At BBF on Saturday there were a few peeps taking pics of the racers, some obviously just of mates etc but a couple at least who looked like pros.

One in particular had more kit than anyone I've ever seen at a race, all mounted on a tripod, and seemingly taking pics automatically as riders passed. He sat there looking bored stiff. If you were there, you'd have seen him. You couldn't really miss him!

Now, I've no problem with whis really and I have no doubt his pics will be crisp and clear and technically perfect, but all shot in slowish locations on flattish bits of trail in the trees…. Yawn.

And ALL THE BLOODY SAME.

Now seriously, I'm no great shakes as a photographer, but I've been and shot at a couple of races, and there's dozens, maybe hundreds of places on the BBF course where I could have taken pics and put some effort in, tried to capture the essence of the event: The speed, the rockyness, the jumps (There were a few of them too) the dust, the sunshine, the effort.

Hide in a bush on the Quarry trail, near a jump, on a berm, that fast dusty corner near the start. Pan the camera. Blur the background, show the dust kicking up, the concentration on faces on that last tight rocky downhill, blue sky in the background near the golf course.
Walk round. Put some effort in. Think. BBF was a superb course: Use it!

Do you really want a pefect pic of you just riding you bike? Or would you like something that makes you look good, or knackered, or fast, or airbourne..?

I mean, this guy will certainly have a pic of me, but I have no inclination to even go and look at it, and certainly not buy it. And I do buy a few race pics. I like them as momentos. Look at my profile pic, it's a heavily cropped race pic I bought, the full size is superb and makes me look good (That took some effort!)

Sorry, I just don't see the point….. 🙁

(It's getting repetitive this, but:)

Race photographers: Poddy takes better race photographs than you do without even trying, and all you haters can suck his balls.

🙄 😛 😀

I agree entirely.

The difference between the photographers is massive, with some managing to capture the action and others just taking a snap.

At the Wiggle Enduro6 the 'official' photographer had positioned himself on a completely bland grassy climb, with parked cars in the background. There were so many interesting parts of the course, but this was clearly the easiest from a 'taking a pic' point of view with plenty of light and 'walking pace' riders.

BD – I could have guessed you'd be the first to reply. You're just predictable now. Yawn. 😉 😆

LOLs at BD.

PP, you are so right about this. I have sometimes felt rather let down by the pics taken in a very boring part of the course. What is the point?!
I have done many races and was only pleased once or twice with the results of the photos taken.

this is why people buy olivercoates photos 😉

Al, BD is almost my stalker. I'm quite flattered TBH 🙂

Well said PP

Cheers, Cheers! 🙂

Race photogs are generally there to get "a" photo of every competitor, not to get an arty photo of some competitors. They will be being paid by the number of people who visit the site and but a photo of them, which they'll tend to do based purely on wanting to remember they were there, not wanting to get a great arty shot of themselves from a hidden spot.

This thread is worthless without pics?
So, show us a pic that a race photographer took of yourself that you rate highly and one that just leaves you cold.
I will go and try to find some on a archived hard drive somewhere ( haven't raced for a while…)

I'm quite happy with the official BBF photos of moi, but the best by far in capturing the event for me was taken by Grahamh from this forum.

He got me at the end of my final lap, I was hurting a little..

They will be being paid by the number of people who visit the site and but a photo of them

Well, in at least one case, it's not working. 🙁

Maybe compromise then….. first lap or so get the dull stuff then spend the next 10 hours getting more inspired shots.

The pics don't have to be arty at all, just actiony 🙂
They will sell more if they could do this instead of taking a boring looking one.

Well, in at least one case, it's not working.

Don't think they care, the number of amateur photogs snubbing their photos based on lack of technical competence is probably fairly minimal. If it was financially favourable I'd expect they'd all be out scooching around the course upside down and getting odd shots while able to offload more photos.

As an amateur clicker myself I'd agree they're boring, but from someone who's accompanied loads of people to sporting events, the last thing they care about is how arty the shot is, they just want a quick cheap shot to prove they were there.

You just make it too tempting Peter… 🙂

I'm absolutely no photographer, but presumably there's a commercial logic to it. If you shoot in a reasonably slow spot with good lighting it's easy to get a large number of perfectly adequate pictures. You'll certainly have a decent picture of everyone doing the event.

I guess that most people buy a couple of mediocre race pictures in their lives, then realise that they generally look the same in pretty much every picture and stop bothering unless someone is lucky enough to get a really fantastic picture of them.

If you've photographed everyone and they've all come out boring but OK, you'll likely sell a picture to everyone who's in the market for one.

If you move about, go for more interesting shots you'll presumably get a smaller number of better/more exciting pictures, but there's no guarantee you'll have taken pictures of the people who definitely want to buy a picture of themselves, and no guarantee that the good pictures will appeal to the people in them.

Ultimately, it's not (so far as I can see) an art-form, it's a high-volume, low-return exercise in getting a few quid out of people's enthusiasm and vanity.

I wonder if one could pay them a day-rate to follow you around taking pictures of you looking awesome? It'd probably be the same rate as for a wedding, or maybe a bit more unless you could offer them a go on your sister or something instead of a slim chance of a bridesmaid. 🙂

You should see the stuff they try and sell at horse riding events! The snappers have the advantage of being able to get close to the fences etc but they either have shadows over the rider faces, are too far back, take the photo late or early, I've even seen them where they've taken the shots from behind the fence so you just see the rider and horse heading away.

I and other friends usually manage to get a better result, even myself just using a compact. The difference being that we can only be in one place and get one chance at a shot whereas the snappers have two or three people, and don't have to be close enough to jog back to meet the rider at the finish.

