Dez – are you trying to be a complete ar5e?

This comment:

And this is her second miscarriage.

Either she is still living too hard, or is just damned unlucky.

Is what prompted my “offensive” comment.

That and your other comments make me question why you feel the need to “contribute” at all? Trying to be controversial or something?

Why not just stay out of it? Your comments add nothing.

Sorry Mat dont really see that to be honest. And there was definitely no suggestion that it was aimed in your direction.

If you have never gone through it then you would be blind to some of the facts, causes etc and it would be perfectly normal to assume that someones lifestyle may have had a hand in it.

As it is life is not as straightforward as that. :'(

TBH seems a bizarre thread to start on here… I think most of us know how threads go on here especially involving celebs.

A few others here have suffered similar fates and understand. The rest have no idea.

That is unreasonable – you don’t have to have suffered such an event to understand how devastating it would be.

Max – okay I see where you’re coming from but the fact is some of the most unhealthy, fag puffing, boozing women have a huge brood of healthy kids while some of the healthiest, most “clean” living mums to be have a complete nightmare with miscarriages or simply just not being able to get pregnant in the first place.

Lilly appeared to have a virus and that’s it – it would appear that the virus is probably the cause of the miscarriage. Truly dreadful.

Some days you read something that makes you realise just how lucky you are.

I know Matt, you go through all these thoughts, but if anything it made me realise that it really isnt based on how “good” you are during the pregnancy etc, what will be will be.

It was a virus in our case, a pure fluke of ridiculous odds…

A third of all pregnacies end in miscarriage and given that Lilly has now had two she’s at risk of recurrent miscarriage.

Very sad.

Hopefully the work that my company is doing will be able to help some of these people

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article6817618.ece

Why not just stay out of it? Your comments add nothing.

Sorry, add nothing to what exactly?

Max – terrible and must bring out a thousand “what ifs?”

Ours was a different but also hideous stroke of terrible luck too – less than one in a million.

wheres TJ to tell us the world is overcrowded anyway and she was selfish for wanting kids in the first place?!

As men we can’t even begin to think how bad it must be.

+1

Sometimes, just sometimes, Hora, you say the most insightful and beautifully sensitive things.

Notice how it’s men arguing on here. Shame on you.

Firstly, I have no idea why Surf-Mat started the thread in the first place. It seemed bizarre to me – I suspect it was more about his eagerness to share his bereavement with us than a [ublic declaration of sympathy with Miss Allen. I’m sure she has a website or twitter or some such Mat; you could have sympathised with her directly.

Secondly, DezB, c’mon mate, you were trying to be controversial when you made the “hard living” comment. It’s classic STW behaviour. Say something that’s going to wind some people up a little then stand back, hands in the air saying “Never touched ‘im ref”. See ton for the classic example.

Thirdly, is any of us surprised this has descended into an undignified bun fight? Some of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves and the sooner this is pulled, frankly, the better. It’s a sorry sight. 🙁

Notice how it’s men arguing on here. Shame on you.

Now I could go into how the man is often ignored in these situations and expected to “man up” and so on or how the crushing helplessness, fear and distress that trying to help your partner get through a natural birth of a child who will never survive feels, but as I dont really see the point of this thread or really want to go on about relitively still raw feelings I think I shall bow out and stick to the bike threads..

It is a tragedy for her and all that know and care for her.
It is a tragedy that in this media clebrity obsessed world complete strangers are discussing this and offering her sympathy.
It is tragic what happened to surf-mat.
I doubt anyine think anyone desrves it but it is reasonable to ask about her colourful past and whether it was /is a factor. I am in no position to pass judgement or offer an answer
I am thankful it has not happened to me and that my kids are ok.
I think as a man you can understand loss and it is a bit patronising to suggest that the father has it easier than the mother …both are hard

deadly, are you suggesting SM started the thread for his own vanity?

The trouble is i guess, those who have experienced a miscarriage will have much more of an emotional attachment to the subject than those who haven’t. As a result they tend to be perhaps a little oversensitive towards it?

deadly, are you suggesting SM started the thread for his own vanity?

Not at all. I wouldn’t confuse an over-eagerness to share with vanity.

Nobody thinking that posting a thread like this might be a part, of anyone who has suffered this type of loss, coming to terms with their own loss?

Some people need to be more careful how they tread.

EDIT: sod it, nothing to do with me

Deadly – the dates (of miscarriage) are the same, that’s all. TBH, apart from some silly comments, it’s incredibly comforting for “us” to share our losses.

As for the bloke being left out – didn’t enter my mind. All thoughts were for my wife.

Anyway let’s leave it there. Sorry once again to all those who have suffered similar.

Surrounded By Zulus – Member
Some people need to be more careful how they tread.

That could be argued both ways.

We lost our little boy at 19 weeks back in July, we took solice in the fact we have Amelie our 3 year old.

