…offensive, really? It certainly is to me!

I mean, it’s supposed to be about the folly and disaster of War, isn’t it?

Think I’ve got myself really quite upset that people would actually think this was a good idea. 🙁

I may have gone a bit social… https://twitter.com/rachel_norfolk/status/662551257828208640

Rachel

It’s so that you can feel a bit of “pre-remembrance” while you wait for the just-released bomb to hit it’s target/wedding party/Medicenes sans frontieres hospital.

It would look sillier with a red nose.

it’s supposed to be about the folly and disaster of War, isn’t it?

Originally the poppy was started by mothers who’d lost sons in the Great War along with the Cenotaph campaigns (iirc) but was quickly overtaken by the military. Nowadays its a strange celebration of pointless deaths in combat, hiding behind a charity for those damaged by those conflicts. It should be the day we get together and say collectively “never again”…

True meaning has long since been hijacked. Maybe it’s easier to remember the dead if you keep making more of them.

Do you reckon that a vinyl wrap? bound to fall off in flight if you ask me.

Nope, you’re absolutely right… You’re just being a bit sensitive.

The poppy has become a horrible symbol of ‘support our brave boys’ which is code for ‘support whatever war we tell you to or you’ll be branded a traitor’. Original meaning completely lost.

Nowadays its a strange celebration of pointless deaths in combat, hiding behind a charity for those damaged by those conflicts.

Well, I wear mine (as I think very many do) to mark my respect for all the British and Commonwealth service men and women who have fallen in war on behalf of my country.

Of course, it being (relatively) a free one, you can please yourself…

given the people who fly, maintain or operate around that plane are the ones who have likely lost friends, colleagues, possibly even relatives to war do you not think they should be the ones deciding if it is offensive?

It’s not a weapon, it’s an aeroplane.

I mean, sure, you ca put weapons on it, but you can also use it as, for example, a sensor platform to look for on the run criminals (http://www.lynnnews.co.uk/news/local/latest-local-news/marham-tornados-in-raoul-moat-hunt-1-669029)

Also worth remembering that weapons can be used in a purely defensive, rather than aggressive role, such as shooting down German flying bombs, like, er, the RAF did in WW2.

Edit:
Of course, if someone was looking to be offended, you would have thought they might have been more offended by the Lancaster bomber of the BBMF that keeps dropping poppies on remembrance parades? It’s been doing it for bloody years without upsetting anyone though…

If that’s the case, STATO, then I can feel fairly legitimate in expressing my feelings, being ex-defence…

ninfan – that’s like saying a rifle isn’t a weapon, a bullet is…

Rachel

Originally the poppy was started by mothers who’d lost sons in the Great War along with the Cenotaph campaigns (iirc) but was quickly overtaken by the military.

The remembrance poppy was used since 1921 and taken from the poem In Flanders Field.

In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

I can’t think a better place to put a poppy than on a weapon as to me it says weapons kill and this should be your last resort.
I recently went to NWA at Lichfield and after finding names of those I served with I was more upset to find the large area left blank for more names to be added. I wear my poppy to remember those that have fallen and as a warning against future wars.

This Bernie Boston picture says how I feel.

Its the same as putting a poppy on the grill of a car – and cars kill more than tornadoes do 😉

Then being ‘ex-defence’ you should know the difference between a weapon and a piece of equipment. 🙄

The poppy has become a horrible symbol of ‘support our brave boys’ which is code for ‘support whatever war we tell you to or you’ll be branded a traitor’. Original meaning completely lost.

This

But equally

This:

I can’t think a better place to put a poppy than on a weapon as to me it says weapons kill and this should be your last resort.

Personally, and I’m not sure what validity my thoughts have outside of my own mind, the occasion is to remember those who did the fighting and were killed or maimed in the process. For me, I take time out to remember the grandfather I never knew and my two uncles who were scarred and traumatised by combat in WW2. I despair at the political hijacking of the event and equally, I reject the ‘poppy nazis’, it smacks of the white feathers handed out during the 1914-18 war and in retrospect, we all know how misguided that was.

Would you be offended if you saw a soldier wearing a poppy on his uniform? I just saw an old man sitting in the foyer of Sainsburys, wearing a military great coat and medals, with a poppy pinned next to them. He was even selling the bloody things!! The cheek!

Maybe I need to get my affrontment gland checked out… 😕

The poppy/remembrance day stuff just washes over me most of the time.
I often think about the lost ones more deeply,when I stop in the wee villages.
Memorials are usually a good spot to sit with the bike ,have a snack and there’s time to look around.
It’s then ,when you see how big the list of names is compared to the size of the village ,that’s when it really gets me.
All those sons and fathers,I can only imagine the heartbreak and grief in such tiny communities.

