Thread Hijack : my Smuggler frame is for sale..
Black, Large, brand new.

I wanted to transfer all parts from my Banshee Phantom, but can’t be bothered now.
(how’s that for 1st World Problems 😀 )

GavinB does it still feel balanced with 140 up front? Not compromised at all?

gemini29 – tried mailing you but it keeps bouncing back!

sorry for that.. fixed now 😳

I am running 140mm 2016 Fox 34s, feels spot on. Mimics next years slightly higher BB and I run a pretty slammed stem anyway, all feels good.

If anyone is still looking for one we still have one last large Teal frame. Not sure why as if it had arrived two weeks earlier it could have sold 4x over! Its now on the cheap cos we have run out of storage space..

Smuggler Large Teal Sale

If anyone is still looking for one we still have one last large Teal frame. Not sure why as if it had arrived two weeks earlier it could have sold 4x over

Who’d be a bike shop owner eh? Dealing with fickle moutain bikers must be enough to drive a fellow mad. Hope you find a buyer for it soon.

michaelmcc
GavinB does it still feel balanced with 140 up front? Not compromised at all?

It feels fine to me. I’m running it with a 40mm stem, with 10mm of spacers underneath) so I guess if I’ve raised the front end 10mm, and was finding it lifting up on climbs all the time, I could get rid of the spacers and see how it feels, or more drastically stick a slightly longer stem on (even flip it). I’ve not felt the need to though, and am finding it climbs fine. The bars are only 10mm rise, so the front end is pretty low (but could be lower still, if I felt it needed it).

I do understand though that this is a very personal thing though, so what might work for me, might not feel right to someone else. I left the steerer long enough that I could play around with things, to an extent, before settling on a set up I really liked. I had factored in that if I needed/wanted to drop the travel down to 130 then that would require a new air spring, so a few ££. Having ridden it for a few months now, I’m not sure it would be worth it.

Interesting thread! Thanks.

I’ve narrowed my next bike choice down to a 2016 Smuggler 2 or a Cannondale Habit SE. I’m just trying to find somewhere in the South West that might have both of them to do a side by side comparison.

Another happy Smuggler owner here:
[url=https://flic.kr/p/yXRPZ5]IMG_3125[/url] by weewillywinky, on Flickr

Great pic!!

This in on my wish list, given it a lot of thought between this and a scout, but think this is a better fit to me.

Are the Stock wheels/hubs good??

Wookster mine is a ‘custom’ build so I’m not sure on the stock wheels. I have not heard any complaints about them though!

Ah ok thanks mate!! The LbS say they are good and no issues so really looking fed to pushing the button on one of these!!

If anyone hears of any XL for sale then please give me a shout.

How did that happen? I was all set to buy an Orange Segment. I like Orange bikes. I like the way they ride and the simplicity appeals. I’d even had a demo on one and enjoyed it. But I wasn’t in any hurry. Having just put chubby wheels on my Solaris I was enjoying that. Then Richard at cyclehighlands dropped me an email to say that the Smuggler frame I’d asked him about a while back was in stock and, well, here it is, all built up and ready for me to get it muddy over the weekend.

I can’t blame Richard though. Him (and the rest of the folk at cyclehighlands) were great and very patient with my endless questions and prevarication. They are an Orange dealer too, so would have been just as happy to sell me the Segment I’m sure. But I’ve fancied a Smuggler ever since they were released and it was only really the colour that put me off buying one last year. Each to their own and all that, I just like orange (and green) bikes.

Anyway, I’ve not done any more than ride it up the track so far, It feels quite sprightly, but time will tell.

Looks goof roverpig! Where are you at?

Can’t wait to hear how you get on with the Smuggler, All I have heard is good things about them, and the a smuggler is definitely on my shortlist for when I replace my current frame!!

Roverpig, what size is yours?

It’s a large and I’m based over Aberdeen way.

The frame was really well prepared. I think it may be the first frame I’ve had (out of too many) where I could put the BB in by hand first time.

I’m giving one of these some thought to fit my B+ wheels in.
Must get a test ride on one after I’ve tried the Spech 6Fattie thing.

Hopefully will have a Demo bike from my LBS in a week or so……Can’t wait!! Really like the Bike had a Sit on one the Shop but it’s the first ride on a 29er for me, so just want to check it feels right?

Plus not sure if I need an L or XL. My 26″ five was XL plus my Epic was too…. Always felt right in those sizes. Demos a Large so I’ll get a good idea soon if it’s too short.

Really nice bike RP. That is a bike I’d be tempted by if I return to FS at some point.

Enjoy it!

Looks exactly that the 15 Patrol. Which is an awesome thing!

Great – thats about 4 Smugglers in Aberdeen/Shire!

