days” of long hours and easy access to your GP, that was paid at 33% of the salary for out of hours. Not 133%. 33% to work out of hours. Is it any wonder it wasn’t popular?

    Dibbs
    Free Member

    Why dont GPs work shifts

    Because they’re paid too much for the pitiful hours they already work. 😕

    nickc
    Full Member

    I suspect if they charged a small fee, say £5, for a GP appointment, you’d suddenly find there were a lot more free slots…..

    I suspect that you’d have to exempt some folk from that, and you’d not get any further.

    Why can’t you see a GP? For probably the same reason you cant get to see an NHS dentist. In my practices it’s people who fail to attend who push waiting times out. Out of a patient load of 30-35 a day/ dentist, 7-12 of those just won’t show up. Or they constantly re-arrange. had a ‘discussion’ with a mother of 4 kids who’d never attended but had re-arranged 4 new patient exams a total of 23 times. When I told her enough was enough, she said I was discriminating against large families!

    We’re open 8-8 365 days a year BTW.

    footflaps
    Full Member

    GPs do the same.

    They used to. Now they can opt out of out of hours cover, in which case the local authority outsource it to 3rd parties who hire unqualified or struck off overseas doctors with a poor grasp of English and inflict that on the populace….

    Hence the increased load on A&E.

    nickc
    Full Member

    in which case the local authority outsource it to 3rd parties who hire unqualified or struck off overseas doctors with a poor grasp of English and inflict that on the populace….

    hmmmmm. not at all inflammatory…(or true) but never let that spoil your rant 😆

    molgrips
    Free Member

    My GPS works whenever I turn it on, even in the middle of the night. I dunno what you are talking about.

    aphex_2k
    Free Member

    So the NHS is mega financial turmoil and the solution is get docs working shifts and pay them MORE? I’ve heard of worse solutions…

    jfletch
    Free Member

    And think of all the extra cash the GPs could earn in overtime

    In the end it comes down to this.

    If you want your GP to be available out of hours “you”* will need to pay for it.

    You** have decided you are not willing to pay this cost since it would be very expensive, it’s not just the GP that needs to be available, all the support staff, the offices etc would need to be available (the days of GPs being a one man band working from home with a breif case are long gone thankfully).

    Instead a much more susatinable and efficient system of out of hours GP care is in place, it works well. The issue is one of marketing, (people don’t know this exists) and expectation (people have been conditioned to think a GP is a named person they can always access, rather than a service they can always use)

    *”You” hopefully continuing to mean “you via your taxes” rather than people having to directly pay for health care.

    **”You” meaning the elected officials that you chose to represnet you when deciding these things

    nickc
    Full Member

    So the NHS is mega financial turmoil

    not all statements by right wing goverments are free from idealogical content

    franksinatra
    Full Member

    There used to be GP cover 24 hours, now it seems to be more like 8-5. And people seem surprised we are seeing an increased load on A&E.

    Facts fail. Every region has 24hr GP cover, and it is more accessible than it was when you had to get your local GP out of bed in olden days!

    The simple reason GP surgeries are not open more is that they are not paid to by the existing contract. GP Practices are businesses run by partners. If it is financially viable to open longer they will, just like any other business. That is only going to happen if someone pays for it, then built into the GP contract. The fact that the surgery is already telling you you need to wait a week for appointments suggests they are running at capacity, opening additional hours will not free up a capacity, it will just shift the problem, unless you employ more GP’s

    My wife’s surgery has appointment system and Duty Doctor. In the circumstance described by the OP, he could see Duty Doc today, but may need to wait a while, especially as it is Monday and people have ‘stacked up’ their issues over the weekend.

    In response to the predicable dig about salaries. It has taken my wife 15 years of incredibly hard graft and sacrifice to get where she is, including working in hospitals for less than minimum wage (by the time you factor in working hours) She works to a level of pressure that a lot of people could not sustain and makes daily decisions that really affect peoples lives. She earns every bloody penny.

    agent007
    Free Member

    This may be a little controversial, but how about priority slots and fast track treatment for people who currently work?

    Working people pay for the health service through tax, and the quicker we can get them fixed and back to work then the more money there will be for the NHS full stop, improving things for every patient.

    unfitgeezer
    Free Member

    So the NHS is mega financial turmoil

    And why is this ?

    Bad management ?

