You knows the risks you takes your chances.

OH and the questions are flawed. Try asking how many hours of accident free/injury free cycling there have been and there will be huge numbers to be bandied about. Not saying it proves things one way or another.

The “what if” arguements don’t stand up to scrutiny unless you go back and recreate the accident without/with the lid in place and i personally am not willing to crash test dummy every scenario but i know some people who i would volunteer.

It’s the “this crash could have been nasty therefore every crash could be nasty” arguement.

1) Twice
2) Loads
3) Never
4) Always on the mountain bike, rarely on the hack bike.

My helmet(s) may not have saved my life when I had my 2 most serious crashes, but they most definitely saved me from a lot of pain. That’s enough for me!
eg. try to break a car windscreen with your bare head. Ouch.

1) 2
2) a few
3) None
4) 0%

1)3…Cuts and bruises,and concussion a couple of times,but my skull didn’t break or my scalp wasn’t cut. If concussion counts as being harmed probably only once.

2)20ish

3)Never

4)About 5% of the time,rarely but sometimes.

1) maybe 5 times

2) loads

3) never

4) <5% (will pop the full face in the backpack for climbing on fireroads)

Probably from studies rather more scientific than this one.

Until people are good enouh to have their crashes under laboratory conditions, the experienced people at the coal face would be the best people to ask I would have thought.

a) 2
b) Loads I suppose, but never really thought about it.
c) Never
4) 99.9% of the time I wear it. The only exception being post fettling shake down pootles around the block.

Until people are good enouh to have their crashes under laboratory conditions, the experienced people at the coal face would be the best people to ask I would have thought.

Maybe, the professionals who test helmets, reconstruct accidents and treat people might be better ones to ask than cyclists who don’t actually have a good idea of how much energy a helmet actually absorbs, though if you are going to ask the cyclists, I don’t think a self-selecting internet forum survey with dodgy questions is the right way to do it. Particularly not if the answers to the questions don’t really prove anything anyway.

The only exception being post fettling shake down pootles around the block.

Bizarrely you’re not the first to suggest that from such a pro-helmet group, given IMHO that’s one of the most likely times for you to have an accident which a helmet would help with. But don’t let yourself be swayed by non-emotive arguments.

a) 3
b) A few
c) 1 – peak detached when having first off mentioned in a) which cut my nose a bit
d) 0%

I have to mention the countless times my helmet has saved me from contact with rather large branches that would have caused damage if allowed to hit me in the face or head

a) 5
b) Many
c) None
d) 0%

Had an accident in Bristol in 1990 on the road. Car went through a red light. Went over the roof landing on my head. Regained consciousness on the road before the ambulance arrived. Passed out again. Came to in hospital totally blind and paralysed down one side of my body. Thankfully all back to normal 12 hours later. Never been so terrified in my life. Didn’t ride a bike for 8 months afterwards (Also had fractured shoulder blade, broken collar bone, broken finger and a big fear of the road.)Had splitting headaches daily for nearly 2 years and had no recollection of the event for over 6 months. Didn’t have a helmet on.

Have worn a helmet ever since. Had a remarkably similar accident in London 10 years later and was wearing one. Walked home. Felt fine by the same evening.

Proved it all for me.

Bizarrely you’re not the first to suggest that from such a pro-helmet group, given IMHO that’s one of the most likely times for you to have an accident which a helmet would help with. But don’t let yourself be swayed by non-emotive arguments.

It is daft as one of my tests is quite a high set of steps and I also test brakes on 2 steep hills. It would appear that you have become rather emotive and are losing, what appeared to me, as the very small bit of credibility that you had. Strange how this subject provokes such strong reaction.

1) none
2) one
3) none
4) 2% (like popping to Tesco for a loaf of bread)

Cheers for that people.

obviously totally unscientific and only kind of proves that stats and surveys are prone to dodgyness if nothing else. To me it just shows that very few folk have been injured by their hats in any way, let alone seriously, which reinforces my own experience.