Then being ‘ex-defence’ you should know the difference between a weapon and a piece of equipment.

To be fair though, the sentiment is the same. It’s not a piece of equipment that has many uses other than to deliver or use weapons.

it’s not a weapon, it’s an aeroplane.

pointless pedantry is pointless

@gatsby – Am I offended by people wearing poppies? No. I wear one too but equally respect those who choose not to. They may be doing their remembrance in a different way. It is not unknown for people to donate to the British Legion and not wear the poppy. I know this is what I did for many years.

Oh yes and @fasthaggis, I know exactly what you mean. It is humbling when you see the lists of the dead.

Well, I wear mine to…

Well I wear my cross to….
if your chosen organisation is morally bankrupt then that’s not a very good kop out is it?

I’m certainly not saying the charity is morally bankrupt but there do seem to be a lot of people using the poppy in their own way for their own ends.

<edit>I’m not googling it now coz I don’t want to inadvertently increase their hit count, but seem to recall Britain first have some previous with poppy appeal.

Cross? And you talk about moral bankruptcy? Irony alert is going haywire.

ninfan – that’s like saying a rifle isn’t a weapon, a bullet is…

Rachel

Is it worth noting that in both situations it is the human being that has been ordered to use that weapon that is the killer, even if it is the lumps of metal doing the killing. It’s the people that should be thought about not the inanimate objects.

I see no reason why there shouldn’t be a poppy on the plane, it’s just a symbol, no different from someone playing the last post or laying a wreath. It lets people know that we are thinking about the fallen and so long as it has that effect and makes someone think then is it a bad thing?

Irony alert is going haywire.

I’m atheist, as is Woppit, quite outspokenly so, hence me choosing that example.

What’s up with STW today? All these posts and not one suggestion of a Daisy Cutter?

On the OP, I agree that it could be viewed as offensive and understand the reasons for it being so. Wearing a poppy on uniform is very different as whilst ultimately its a person in uniform that pulls the trigger the same person is the one with a conscience. The same cannot be said for a plane/equipment/weapon/whatever.

no different from someone playing the last post

On a sophisticated communication device specifically developed and used by the military to deliver orders to troops on the battlefield, enhancing their combat effectiveness.

My poppy is stuck high up near where the rear view mirror would be in my van. Theoretically according to some on here my van is deemed a weapon 🙄 so I’m guilty too.

pointless pedantry is pointless

Pointing out pointless pedantry is even more pointless shirley?

Best STW post I’ve seen on this subject in the many years it’s been regurgitated.

http://noglory.org/index.php/articles/75-this-year-i-will-wear-a-poppy-for-the-last-time-says-91-year-old-veteran

Pointing out pointless pedantry is even more pointless shirley?

Not as pointless as pointing out that pointing out pointless pedantry is pointless.

Don’t wear a poppy because I don’t believe in glorifying the military.
Its meaning has drifted to include all of our ‘brave boys’ and I don’t think it’s particularly tragic when a professional soldier is killed while invading another country for no particular reason.

LeeW, yeah probably.

jon1973 – Member

Pointing out pointless pedantry is even more pointless shirley?

Not as pointless as pointing out that pointing out pointless pedantry is pointless.

*Pointless pedantry* I was asking a question *Pointless pedantry*

Don’t wear a poppy because I don’t believe in glorifying the military.

I refuse as I really object to the #PoppyFascism thing which comes hand in hand with the whole thing. Plus I think it’s the ultimate in hypocrisy, personally I don’t give a shit about dead people I never knew and I suspect neither do most poppy wearers (although I’m sure they’d all protest that they really do care, so much so they spent £1 on a piece of tat).

Fast Haggis opined

I often think about the lost ones more deeply,when I stop in the wee villages.
Memorials are usually a good spot to sit with the bike ,have a snack and there’s time to look around.

A recent trip to Bavaria was an eye-opener when I realised there were recorded deaths from late 1947 on the memorials. Mention of Eastern Russia as well. The poor devils had died while still in camps provided by good old Uncle Joe.

I think it’s more hypocritical that folk who wear them still send people to die and the lesson has all been lost.

I don’t care much for folk I never knew either, it doesn’t mean I don’t care about those who might still end up there or are still living through it though.

Think you may have gone a little too far with that footflaps!

If you think about it, I’m sure you probably do GAS.