Wookster – I’m 6ft2 ish on a Large if that’s any help…

If anyone hears of any XL for sale then please give me a shout.

Our first stock has arrived, including an XL frameset in stealth black…

Plus not sure if I need an L or XL.

I’m 6’2″ and our demo (Large) is a good fit for me (total coincidence, of course…) with wide bars and a short stem.

Plus not sure if I need an L or XL. My 26″ five was XL plus my Epic was too…. Always felt right in those sizes. Demos a Large so I’ll get a good idea soon if it’s too short.

It’s worth bearing in mind that the seat tube on these is pretty steep. Although, on paper, the ETT on this large is very similar to my large Mk1 Solaris, the reach from the saddle (at full height) to the bars is noticeably less. I think it will work OK for me at 6′ but if you do a lot of seated climbing (e.g. long fire-road slogs) then, at 6’2″, you might want to look at the XL.

Really nice bike RP. That is a bike I’d be tempted by if I return to FS at some point.

Thanks. As you know, my other bike is a Solaris, which now sports chubby wheels. I’ve been amazed at how good those chubby wheels feel on the Solaris and, to be honest, if I hadn’t already committed to the Smuggler before I got them I’d probably have held off buying anything else for a while. On the plus side, I do have the option of trying the chubbies on the Smuggler 🙂 But first things first; I’m going to test it with “normal” wheels first.

Thanks RP. Yep I’m looking forward to having a go on the Demo, but I do think the XLis the way to go. Tough call when I can’t try one ( an XL) though!!

Our first stock has arrived, including an XL frameset in stealth black

Oh dear. My colour too. Has anyone tried if other brand shocks fit in the smuggler? I never got on with Monarchs. Not sure if it’s my weight but never got them to feel right despite much trial and error with pressure and vol spacers.

OK, first ride done, so time for the traditional enthusiastic write up. Except it’s a bit more complicated than that.

First, I should point out that I’m looking for something a bit different to the supposed target market for this bike. While Gavin is chucking his down the Fort Bill WC downhill track, I’m more likely to be pottering along a land rover track, startling the wildlife and admiring the view. These reviews which talk about the Smuggler being a bike for aggressive trail riders were more of a deterrent than an incentive for me, as I’m anything but.

So, why did I go for it? Well I like to ride up and down mountains (Transition’s tag line for these bikes). I like to do it on my own and I don’t like having to walk sections. I’ve also reached the age where I tend to shatter rather than bounce and I want a bike that wont leave me broken by the trailside miles from anywhere. Basically I want all the skill compensation I can get. The problem is that I also enjoy climbing just as much as descending and a lot of the time I’m on pretty tame trails, so it needs to be fun on those too, which rules out a big bouncy beast. When I heard about these “nu-skool” 29ers (long, low slack, but short travel) I thought they sounded ideal. Big wheels and a slack head angle to keep me out of trouble, but short travel for climbing efficiency.

Anyway, enough preamble. For the first ride I chose a route that would be a good test (of me and the bike). A total of 27 miles with over four thousand feet of climbing. Some hike-a-bike up steep slopes and through a large section of heather (where the path disappears). Some fast rocky descents (but nothing too technical) and even a few miles of climbing on the road at the end. Around four and a half hours of riding, plus some time to admire the view!

So, how did it do? Well it’s fast. Out of 7 Strava segments I set 6 personal records (up and down), some by quite a bit. You’ve got to allow for some new-bike enthusiasm, especially on the climbs. The descents were more of a surprise though. They felt very controlled and composed and I felt that I was scrubbing more speed of in sections than I needed too. Basically I felt I was being a bit too cautious, so was surprised to see that I’d smashed some previous records.

Not that speed is that important to me really. The other pleasant surprise was how agile and fun it felt. My bike handling skills are somewhat limited, but it seemed just as easy to throw around and pop off things as my old Five. The big wheels and slack head angle just didn’t seem to be an issue. Maybe a touch harder to get it round tight corners. I felt I was slowing more than I’m used to on some turns. But Strava tells me that, if I did, I more than made up for it elsewhere.

So, what about the negatives? Well, by any objective measure, I’d have to say that it is a better bike than my old Five, but it lacks something of the character. By which I think I just mean that there is less feedback. It doesn’t tell you off if you jam the anchors on during a descent. It doesn’t grumble on the climbs or chatter on the flats and there isn’t that vigorous debate between the front and back wheels over which way to go. It just quietly gets on with the job of making the trail a bit smoother and leaves you to enjoy the ride, which is what a good bike should do, I guess. But when I’m on my own for hours I miss that chat.