I’m going to hop back onto the fence on this one, and wait for TJ whose views generally I concur with to convince me further. So jury still out here TJ.

Oh yeah and the other thing…. isn’t it interesting how defensive the non helmet people are of their view. They seem to get quite aggresive quite quickly about it. So whats that about ?

1) How many times have you experienced a cycling incident where your were wearing a helmet and the helmet was damaged but you weren’t?
2) How many times have you received a blow to the head while cycling where neither you nor your helmet suffered any damage?
3) How many times have you been involved in a cycling incident where your helmet has harmed you regardless of whether it protected you or not?
4) What percentage of your cycling time is ridden without wearing a helmet

Just to kick off

1) 2
2) loads, usually low slung branches
3) once, got a strained neck but avoided a fractured skull so will take it.
4) 0%

1. Depends on what you call damaged?
I’ve split a helmet in half and was cuncussed. Does that count?
I’ve put dents in helmets and was fine.

We’ll go with a few but I think it’s a flawed question and really should have a second question about damage to yourself and the helmet.

2. Lots. Trees, ground, branches. But then that means there was no visible damage to the helmet or me abd as it’s the polystrene under the hard shell that matters it’s very hard to tell if the helmet was damaged.

3. I’ve been snagged on branches before which can hurt and it’s hard to tell if neck injuries (like whiplash) are because your helmet hit the ground but if you hadn’t have been wearing it your head may not have contacted the ground and you’d have been fine.
4. 95%ish. I only don’t wear one when riding into town or when riding drunk at events/parties. Stupidly enough probably the 2 most likely times you’ll get knocked off or fall off ;0)

Probably from studies rather more scientific than this one.

There’s nothing unscientific about doing a simple poll – epidemiologists and others do it all the time. As long as the conclusions (if any) are limited to similar riders to the group polled and there is no inherent bias in the questions, the job’s a good un. It should be statistically powered at 100 plus answers (this is a complete guess btw 😉 )
My answers:
a) one helmet returned for replacement after a high speed head-plant (~15 years riding with a helmet).
b) a fair few minor collisions with branches and minor offs .
c) stiff neck after head plant and scuffed scalp (helmet rotated 90 degrees in crash).
d) <1% helmet not worn.

1) 3 (over the bars directly onto top of head scenarios)
2) Nothing major, plenty of tree-branches and the like
3) None
4) <1%

1) How many times have you experienced a cycling incident where your were wearing a helmet and the helmet was damaged but you weren’t?
NEVER
2) How many times have you received a blow to the head while cycling where neither you nor your helmet suffered any damage?
COUNTLESS TIMES
3) How many times have you been involved in a cycling incident where your helmet has harmed you regardless of whether it protected you or not?
NEVER
4) What percentage of your cycling time is ridden without wearing a helmet
ZERO, its illegal in Australia to set your ass on a saddle without a helmet on.

1) Loads but three times where I’m convinced the helmet prevented serious damage.
2) Loads
3) never
4) 25% (Darkside non-commuting)

obviously totally unscientific and only kind of proves that stats and surveys are prone to dodgyness if nothing else.

Which is also true of some “proper” surveys – they often ask biased questions designed to get a particular response – something to bear in mind when a newspaper says that statistics show something. However it is possible to do them properly if you’re careful (and I’d hope those used for proper scientific papers are – they should be if the peer review system works properly).

isn’t it interesting how defensive the non helmet people are of their view.

As I’ve stated multiple times, I wouldn’t describe myself as a non-helmet person (can’t be bothered to repeat my position – do a search if you want to know). However it’s hardly surprising that people get defensive when they get called stupid for daring to question the orthodoxy.

There’s nothing unscientific about doing a simple poll – epidemiologists and others do it all the time.

Indeed – but for a start they’d make sure the respondents weren’t self selecting!

