Hi

Any builders around for any advice.

We bought our house 10 years ago (2005) and removed an interior wall to open up the kitchen and dining room.

The work was done using a huge RSJ that was supplied by a steel stockholders at their recommendation for the work being done.

It was bloody huge

Its been in 10 years and there are no issues at all – no cracks or anything untoward going on

The work was done by a builder friend and myself.

We are now selling the house and filling in the house sale forms for the solicitor and there are questions about work that has been done and building regs etc.

I have no paperwork for the wall removal – whats the best course of action?

Thanks for any advice

Oops….all changes must be notified ideally before work carried out (especially structural) to be inspected and signed off….

“It was there when we moved in” may be your only choice. My local council planning are a joke.. The guy who I used to use has now retired and so have my bigger jobs as its too much hassle now waiting and masses of paperwork.

Does your house have any covenants? You’d be surprised how many do.. If any breached all work breaching covenants must be put back to original state. Structural work needs to be inspected just rang my surveyor buddy to double check as regs change.

Non load bearing no plans etc but load bearing yes.. Even fencing alterations need planning now… Madness.

We are considering doing the “it was like that when we moved in”

Could easily suggest it was done at the same time the house was extended which was sometime in the 80’s

Is there any way they can find out after 10 years and what is the likely outcome if they do?

The house is a 1930’s semi so no covenants as far as i know

You could probably get a structural engineers report stating the steel is adequate then an indemnity policy. I’m sure there are time scales for local authorities to pursue breaches and 10 years will be way beyond any they have to abide by. I’d also ask your conveyencing solicitor for advise. Personally don’t think it’s a huge issue.

“It was like that when we moved in” and then pay the ~£140 for the Indemnity policy.

Speak to your solicitor about an indemnity

As above – sort an indemnity.

Can I just suggest that lying on the contractual enquiries (the questionnaire) is really not a good idea – iirc there are penalties and risks of civil liability for such things. Ianal but when I found someone had fibbed pre completion about a boundary issue on something I was buying I canned the whole purchase writing off 1500 quid of costs. If I’d found out post completion then I’d have been looking at civil claims.

Indemnity is just protecting against enforcement action. Entirely pointless on something 10 years old. It gives no protection for the buyer against the quality of work. If I was buying I would want something other than indemnity for structural work.

Thanks for the replies – think we are going to go with – it was like that when we moved in.

Cant really see anyone being able to say otherwise.
Especially as it has also had a 2 storey extension added before we bought it.

I think anything else may open a huuuuge can o’ worms

I had a similar query when I last moved house, I responded with do you want to buy it or not. they grumbled a bit and eventually we settled on a indemnity policy that I paid for for about £40 to get things moving again.

tell them…
Then you will end up with this

I had a similar query when I last moved house, I responded with do you want to buy it or not. they grumbled a bit and eventually we settled on a indemnity policy that I paid for for about £40 to get things moving again.

I think anything else may open a huuuuge can o’ worms

This.

to be fair, this was back in early 2008 when the property market was still a bit mental. These were buyers who’d offered asking price within hours of it going on the market and there were others lined up.

I could afford to be bullish.

I’m not sure how the ‘it was like that when we moved in’ works. if someone said that to me my next question would be ‘well what did you do? what did your solicitor say?’ when do you stop the lie? this is a building regs issue btw not planning.

exactly – if you can’t provide the appropriate certification my next question would be to see the surveyors report for when you bought it. And I’d be smelling a pretty large rat…..

If it was “like that when we moved in” you would have gotten some sort of paperwork from the previous owners. There should also be building regs sign off held by the local council.
The solicitors for the buyer of our house asked for it for a 20yo extension on our house and I was able to get it from the council no problem.

Personally, as I am in the hunt for a house at the moment, I would prefer you weren’t a lying toad just trying to save money to line your own pockets and instead get it checked and signed off retrospectively. But that’s just me of course. 🙄

Don’t mention it, but if anyone asks tell the truth.

I can’t image any buyers questioning every mod.

I can imagine their surveyor doing so

Something like what Rob said.