Sorry, I just don't see the point…..

Then don't spend you're time doing it and let those who are prepared to spend their time (even if you think it's a waste) get on with it in peace.

Pardon my ignorance but where are the official photos for the BBF I can't seam to find them.

Iain

Here

So, show us a pic that a race photographer took of yourself that you rate highly and one that just leaves you cold.

Oddly, I only buy the good ones! 😉

This is the full size on of my profile pic I mentioned. TransWales 2008 –

It was pouring with rain, and he was halfway down a slippy muddy gully, and he gets a pic of that quality. Well done sir, that's what I'm talking about. 🙂

Too right, it's the same at running events as well, crap photos that convey nothing other than, 'I was there'. Expensive too. I suspect in a few years this bubble will burst as wives start telling their husbands to get proper jobs that earn some money and all the crap photographers that seem to have sprung up recently will be gone.

Ha ha, that is a good photo, but it's all a bit MBUK! Or do the trees grow funny round those parts?

Surely it depends what you want to get out of it? If you want to 'capture the event' then you're absolutely right PP, but if you want to sell photos to the riders then they probably don't care that there's hundreds of others virtually the same! Agree that some photos can be in very dull locations though. I wonder if you're more likely to sell more of 50 photos you get 'just right' with the ambience, or of 500 photos you just 'point and shoot'.

I remember doing BBF in 2007 and there were more photos of riders than at any other event, it obviously attracts them!

I agree with PP, there's a severe lack of imagination going on in a lot of race photo's. But that said it is a pretty tough job as we're probably all going a lot slower than we like to think we are and so it's difficult to make us all look like Tomac…
But you're right, a bit of creativity about the backdrop, and mixing that up with some decent close-up gurning shots shouldn't be rocket science. All the good kit in the world can't make up for dull composition.

I understand the 'why' regarding people taking 'safe' images to get everyone in, and get more chance of making money based on volume sold – and there were quite a few buying at the Enduro6.
But some people seem to manage that and take interesting shots as well.

I have found that Joolze Dymond always manages to get some great pics and evokes the atmosphere of an event. She doesn't mind parking herself in amongst some uncomfortable looking shrubbery if it means she gets some great shots.

For what it's worth, I like Peter's MBUK-action shape-throwing extravanganza of panning, but the BBF shot of Mike's a good one too. Nothing flashy, it's just a picture of a man suffering on a bicycle towards the close of a rather fine day. 🙂

I still think Joolze Dymond consistently gets the best. I've seen so many photos of me that I usually ignore them, but some of hers still make me think 'woah, that's good'.

I think her highlight was 24/12 last year, with this shot. I've got an A4 print of it, you can read the lettering on my tyres, water bottle, crazy!

forgot – yes joolz always gets good shots too … just not up here in scotland 😉

PP got to say that photo really wouldn't get my cash at all, looks like one taken with a compact that friend might take as he tripped backwards – bearly any of it is in focus due to the motion, the extreme angle adds nothing and conveys a sense of "it wasn't very steep so I tilted the camera to make it look better". Each to his own.

KINKTUT – too much sag dialed in there?

i'm going to eat my words – just checked the official photo's of me and team mate and they're chuffing wicked! well done that lensperson!

It is a common belief that to achieve success in life, you have to do your best at everything you try to accomplish. It is also argued that, if you want to become a specialist in your line of work, you should give yourself in, and be the best.

In the first place, while trying to get to the top and doing things well, we have to learn new things, cope with problems and find resolutions, and therefore, we develop into better people. Trying to achieve our goals we develop, keep our minds open and constantly full of ideas. We keep the world we live in turning, evolving and changing into a better one.

the photographers they had a 24h de finale in finale ligure, italy, this year were the best i've ever encountered. no put any of the pics i bought online yet but you can see the samples here (you might need to stick 410d in the search box though to see mine). the pricing was about right too, €20 for about 50 very high res, very good quality digital images with no watermark etc.

The pics don't have to be arty at all, just actiony

Indeed. It's not hard. A basic technique like SLOW SPEED SYNC, pan the camera, rider looks fast, job done.

If you shoot in a reasonably slow spot with good lighting it's easy to get a large number of perfectly adequate pictures. You'll certainly have a decent picture of everyone doing the event.

"Adequate", "Decent"

Why settle for that? 🙂

I was actually talking to a pro MTB snapper earliet this year who said they'd seen someone at another event taking pics like this and that they thought it wasn't showing out sport is as good a light as it could be.
It can be done. You've just got to want to do it. 🙂

KINKTUT – too much sag dialed in there?

Nope 100mm Sids @ 25%, I am however putting weight on the front as I as going prone to beat the head wind.

Why settle for that?

It can be done. You've just got to want to do it.

I think perhaps you do just need to get on with doing it yourself. As you've made clear, your pictures would be very good. I'll look out for you lurking in the bushes near the tricky bits of Hit the North with an expression of concentrated artistic rapture on your face. 😉

Nope 100mm Sids @ 25%, I am however putting weight on the front as I as going prone to beat the head wind.

IC, just looks like a normal riding position to me rather than over the front.

I still think Joolze Dymond consistently gets the best. I've seen so many photos of me that I usually ignore them, but some of hers still make me think 'woah, that's good'.

That's because she puts the effort in. I've got one of hers of me from Mayhem (Sorry, don't have it available to post) It's a long-shot, taken early morning on the grassy climb, side on. My head's bowed, I'm obviously suffering a bit and you can only see the top 2/3 of me for the grass, and I'm all alone. It's a great shot.