Hi everyone. As a few of you may have noticed, I was out digging in the Pentland Hills last Saturday, and pulled my lower back. It eased a wee bit through the day, though the pain remained throughout. Following good advice from teh interwebs (i.e. medical websites) I attempted to keep active with out hauling heavy boxes about. All was going well till Wednesday evening and it seems to be going backwards a wee bit – the pain was almost gone, but has returned, and I twisted today making it even worse.

So anyway, I bought some diclofenac today, taken the recommended dose and the pain is still there. I think I should see a chiropracter to get me twisted back to shape. I’ve had this before (but much worse) and had one session and it was fine after for a few years. SO yeah, that, but in Edinburgh? What kind of prices do people charge?

My wife was seeing a chiropractor for a while but her doctor warned her off them – he recommended sports physio instead as they will look at the root cause and not just the problem. She goes to the one in Currie – Edinburgh Sports Injury Clinic or something. It is definitely working as she’s not having the problems that didn’t get fixed by the chiropractor.

http://www.quackwatch.com/

See a proper Doctor! 😆

For physio…FASIC.

I use a osteopath based at http://www.somauk.com/ I don’t like chiropractors. I have also used a sport massage therapist http://www.sports-clinic.co.uk/

Hey

I think I spoke to you on Saturday about the problems I had with my back, I see an osteopath not cheap but very good, however the main thing you need to do is strengthen your lower back with exercises.

The problem is that the vertebrae will be sitting too close together and this causes that area to be compacted. When you build up the right muscles it will shift the weight from the vertebrae to the muscles, freeing up space.

Feel free to email me and I can give you more info about what I do, which is a combination of yoga, the alexander technique and the exercises from the osteopaths.

Also although it might look a bit daft you really should warm up before doing digging and other outdoors work, especially digging as you bend over and pull at the same time, this puts a lot of strain on your lower back muscles.

I saw someone from Active-x osteopaths when I pulled my back a few years ago. Sorted it out in 2 visits.

More recently I saw a sports physio from Physis in Trinity to sort out a shoulder problem that had come on gradually and had stopped me biking. They were very good too, a variety of massage, strapping and specific exercises sorted it out quickly.

A chiropracter thread and no mention of Simon Singh yet

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Singh

Well, on balance I’ve had brilliant results at Knight Chiropractors in Musselburgh….and conversely have found FASIC pish…have heard great things about Space sports physio at Dalry and one on Henderson Row I cant remember the name of…

My wife was seeing a chiropractor for a while but her doctor warned her off them

Aye, Cos GP’s are brilliant at dealing with back problems “How long do you want signed off work for Mr X ? and here’s a script for Diclofenac/Tramadol..” or “we’ll put you on the waiting list for NHS physio which normally takes about roughly the same time as your back does to sort itself out and when you do see them, they’re that overstretched/understaffed you’ll just get a badly photocopied sheet of stretches you probably could’ve printed off the internet yourself…”

Good Luck MrKMkII…

i am happy to provide you with a broad spectrum placebo at a reasonable cost. Obviously I have no actual scientific evidence that it works whatsoever but i will make outlandish claims for it if that reassures you .

Traditional chiropractic assumes that a vertebral subluxation interferes with the body’s innate intelligence,[5] a vitalistic notion ridiculed by the scientific and healthcare communities.[6] A large number of chiropractors want to separate themselves from the traditional vitalistic concept of innate intelligence.[7]

D.D. Palmer founded chiropractic in the 1890s, and his son B.J. Palmer helped to expand it in the early 20th century.[8] It has two main groups: “straights”, now the minority, emphasize vitalism, innate intelligence and spinal adjustments, and consider vertebral subluxations to be the cause of all disease; “mixers”, the majority, are more open to mainstream views and conventional medical techniques, such as exercise, massage, and ice therapy.[7]

If this fails have you considered scientology or faith healing?
i can do your chakras by e-mail 😀

I’m seeing Dr Stuart Cooper at Capital Chiropractic on Frederick Street.
I had a few problems earlier this year. He diagnosed & sorted me right out.
A really nice guy & very talented.

