So who’s got one? Have read about Barney’s long termer and it ticks most of the right boxes for me. The only concern is the 75deg SA, which is a little steep for my tastes, preferring somewhere around 73.5 ideally. Would he kink a seat tube to allow a slightly slacker angle whilst retaining awesome tyre clearance do you think?

Anything else to consider instead? Have spotted the BTR Chaser which looks an absolute weapon too! The idea of a frame build course and building my own appeals, but 2 weeks out of work (my own business), the cost, and the fact I could never weld even when I used to make things out of metal all day long (quite a good fabricator, worlds worst welder!) puts me off. Looking at the quality of what circa £1k seems to get you compared to spending more and doing it myself (I want a bike for riding, to be abused, not one to look at) I’m inclined to buy ready built to be fair.

Any idea what kind of waiting times once a deposit placed?

Nope – but Adrian @ swarf is an ex-colleague of mine (he left to set up Swarf)

I’ll point him this way……

A

Curious – why do you feel is 75 too steep?

Haven’t found any negatives to a steep seat angle myself

Seat angle is a bit of a strange one because it isn’t a true figure unless your seat tube is straight and starts at the BB – which is very rare for any full-sus frames and many 29″ hardtails. I suppose it is accurate if your saddle height is level with the top of the headtube but that requires the rare combination of short legs on a long travel big wheeled bike.

I found the true seat angle of my modded Bird too steep at 75.4 degrees – went up hills well but was weird on the flat without raising the bars up high – which then defeated the climbing benefit. It’s much nicer at 74 deg. Bear in mind that the seat angle on a hardtail is even steeper when riding whilst on most full-sus bikes it’s slacker when riding on the flat and slacker still when climbing.

Those Swarfs are lovely – you’ll get a great bike. If you wanna change the geometry (you seem to know what you want numbers wise) they also offer a custom option. You could also consider Ted James, you”ll have seen mine on this years #Jennride, i presented him my geometry, he added his minor tweaks and built me a frame that does exactly what i wanted. In my opinion his portfolio is wider than most, he isn’t too far from you, hes in Nympsfield, Glos. so you could talk face to face, which i liked. If you go Swarf, you’ve GOT to add some mudguards to your order, just because!!!

Nope – but Adrian @ swarf is an ex-colleague of mine (he left to set up Swarf)
I’ll point him this way……

Cheers. If I’d have spotted his frames during shop hours I’d have given him a call already, only noticed his existence late last night.

BTRs also look great although I’d have thought the Ranger would be more appropriate as opposed to the chaser which is their xc frame albeit with a BTR slant.

That’s it… I want an XC frame with an aggressive slant, not an Enduro or Freeride Hardtail. The Stanton Sherpa is a near miss for me, if the reach was longer (or the 19 had an 18″ seat tube) and the BB 20mm lower it would be perfect.

Curious – why do you feel is 75 too steep?
Haven’t found any negatives to a steep seat angle myself

If all your riding is “winch and plummet” (as I believe it is now called) then a steep seat angle is perfect. For more XC, plenty of along as well as milder ups and downs, a steep seat angle has a couple of negatives. Firstly you can feel a little cramped when in the saddle, secondly the steeper the seat angle the harsher the (seated) ride. I run a reverb on everything now, which is inline, so no chance of kicking a steep angle back with a layback post either. Obviously too laid back means it’ll climb like it wants to wheelie everywhere, so there is an optimal middle ground. Reach numbers look perfect on the Spline 29er, but the ETT a little short because of the 75deg SA. Knocked back to about 73.5 it would lengthen the ETT about 10-15mm which would be what I consider perfect.

You could also consider Ted James, you”ll have seen mine on this years #Jennride

My next port of call was to email you… So expect a few questions soon!

Watching this thread with interest Mark.

I’m pretty happy still with my mk1 Solaris but with 120mm forks the BB just feels bit too high. So I keep having ‘what if’ thoughts about a frame change. I’m also after xc with a hint of aggression.

Watching this thread with interest Mark.

I best set up a pay per click on this thread then quickly eh Simon! 😉

I’m pretty happy still with my mk1 Solaris but with 120mm forks the BB just feels bit too high.

Played with a Mk1 Solaris myself, felt too tall for me and Reach not long enough. Sherpa angles better, and slightly more lively ride, but again too tall and reach not quite long enough. My Whyte 629 frame is almost bang on but ally and could do with clearance for 2.35″ tyres (2.25’s ok but no bigger on it or it’ll rub), and maybe 5mm off the chainstays. On paper the Swarf is as close to perfect as I can get. I did my own BikeCAD drawing for my perfect frame 12 months ago now, I’ll dig it out and email it over… Just be sure to pay me some royalties if you use it! 😆

Oh my. The 650b spline is lovely, definitely on the list for the future. But rich for me at the moment though.

In my opinion his portfolio is wider than most, he isn’t too far from you, hes in Nympsfield, Glos. so you could talk face to face, which i liked.

Just googled his address… Spent a few months driving straight past his place every day when I was working down in Tetbury!!!

mboy – Member

did my own BikeCAD drawing for my perfect frame 12 months ago now, I’ll dig it out and email it over… Just be sure to pay me some royalties if you use it!

Thanks Mark.
Group buy 😆

If you go Swarf, you’ve GOT to add some mudguards to your order, just because!!!

