Viewing 29 posts - 1 through 29 (of 29 total)
  • Ghetto Tubeless
  • bigsi
    Free Member

    Looking to go tubeless on my 29er and don't really fancy forking out over £50 for the kit (have all the bits apart from rimstrips lying around) so am looking to go down the ghetto route.

    The question is what size inner tube should i use on the 29er rim. I think I'm right in saying that for a 26" wheel the recomended tube size is 20" but what would it be for a 29er. 24", 26" ?

    Anyone tried this and if so how successful was it for them. I'll be using Bonty ACX tyres which are tubeless ready and Halo Freedom rims.

    Any thoughts etc welcome 😀

    schrickvr6
    Free Member

    I'd have thought 24" tubes would be ideal.

    el_diablo
    Free Member

    Slightly off topic, but I went Ghetto last night and was struggling to inflate the tyres, that was until I made this…

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    rich-6
    Free Member

    ^^ Nice idea, Ghetto FTW 8)

    daim
    Full Member

    @MFCat – I doff my cap to you. That is genius! 🙂

    daim
    Full Member

    If it is any help, I run Ghetto tubeless on my Halo Freedom Discs. I use the tape only method using 1 layer of reinforced packing tape and 1 layer of PVC electricians tape (no faffing with 20" inner tubes) and run Specialized Eskar 2Bliss.

    I have never burped a tire and get zero air loss. Last time I added any air to either tyres was about 6 weeks ago.

    Can't recommend it enough.

    rich-6
    Free Member

    WHat do you do for valves Daim? Do you purchase tubeless ones?

    edd
    Full Member

    A+ MFCat

    bigsi
    Free Member

    daim – talk me through that one will ya as i've not heard of that method 😕

    daim
    Full Member

    Right, this is my method. I didn't invent it, it's just what I use and has worked flawlessly for me. No air loss, no burping, no punctures.

    You will need:

    1. Some very fine sanding blocks. Preferably those sponge ones. Available from any DIY shop.

    2. Some strong, clear cross-weave or mono-filament packing tape. The cross weave stuff is usually very wide but can easily be torn lengthwise (like duct tape) to get the right width for the bottom of your rim.

    3. Some PVC electrical (insulation tape)

    4. Some washing-up liquid and water

    5. Some Stans solution or similar latex based sealant.

    6. A CO2 inflator or compressor. (I never have any luck with the initial inflation and seating using a track pump despite what other folks claim. Maybe I just have weak arms.)

    7. The presta valves from some Schwalbe tubes or similar. Basically, ones with removable cores so you can easily top up your sealant.

    The method:

    1. Remove tyres and rim strips from wheels.

    2. Wash wheels and dry well.

    3. Sand the inside of the rims to make sure they are perfectly smooth and clean. Use some very fine sanding blocks. You can get these from any DIY shop.

    4. Get packing tape to fit the width of the base of your rim. It should ideally be slightly narrower than the insulation tape although I have used this method very sloppily in a hurry and had no issues whatsoever. Stick the tape around the circumference of the rim with an overlap of about 100mm. Make sure it is pressed down well and completely covers all of the spoke holes.

    5. Do exactly the same with the insulation tape. It should ideally be slightly wider than the packing tape and again press down well.

    6. Cut the valves from the tubes so that they will seat well and make a good seal against the tape.

    7. Carefully cut a hole in the tape so you can insert the valve into the rim and do it up nice and tight.

    8. Put your tyre on the rim as you usually would, get loads of nice foamy washing up liquid mixed with water around the bead of the tyre.

    9. Add your sealant to the tyre.

    10. Use your compressor or CO2 inflator and just blast the air into the tyre. It has always inflated and seated for me first time. Get it up to a good high pressure. You can always let some air out once it is well sealed.

    11. Swill your solution around the tyre, getting it up to the beads to make a good seal. Hold the tyre vertically, side on and swill using a forward-backward motion whilst rotating the tyre.

    12. That's it. You are done. Do your other wheel and go and have a nice cuppa.

    I have successfully used the Schwalbe presta valves for well over a year but recently I splashed out on some of the Stans Valves to replace them. These work just as well, no better, no worse. They are the "standard" ones, I bought them here: http://www.justridingalong.co.uk/?product=58

    The tapes I bought from here: http://www.tapes-direct.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=148_193

    Daim

    sailor74
    Free Member

    what is the point of ghetto tubeless? you still have most of a tube in your wheel, and after adding sealant it probably weight more than with a standars tube.

    i have been running tubeless but its a pain, last 2 punctures failed to seal and i had the messy job of sorting it all out on the trail. I now just run tubes (i was carrying spares anyway).

    uplink
    Free Member

    what is the point of ghetto tubeless? you still have most of a tube in your wheel, and after adding sealant it probably weight more than with a standars tube.

    It's not about saving weight

    i have been running tubeless but its a pain, last 2 punctures failed to seal and i had the messy job of sorting it all out on the trail. I now just run tubes (i was carrying spares anyway).

    I've now not had a puncture in 4 years 🙂

    daim
    Full Member

    @Sailor74 – What uplink says 🙂

    Since going tubeless I have not had to worry at all about punctures and the tyres are much more compliant. When you first go tubeless it feels like you are running on under-inflated tyres, they feel so plush.

    With repect to the weight query: The amount of tape you use in my method along with a scoop of latex weighs WAY less than an inner tube.

    Trust me, I was a serious tubeless skeptic before giving it a go. I would never go back to tubes now. The only disadvantage is if you are a tyre-tart and are forever swapping tyres. Unless you have a compressor it would be more hassle for you.

    sv
    Full Member

    Does the CO2 not affect the latex – quicker curing times?

    daim
    Full Member

    sv – Member

    Does the CO2 not affect the latex – quicker curing times?