I also like low gears. I have the Smuggler set up with a 28T NW chainring as a 42 tooth sprocket on the back, which is about as low as I can go without going 11 speed. I could still have done with one easier gear though. I knocked 30 seconds off my best time up a longish (17 minute) climb, but if I’d had a lower gear I’d have used it and gone a bit slower.

But all in all it was a pretty successful first outing. Despite my opening line I tend to try and avoid the over-enthusiastic review. It’s just a bike at the end of the day. They are pretty much all fantastic these days. Most of what I’ve said would probably apply to any of the new breed of trail 29ers. It’s easy to get sucked into obsessing about the minor details, when really you are better off just buying something you like the look of and riding it lots.

If you’ve got this far you deserve a reward, so here is a shot of it in the wild 🙂

Lush picture mate! Thanks for the write up too!

Nice write up RP, sounds like you’ve bought a great bike for all the right reasons. Enjoy riding it lots more!

Has anyone tried if other brand shocks fit in the smuggler?

We’ve not tried swapping any, but in principle there’d be no reason why something from Fox, Cane Creek, or whoever, wouldn’t work. But, I’d encourage you to give the Monarch RT3 a go first – it’s what the bike has been designed around and the suspension really does work well. It’s extremely progressive, so compliant over small bumps but incredibly capable when things get more serious.

Can you say what specifically you’ve found lacking with previous Monarchs? What versions of the shock have you been using?

I thought the Monarch felt fantastic in the open position. It also felt good fully locked out on the road section (where the stiffness of the bike in general was really welcome). I’m not so sure about the pedal position just yet though. I left it open for the first short (5 minute) climb and smashed my previous best (from 9 attempts), but that could have just been new-bike excitement 🙂 I felt I’d probably need some platform for the next longer (16 minute) and steeper climb though. It has some sections that are really borderline for me (I’ve ended up pushing more than once), so needed all the efficiency I could get. But I felt the platform kind of got in the way of the smoothness. It’s not bad (it was still a PR), but maybe it is just a bit too firm. Or maybe it would be better to just leave it open. I’ll need to experiment with it more I guess.

I am using a 2016 Fox DPS. Mainly to match the forks (tart!) and cos it’s wot Lars n Bars has but it is a very good shock. The fact you have three settings in the open position means you can run it with a little more compression but not as much as Monarch ‘trail’is nice. The lockout is a full lockout which in my opinion makes it useless, if you try and ride anything rougher than a smooth road on it the bumping and jarring wastes way more energy and momentum than if you just left it wide open.

My shock is also a stock medium tune vs the light tune on the Monarch, so isn’t really a direct comparison but I like it. Was planning to get it tuned to match but after riding for a while think it’s pretty spot on.

If they have sorted the reliability issues then a Cane Creek Inline would be fantastic if you have the time to tune well, best shock I have ridden by a long way, but it did blow up. Later ones seem fine, mine was from the first batch in the UK.

Well that was unexpected RP Enjoy

Thanks. Will do 🙂

Thanks for the update and a great photo. The Smuggler is the Covert (which I have) replacement right ?

I’ll just leave this here:

A bit of Sunday afternoon silliness; a Smuggler with B+ wheels (nicked from my Solaris).

I’ve not ridden it on any trails and am not sure I will. I was getting a few pedal strikes with the standard setup and I’m not sure dropping the BB by another 7mm is going to work. Mind you, the BB on these Mk2 bikes is supposedly 5mm higher than the Mk1, so I guess I’m just back to where a lot of Smuggler riders were last year anyway. Maybe with 170mm cranks. No, that way madness lies. Looks good though, don’t you think 🙂

ps. I finally got round to weighing it. If you can believe my bathroom scales the all up weight (including pedals, dropper post) of this size Large was 30.5 lb with the 29er wheels and 31.5 lb with the B+ wheels. Slightly lighter than my 26″ Orange Five which came in at 32 lb but heavier than the Solaris in 29er guise, which was 29 lb (both on the same scales).

I was just about to start a thread askiing if other Smuggler owners were getting lots of pedal strikes….I’m on the older version than you btw.

That orange looks almost fluro there!

Yes, sorry, I think I must have had a funny setting on the phone or I clicked something in photobucket.

Anyway, I guess pedal strikes are a price you have to pay for a low BB. Still pretty annoying though. I used to have a lot on an old 26″ Giant Trance and I can’t say I missed them when I moved to the Five. I’ve got a feeling that if you buy a full bike from Transition now they come with 170mm cranks, so that may be worth considering.

Looks good in + format

I do get a lot of pedal strikes but I’m on 175 cranks. It’s not a bad problem, just something to be aware of. I ride flat and imagine that doesn’t help compared to spds or something.

Yeah I am looking for 170m cranks and some thin profile flat pedals to try an minimise it but as you say that is the price you pay for the low BB.