Used Taylors a couple years ago, one off as I stay in Derby but was impressed

Not a medical doctor though is he

It was here at the college where he began to understand the importance of a healthy functioning nervous system and how you cannot reach optimal health unless you’re nervous system is free of any interference.
http://www.capitalchiropractic.co.uk/about/capital-chiropractic-team/
Bet I can get your chi flowing for cheaper

Ok have your thread back I think I have made my point

No he’s not a medical Dr

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2006/apr/22/badscience.uknews

The General Chiropractic Council’s code of practice says: “Chiropractors who use the title of ‘doctor’ and who are not registered medical practitioners must ensure that they make it clear that they are registered chiropractors and not registered medical practitioners.” And the word chiropractor does not appear in this authoritative 2,000 word promotion for Dr Robin Pauc’s new book and cure for attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.

But is it so bad? By law, unlike “protected titles” such as nurse or physiotherapist, anyone can call themselves a doctor or a neurologist. Amusingly, on the other hand, you cannot call yourself a chiropractor, as Dr Robin Pauc can, because that is a protected term.

woah, i thought that was simple request! surprised at all this chiropractor hating. My experience did not reflect any of this hippy stuff some of you are mentioning. I lay on my front and he grabbed two opposing limbs, and pulled until my back clicked and that was the pain gone. he then then gave me a massage and i was back working the next day, hauling lorry tyres about without any stress. is it possible i actually saw an osteopath?! i’m sure it was a chiropractor though…

i hear what you’re saying about physios, my worry there being that i have to make loads of visits, which I can ill afford. i got a bad back a couple of years ago and was prescribed diclofenac and i was free of the pain within a week. i wouldn’t say i have terminal problems with my back, i just want a one-off fix!

The “treatment” of Chronic conditions is the most profitable area for snake oil salesmen…their patients will never get better, and so will continue to buy treatment, if their symptoms alleviate for a while they will attribute it to the treatment, and so will buy more of it when the condition returns.

just like doctors though, right? that’s why i’ve been prescribed an antihistamine for years and can’t function without it?

Does mrs glupton work in ed – spent alot of money on sports physio and sports massage for an ongoing achillies problem

She was the first to look t root cause rther than alieviating my symptoms

Tight achillies due to hamstrings and lower back pulling them tight.

Everyone had me stretching my achillies and the like. Repeat adnausem for 6 months . 2 weeks after seeing mrs glupton i was back on my bike training for a 24 and able to walk when i got off it !. Lots of foam roller , , back and hamstring stretching that i still do now !

just like doctors though, right?

Do you pay to see your GP though?

No. But my taxes pay for the repeat perscription, ad infinitum. if i stop, I conclude it was the medication, and they start getting lots of money again as I go back on it.

fair enough, what’s the antihistamine for?

You’re right any chronic condition will necessitate repeat visits and probably never be cured but I also think there are different ways to approach it. I think a physio is a good approach for identifying the underlying issues and resolving/alleviating those (i had similar prob as trail rat) whereas i see chiropractor as alleviating symptoms without tackling the underlying issue.

I guess you could argue both have similar outcomes but I’d prefer the physio as I can take exercises etc away with me and work on the problem. Seems more rehabilitative in my mind but it’s only my opinion at the end of the day. If you prefer the chiropractor then go for it.

ok, thanks for that Fontmoss. I guess the point i just wanted to make was that my chiropractic experience was not one that saw me going back time and time again, shedding money. i’ve been once when I was 17 – 17 years ago! at this rate i’ll go another 3 times in my life 😉 But i see the point re: physio. I’ve been to FASIC and also an NHS one, and while it helped with the symptons i had, it wasn’t without its longish term commitment to it. FASIC cost me over £200 to get my IT band sorted, along with a set of prescription orthotics and all the sessions related to that. If they charge me that kind of money for my back I won’t have enough for bills and rent, it’s that simple.

oh, and the antihistamine is for a runny nose – one that means I can’t sleep. I’ve asked to be checked to find the cause but the old procedure – stamping one’s arm with several potential allergens – is no longer used since someone died after having it…

just like doctors though, right

yes a doctors account of your illness and the peer review double blind validated treatments they prescribe are exactly like the clinically unproven chiropractory in every way.
Can I interest in you having your aura cured after all this would be just like visiting your GP as I wont cure you either?