It must be so much worse if it’s your first! Poor girl

I knew what this thread was going to be about and don’t know why I clicked on it.

This is devastating for her, and brings backs memories of our own losses. Maybe the fact that she’s a celebrity will bring more attention to the sad fact that this is more common than most people realise.

At 6 months it is not a mis-carriage, She lost her child. Think about that for a minute before making any flippant remarks or comments.

Secondly, DezB, c’mon mate, you were trying to be controversial when you made the “hard living” comment

Er, you might want to check that.

descended into an undignified bun fight?
Well as the guy who started the thread also started that, I guess that could be how he wanted it to go?

I don’t understand the need for people to post on here argumentatively over such a devastating subject. It’s a public chat forum, if someone wants to start a thread then they have every right to. Surf Mat has every right to post on here about it, there have been other threads offering support to other members/threads about depression/marriage break down/family & friends dying etc. Sometimes it’s just nice to know that you are not alone and that other people understand what you have been through and as celebrities are known to most then its a common starting point to talk to people.

If you are not interested or are not in the frame of mind to post something sympathetic in situations like this then just leave alone. I know there’s the argument that it is a public forum so it’s to be expected but it’s pettiness like this that makes this forum unlikeable and that is a shame. There’s no need for it so try to be supportive of other people’s loss rather than argue them down or make comments to try and get a reaction.

I’ve never experienced anything so horrendous so can’t even begin to imagine what it must be like but even I have felt like reacting to some of the comments made so it’s no wonder some who have been through it all have felt the need to challenge. Sorry to thread crash, that will be all. 🙁

Well said Emma.

+ 10 Emma, Sharki and supersessions.

i can’t imagine what it must be like emotionally to be put into a medically induced labour knowing your baby is already dead, at 24-26 weeks she will have had to have delivered a stillborn baby and gone through a labour. She will have been excited and looking forward to have been a mother especially as she has miscarried before. And now it has happenned again.It’s NOT her fault it’s happenned one in three to four pregnancies end in miscarriage. She must be going through a personal hell but it happens she is also a celebrity.

Those of us who can conceive without any problems don’t know how lucky we are and shouldnt mock those who fail to.

I think it is a very odd thing to start a thread about. Peculiar in fact. What on earth importance is it to us?

I think it is a very odd thing to start a thread about. Peculiar in fact. What on earth importance is it to us?

It has a cathartic effect for the OP.

Empathy folks. Its a powerful and wonderful thing.

When mrshora started having pains and passed blood early. It was a numbing and scary experience.

Us men will never know, come even close to knowing the risks etc women go through to give birth to us and to our Sons and Daughters.

I think it is a very odd thing to start a thread about. Peculiar in fact. What on earth importance is it to us?

The subject seems to be quite important to a few people on here TJ? Maybe the thread isn’t actually about Lilly Allen?

Agreed Hora …and TJ it may not have any importance to you so just don’t post and move along? As you can blatently see from the thread it has relevance to quite a few people on here so don’t wade in trying to stir things up.

As someone who’s been through it. Twice. Can I just say

TJ – SHUT THE **** UP!!!!

That is all

I think that is a fitting end post binners. </thread>

mrs ton had a miscarriage.
i always thought there was a reason when a woman has a miscarriage….kinda like the natural way for a baby not to be born.
not a thing to mourn about…..if you see what i mean.

maxray – Member

TBH seems a bizarre thread to start on here.

I don’t think I’ve ever (in several years of being on STW) seen someone ask why someone else has started a thread…….and then people ask why on a subject like this. Why is this not worthy of discussion?????

Part of the breavement process is talking about things and people are shooting down surfmatt for talking about what has happened to him. I really don’t understand why you would want to do that? and to suggest that he would do it for vanity is just offensive. Maybe he finds it easier to talk about it this way.

My wife is currently 13 weeks and to think about this happening for the 3rd time (for us) is just unthinkable.

Some of you really need to have a good hard think about what you are saying!!

not a thing to mourn about…..if you see what i mean.

What like when someone dies – say your wife or brother or dad or best friend?

Ahh well, it was just cancer/brain tumour etc, it was meant to happen.

Silly argument.

I have no problem with someone wanting to talk about their experiences even of horrible things and where I can I do my best to be supportive

What I find odd is the discussing of a celebrities miscarriage. Seems odd to me and clearly to others.

I’ll butt out now but I want to be clear. I have no issue with discussing things of relevance to us or to any stwer. I find the discussion of celebrities odd.

ton, so if a kids dies of meningitis, no cause to mourn, natural – just happened for a reason kind of thing?

people are shooting down surfmatt for talking about what has happened to him

It is simply because Matt is often the fall guy in threads so the really tough kids like to gang up on him.

fella’s what i meant, was that in most cases a woman miscarries cos the baby is not well in the womb……and it is natures way of stopping the birth.
and how do you mourn something you have never known??