1. 2
2. never – provided we’re not talking about a tap from ducking under branches etc
3. never
4. 95%

1. 3. All needed new helmets
2. Countless. Every few rides my helmet will get some minor knock.
3. Never
4. 100%

I can’t say for certain that my helmet has ever saved my life but my last big crash was head-first into lots of pointy rocks. I dusted myself off and had a slight headache. The helmet was ruined. It’s fairly obvious I would, at the very least, have bled an awful lot and needed loads of stitches, without the helmet.

My scalp just isn’t very rockproof. I don’t need any science or statistics to tell me that.

Oh yeah and the other thing…. isn’t it interesting how defensive the non helmet people are of their view. They seem to get quite aggresive quite quickly about it. So whats that about ?

Who are the non-helmet people?

From my desk i can see my Giro Atmos (sitting on the roadie saddle) and sitting in the back of the car is my Giro Havoc. Not anti-helmet in any way but fed up of poles with bias, deliberate or not, reinforcing a particular view point.

interesting debate this. The fight against the apparent common sense perception (to wear a lid is best) could be more to do with not wanting to be told what to do or being an seen as an individual. I hate being told what to do and would probably rebel against any law forcing me cover my noggin with a bit of way over priced plastic and polystyrene.

However as I’m a coward and don’t like pain:

1, 4
2, lots
3, not sure but can see it could have happened
4, 0.1% when doing a post fettle test. this being one of the times I could hurt myself due to mind set of low risk. Bit like tow path rides (oops).

“Maybe, the professionals who test helmets, reconstruct accidents and treat people might be better ones to ask”

I was at a lecture last year given by a neurosurgeon, about brain haemorrhages. It wasn’t addressed to an audience of cyclists at all, but he still spent a good few minutes going on and on about “for God’s sake people, please wear helmets when you’re cycling”.

1 = 3 times all road racing/training
2 = Loads
3 = Got a nasty rash once
4 = 0%

1- None
2- None
3- None
4- 5%

Hope you are going to collate all this.

1) 0 (I’ve broken 3 helmets, each time I’ve had other injuries, like a fat lip, a broken collarbone and a dislocated finger).
2) Hundreds probably.
3) It rubs a bit on the back of my neck, does that count?
4) 90%

So jury still out here TJ.

I thought this was going to put it to bed once and for all 😥

kevonakona – Member

Who are the non-helmet people?

From my desk i can see my Giro Atmos (sitting on the roadie saddle) and sitting in the back of the car is my Giro Havoc. Not anti-helmet in any way but fed up of poles with bias, deliberate or not, reinforcing a particular view point.

Actually fella I was trying to see TJ’s point, rather than prove or disprove anything in an obviously unscientific poll. I’ve been around cycling a long time and I’ve heard all of the arguments many times, but frankly I just don’t get the argument. I’ve never, and I mean never seen anything that supports the arguments that not wearing a helmet is safer or better for cycling than wearing one. Seems to be borne out by the experience on here. So armed with that fundamentally flawed view I’ve climbed right back up onto the fence and still await the day when someone can convince me that not wearing a skid lid is a good idea.

Other thought is that much like the Jade Goody thing if you’re fed up with something best advice is to ignore it in my experience.

that much like the Jade Goody thing if you’re fed up with something best advice is to ignore it in my experience.

and at last that f*!@king thread is falling off the page!

1) 3
2) Several – 10 maybe?
3) 1, but it saved my head and my throat was hurt by the strap
4) 3-5% ish

1) Once, I hit a overhanging tree branch at night and put a dent in the polystyrene and cracked & Bent the shell cover.

2) A couple of times, both over the bar moments with me landing head first on soft ground, hence the over the bar moment in the first place.

3) Never.

4) I wear a helmet for 99% of my riding bar the little jaunts up and down our avenue after post fetteling sessions

1. Once
2. Shed loads
3. None
4. 1%

1. None
2. None
3. None
4. 0%