    Not that I have noticed. Maybe it gives a slower curing time?

    If it concerns you, you can evacuate the CO2 from the tyre once it is seated and sealed properly and then pump it back up with your track pump.

    You do this anyway when you need to add new sealant via the valve.

    buzz-lightyear
    Free Member

    what is the point of ghetto tubeless?

    No (hardly any) punctures. Not sure why yours didn't work.

    hora
    Free Member

    Ive noticed- Ive got a DT 5.1 rim on the front. Its easier?….if I buy the DT conversion strip/valve? Its supposed to be set up for easy conversion right?

    Lanesra
    Free Member

    CO2 kills the sealant – once seated you should deflate then pump up with a compressor/track pump

    daim
    Full Member

    Lanesra – Member

    CO2 kills the sealant – once seated you should deflate then pump up with a compressor/track pump

    I can't find any evidence that it does and I have certainly not experienced any issue using CO2 with sealant. I usually use CO2 to inflate the tyre and leave it at that. I would be interested in hearing about any of your experiences of sealant being "killed" by the CO2. Anything I can find online seems purely anecdotal with no real evidence to support it. TBH it reeks of "urban myth" to me.

    I concede that in very cold conditions, there is the possibility that the initial rush of very cold CO2 could temporarily freeze the sealant but I believe Stans is designed to have a very low freezing point indeed. If it didn't have then riding in winter would freeze your sealant. I have never had my sealant freeze nor has it been "killed" using CO2.

    Wally
    Full Member

    Not an urban myth IMO
    Latex sorbs CO2 and swells resulting in a coagulated lump in your tyre.

    daim
    Full Member

    Just found this: http://messageboard.notubes.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=66 so it looks like Stan's dont recommend using CO2 except for an on-the-trail fix.

    Doesn't change the fact that in my experience it has had no detrimental effect on the sealant that I have been able to detect. As always though, YMMV.

    bigsi
    Free Member

    Cheers Daim sounds very straight forward, similar to when i ran stans on a 26" wheel, had just never heard about the tape method and as i have all of the bits to do it will give it a go.

    As for CO2 killing the latex, I always used this to inflate my 26" wheels and never noticed any problems so will continue to do it 😕

    Wally
    Full Member

    Tape super ghetto method
    Rocks because it makes changing tyres possible.

    daim
    Full Member

    @Wally – Nice find. Pretty similar to what I do except I don't tape over the top of the valve and I use one layer of two different kinds of tape.

    I have heard that some people then put a rim strip over the top of the tape and the valve. Specifically the yellow plastic Michelin ones. These are very tight and I assume hold it all together nicely and protect the tape. Never found the need to do this though.

    Wally
    Full Member

    Might try that, I have a new set of the yellow plastic rim tape from Decathlon, both being french. I find the water proof rhino tape from Maplin works well.
    I used the video method to the letter and it works. The cheapest source schwalbe car tyre tubes I could find was odd sized ebay ones, the size not being a problem as you just need the valve.

    finnegan
    Free Member

    Yesterday morning was the last straw – we got our two bikes out for a ride and both had punctures, Mrs F's from a thorn, mine from a torn valve from the tyre turning on the rim (newish tyres, have rim strip etc, so no excuse really). Took the shine right off the ride.

    So, I'm looking for advice on which of my exisiting kit is going to work 'ghetto' tubeless. Except for the mud tyres (old Panaracer Spikes, and I've *never* had a puncture with them) we're a Kenda family, Nevegals and Blue Grooves. I read in another post on here that they'll be OK tubeless, which is nice – anyone care to second that?

    Mrs F's bike has On One Reetard rims – they've been great rims, but don't look likely to work tubeless because I can see through the weld on both rims – anyone had success making Reetards work tubeless?

    My bike has 717s, and the only place I can see through them is where I'm supposed to, spoke holes and valve – OK for tubeless?

    Thanks for your wisdom,

    daim
    Full Member

    we're a Kenda family, Nevegals and Blue Grooves. I read in another post on here that they'll be OK tubeless, which is nice – anyone care to second that?

    Never tried them but have also read that they work well ghetto.

    Mrs F's bike has On One Reetard rims – they've been great rims, but don't look likely to work tubeless because I can see through the weld on both rims

    Sounds like you will struggle if the weld is not sealed. You could try sealing it with some epoxy or something. Dunno really.

    My bike has 717s, and the only place I can see through them is where I'm supposed to, spoke holes and valve – OK for tubeless?

    I don't see why not. There is a thread here where someone posted saying they had issues with a 717 tubeless and then subsequent replies saying that they have been fine: http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/my-first-ghetto-tubeless-ride-not-good

    Best thing I can say is give it a go. It's not really all that expensive to give it a try. You can dip your toe in the water by just doing one wheel first and take a tube with you. Any isues, just pop the tube in and inflate.

    Most of the issues I have seen with ghetto tubeless are down to people either using tyres that are known to not work well or when they try to run at ridiculously low pressures. One thing I have found with tubeless is that you don't need to run your tyres at such low pressures as they are more compliant anyway when there is no tube present.

    Good luck!

    devs
    Free Member

    Mrs F's bike has On One Reetard rims – they've been great rims, but don't look likely to work tubeless because I can see through the weld on both rims – anyone had success making Reetards work tubeless?

    If you use the bmx tube method there will be no problem.

    rich-6
    Free Member

    I tried this method last night and my tyre went out with a bang 😆 It sealed up nicely with the smallest hole around the valveso i took the tyre off and added a bit more tape, It worked 😀 So i blew it up a bit more and the valve gave way, BOOm tyre came off the rim and i was deaf for a few mins 😆

    Worked though just me and my pressures 😀

Viewing 29 posts - 1 through 29 (of 29 total)

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