Oh yes – I’ve got some of the mudguards on my Diverge (one of the first pairs) – they get a lot of admiring glances!

A

What happened to the Curve?
I’d have bought one of those – the steel rear triangle didn’t look as appealing as the carbon one though.

Hi everyone, it’s Adrian from Swarf here
Just a quick one to clarify a few things. The seat tube on the Spline is straight and runs to the centreline of the bb so the seat angle measurement is real. Also all of my hardtail geometry is quoted at the sagged position, so when static it’ll slacken off a little over 1 degree for a 120mm forked bike. Something to bear in mind when comparing to other geometry.

Obviously you can tune the geometry somewhat if it’s not what you want. Without lengthening the chainstays the seat angle can be slacked off to 74 degrees without issue, any slacker and you start getting tight on clearance between the tyre/seattube/front mech. I’ve built quite a few at with 74 degree seat angle. There’s a thread about one on here, I’ll
Find the link in a sec.

As for the Curve, it proved just too complex for me to produce. I made a total of 7 and called it quits…. I might pick it back up sometime although I’m currently dabbling with a short travel 29er currently which is much simpler and is amazing to ride!

Cheers

Adrian

I’ve met Ade and Sah a few times on their local trails and at races and the bikes are beautifully made – and they’re both pretty handy riders! I have a longterm plan to get a custom Spline, just need to make some final geometry decisions and find some money down the back of the sofa.

The Curve rear triangle was too expensive to build – huge number of hours. Very cool design though with the high pivot and idler, and the geometry was ahead of its time.

Here we go, this one has 68ha, 74sa and is built around a 100mm fork

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/bored-friday-heres-my-new-machine#post-7866393

Lovely bikes, and excellent builders being discussed, but would it not give your customers more confidence in you and the range you offer them, if you rode a bike that you sell? 😕

I’m not entirely sure I understand what you are getting at sillyoldman? Between the wife and I we have 5 bikes, all
Made by myself…… I spent 18 months riding a standard geometry small Spline 29. I tend to spend most of my riding time on my prototype frames to ensure what I do put up for sale is good.

would it not give your customers more confidence in you and the range you offer them, if you rode a bike that you sell?

I do… 2 road, 2 MTB and a CX bike currently (though CX bike going soon as I just don’t use it). This is more about taking a 20+ year fantasy of getting my own custom frame made. Besides, without revealing too much, there’s a chance I might get a medium, large and XL made to the same specs… It’s just a thought but one I’ve been entertaining for a while, and I’ve got willing guinea pigs ready to test them out.

Also all of my hardtail geometry is quoted at the sagged position, so when static it’ll slacken off a little over 1 degree for a 120mm forked bike. Something to bear in mind when comparing to other geometry.

Interesting to note (and a big thank you for coming to this thread by the way!) that you quote the sagged geometry. I’ve got too used to working with or people quoting static. Guessing 75 sagged equals approx 73.8 static which is ball park what I’d be aiming for. Sub 66.5 static HA… Chapeau! 😀

Do you have a wheelbase measurement on the middle of the 3 sizes with a 120mm fork? I’m guessing around 1170mm ish.

Without lengthening the chainstays the seat angle can be slacked off to 74 degrees without issue, any slacker and you start getting tight on clearance between the tyre/seattube/front mech.

I’m not concerned by front mechs but I am concerned by tyre and mud clearance. Ideally want to be able to fit a decent 2.3″ in the back with clearance, in winter probably downsize slightly but with a more aggressive tread so mud clearance will need to be half decent. Can I ask why you’ve stuck with a straight seat tube rather than kinking it slightly for mud room, or even joining it ahead of the BB centreline?

I’m currently dabbling with a short travel 29er currently which is much simpler and is amazing to ride!

Sounds awesome! Spent a lot of time on various short-mid travel 29er FS bikes over the last few years, love the sounds of this one.

Here we go, this one has 68ha, 74sa and is built around a 100mm fork

Looks stunning for a more overtly XC bike! Awesome colour too…

@sillyoldman, apologies I think I got the wrong end of the stick, thought your comment was directed at me!

@mboy, I went with the straight seat tube for no other reason than it works fine with the geometry I wanted… keeping things nice and simple. Bending a 35mm seat tube is not an easy task and requires some fairly hefty kit, which sadly I don’t currently have. I’ve had seat tubes bent elsewhere but the chap decided to move to whistler, can’t understand why!

Offsetting the seat tube is not a problem although I’ve not have to do it as yet.

Cheers Adrian

Bedfo – aye, comment was aimed at OP!

mboy – cool. Own brand frame plans? Nice. Good luck with that.

It’s just an idea at the moment sillyoldman, but inevitably I’d need to start with a prototype, or 2, or 3… The very worst that could happen is I end up with a really very nice frame to ride around on to my own design, and it costs me a few quid.

@mboy, I went with the straight seat tube for no other reason than it works fine with the geometry I wanted… keeping things nice and simple. Bending a 35mm seat tube is not an easy task and requires some fairly hefty kit, which sadly I don’t currently have. I’ve had seat tubes bent elsewhere but the chap decided to move to whistler, can’t understand why!

Ok gotcha.

Used to work for a fabricator prepping rally car shells many moons ago, bending 2″ dia CDMS and T45 pipes requires some serious kit for sure!

just because 🙂