    Dare I say to many people pulling from it and not paying any taxes… from the UK or foreign nationals…oooo don’t shout at that its true blind if you think its not !

    qwerty
    Free Member

    OOH GPs get around £100 per HOUR (£1200 a shift!!!!), which isn’t bad for being driven around by your driver, taking a pulse & then scribbling something illegible onto the back of a print out sheet. I can’t understand why more don’t do it.

    legend
    Free Member

    Just out of interest, how do you think GPs are paid?

    Bullion I would expect

    franksinatra
    Full Member

    This may be a little controversial, but how about priority slots and quicker treatment for people who currently work?

    What about older people who have worked all of their lives and are now drawing on the NHS that they have contributed to all of their lives?

    Or genuinely ill people who would love to work but are unable to?

    Perhaps a more sensible option would be to ensure early and late appointments are freed up for working people, would be an administrative nightmare though.

    jfletch
    Free Member

    Because they’re paid too much for the pitiful hours they already work.

    Just because a GP appointment is not available doesn’t mean they aren’t working. 12 hour days are standard for most GPs.

    In response to the predicable dig about salaries. It has taken my wife 15 years of incredibly hard graft and sacrifice to get where she is, including working in hospitals for less than minimum wage (by the time you factor in working hours) She works to a level of pressure that a lot of people could not sustain and makes daily decisions that really affect peoples lives. She earns every bloody penny.

    This ^

    Being a GP (or any doctor in this country for that matter) is far from the gravy train that the media and foreign TV dramas make it out to be.

    As with any profesion there are a small handful at the top who make a lot of money but saying all GPs earn to much is like saying everyone who works for Tesco earns too much beacuase you know the cheif execs sallary.

    rogerthecat
    Free Member

    There’s good and poor GPs and their practices.
    MrsCat deals with lots of them and some are just amazingly brilliant, a few are truly crap.

    An example of good GPs happened yesterday where three GPs attended an RTC we were also at on Sunday, just beneath Higger Tor.

    Whilst other motorists turned around and left without even asking if they could help, MrsCat, me and 3 GPs got stuck in with a roadie and two other car drivers to get the uninjured passenger out and look after the driver until the emergency responders arrived – which was quite a while.

    The GPs were great, they just got involved and organised the rest of us, they also stuck around until the casualty had been taken to the ambulance in case they could help – not a bad out of hours service.

    franksinatra
    Full Member

    OOH GPs get around £100 per HOUR (£1200 a shift!!!!), which isn’t bad for being driven around by your driver, taking a pulse & then scribbling something illegible onto the back of a print out sheet. I can’t understand why more don’t do it.

    Not those employed by a trust. My wife did it for years and was paid £70k FTE.

    You are describing Contractors flown in (sometimes literally) to provide cover at short notice. It is a symptom of poor management that they need to pay for cover at those rates.

    franksinatra
    Full Member

    Next time you drive past your GP surgery at 7am in the morning or 8pm at night, have a look to see if the lights are on. Surgery may be closed but very likely some of the GP’s will be working. There is a lot more to working as a GP than just seeing people for 10min slots during surgery.

    unfitgeezer
    Free Member

    not enough doctors….oh dear !

    What about all those PRIVATE doctors who trained with the NHS and then bugger off for the Private world of medicine…it happens…that’s a drain isn’t it…?

    jfletch
    Free Member

    GPs get around £100 per HOUR (£1200 a shift!!!!)

    You are out by a factor of 3 there. A GP will be on between £25 and £40 per hour. Which is a decent wage but nothting more.

    And it bloody should be more given the level of skill, knowledge, compassion etc required and the magnitude and consequence of the decsions they make multiple times a day.

    legolam
    Free Member

    In the UK, you cannot work as a private doctor until you are consultant level (minimum 9 years of training post-degree in my specialty).

    You then have to offer your time to the NHS first, before you are allowed to work any time that the NHS declines to use you in private work eg if there are 10 half days in a working week, then the NHS might employ you for all 10, or pay you for 9 and you can choose what to do with the final half day. Therefore, the NHS doctors working in the private hospitals have already offered to work extra hours in the NHS and been turned down.

    The reason my colleagues are “buggering off” (mainly to Oz and NZ rather than the “private world”) is that there are not enough consultant or GP jobs for the number of medical graduates, therefore there are doctors who are being made unemployed unless they “bugger off” and do something else. The politicians and public are currently unwilling to employ more doctors.

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 117 total)

The topic ‘Why dont GPs work shifts and open all day Mon-Sat 8to8’ is closed to new replies.