Our new house was previously owned by a builder (aka bodger).

Conservatory – not actually tied into the brickwork of the house, no PP or building control sign off or anything like that.
Loft conversion – not actually a conversion, wouldn’t have got sign off as there’s no headroom (not a big deal for us, it’s just storage), and he’d bodged the electrics, and RCD (No fuse, not RCBO) straight into the 100A fuse!

There have been a few times I’d have liked to punch him over the past few months. And won’t be taking the “it’ll be fine, it’s been there 20 years” approach next time.

Ok – don’t want to be thought of as a lying toad (thanks Rob)

What do i need to do or who do i need get in touch with to get this sorted out.

Don’t want to cause any delays or give the buyer any cause for alarm.

Whats the best way to do this quickly with the minimum of fuss?

Our new house was previously owned by a builder (aka bodger).

But you still bought it, and it must have passed your survey, or you were informed about the issues and still went ahead.

Speak to your solicitor about an indemnity – I was in the same situation, and that was all that was required.

hunterst – Member

think we are going to go with – it was like that when we moved in.

Er, at the risk of being sanctimonious, that’s at best a deliberate misrepresentation and at worst fraud…

It’ll also void any indemnity policy you buy.

I’d cop to it. But that’s me.

What do i need to do or who do i need get in touch with to get this sorted out.

I believe you need to apply for a “Regularisation Certificate” from the Building Control Department of your local council (assuming you are in England or Wales).

You will probably need to supply calcuations from a chartered engineer to justify the size of the RSJ and its bearing support – bread and butter work for a structural engineer.

You might also need to expose the supports for the RSJ unless you have photos of what’s there, but *talk* to the BCO and discuss what he/she would like to happen. There seems to be a fair degree of personal discretion and they can be very helpful (or a royal PITA if you piss them off!)

IANAB

Whats the best way to do this quickly with the minimum of fuss?

As above, speak to the local building control about getting it signed off retrospectively, at worst they will want you to provide calcs & (I am guessing here) may be able to put you in touch with a local structural eng to sort those out, should be simple bread & butter stuff to them really.

Depending on the buyer, you could try the “do you want to buy or not tack” which is something that worked when selling my dad’s house recently but then we had knocked the price back on the basis of no come backs

local authority building control here 🙁 you should submit a regularisation application, fees would be circa £300.
If I was looking at it unless you have good photos I’d ask you to expose part of the steel, bearing so size can be checked.
It may be quicker, easier to get an indemnity policy, whether that’s acceptable would be up to your purchaser, their solicitor, lender and surveyor.

I can’t image any buyers questioning every mod.

[quote] thestabiliser – Member
I can imagine their surveyor doing so [/quote]
😯 IME, unless the house has at least half collapsed, a surveyor won’t notice. “unable to assess condition or actual presence of walls due to possible aliens/zombies requiring all assessment to be completed from driver seat of my car”

OP should still cough to it though

Builders eh 🙄

My house survey says the conservatory was built before the house.

That sums up my opinion of surveyors.

Look into it before contacting the council…I paid for an indemnity as we’d had a new door fitted (FENSA so all approved) but I subsequently blocked up the old door and apparently this should have been noticed to building control.

I had the choice of go to the council and get it done retrospectively, or take out the indemnity.

But if I contacted the council and made them aware/asked any questions about it, that voids any current or future indemnity policy as it increases the chance that the policy may need to pay out. So think twice before calling them! (apparently also voids the policy if your buyer contacts the council about work you’ve had done)

But you still bought it, and it must have passed your survey, or you were informed about the issues and still went ahead.

Conservatory’s fine, survey missed the deathtrap electrics, which somehow had passed an annual inspection not so long ago too 😕 and there’ve been other WTF moments when doing stuff.

Still, you live and learn.

Blimey now i’m confused.

Think i should speak with our solicitor handling the sale first and see what he advises.

He must have come across this before.

There should also be building regs sign off held by the local council.

This, even if you have no paperwork, the local BC could dig up a copy, so it will be obvious to anyone who goes digging that the wall was removed without BC approval.