Medicine cannot cure everything but that does not mean a chiropactor can [ or cannot for that matter] cure you.

Junkyard – i never meant to suggest they could! Just don’t ever conflate a peer review process with an a-profitable, moral just, unbiased process that is only ever for the common good. As others have pointed out, the frontline medicinal approach to back pain is simply strong pain killers. If that isn’t isn’t a snake oil cure then I don’t know what is!

Can someone describe the difference between a chiropractor and an osteopath? because every time someone mentions chakra and auras and other hippy nonsense I start to wonder whether it wasn’t actually a chiropractor that I saw! certainly my experience was not like that in any way at all. I’m frankly quite beguiled right now!

This is worth reading,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiropractic

A chiropracter thread and no mention of Simon Singh yet

You beat me to it. It’s an outrage!

Flippin’ eck, I only wanted a cheap and effective way to sort my back! It strikes me as odd that all this hippy stuff comes through, yet in my experience, what I got was a treatment that alleviated some physical pain. I wasn’t asked to think away the pain, or repeat a mantra, or treat something unrelated, or any of the stuff that I’m being told is the essence of chiropractic. Going off that wiki page, I’d suggest that I saw a ‘mixer’, who adhered to a more materialist approach (which, according to that table on wikipedia, lends itself to scientific inquiry).

Anyway. Who knows a reasonably priced practioner of back pain alleviation based in Edinburgh? 😉

MrK, patch testing is still used in Dermatology but it sounds like an ENT referral might be more useful?

EDIT: desensitisation injections for allergic rhinitis have stopped due to anaphylaxis though

I’m guessing if I started wearing a kidney belt I’d get even more criticism, eh? 😮 🙂

For me it worked great.
I injured my back doing Jiu Jitsu.
I felt a couple of vertebrae were out of place, I couldn’t lie on my back on the floor.
My chiro popped it back in.
Result for me- no pain, full strength & mobility.
I also feel more energetic, I’m sleeping well & my wife says I don’t snore anymore.
So I’m happy.
As for seeing a GP, good luck with that.
Osteopath & massage therapists are great to.
Physios are the biggest waste of money on the NHS – going through the tick box motions & as said, handing out badly photocopied sheets of stretches & excersizes.
Whatever gets a positive result though I suppose.

I’d recommend Judy at the Edinburgh Sports Injury Clinic in Currie – about £35 for 30mins – but after suffering for years with lower back problems she can normally sort you out in a couple of sessions.

As for the badly photocopied sheets from physios – I was recommended 2 things to maintain my back in decent shape – 1: lie on a rolled up bath towel down the length of your spine for as long as you can take it – this opens out your upper back and 2: the Makaho core exercises which are a series of stretches to help loosen your lower back and allow it to re-engage your core muscles.

thanks everyone, for your responses. Sorry I got a wee bit carried away earlier! Edinburgh Sports Injury Clinic in Currie sounds ok (as there’s more than one recommendation above) but I can’t find a website. Anyone have any details?

I thought I was all fine, but it’s kinda come back again today, while twisting slightly. I’ve been pretty active this week, with two longish (for me) bike rides and a 2.5 hour gym session. I also saw a doctor on Monday, and to be honest, I’m not sure what use it was. I did find one of the stretches she shown me was quite painful on my hip which I thought might be a throw-back to my old IT band problems. So i think I might see a physio…

http://www.edinburghsportsinjuryclinic.co.uk/

MrK,

I was just browsing and came across this thread. Most interesting to see how the thread developed. Being a chiropractor myself and the director of two health centres in Scotland, I felt compelled to comment. It seems that there has been a bad case of bias- to the point of uninformed prejudice- infiltrating this thread.

Your question was quite a fair one, looking for some help with a bad back. I understand your desire to avoid the doctor’s or the chiropractor’s office by taking advice off the internet. Many people do the same thing; the only problem is that each back pain case is unique, and unless you’ve had a professional examination, you may actually be doing more harm than good by attempting exercises or other generic recommendations. So I’m not surprised that your pain initially returned. In some cases, back pain may actually be caused by something more sinister and it’s best to know before jumping into any treatment.

You were also quite right about suggesting that pain killers are not the best approach for back pain. There is no research that analgesics can treat the cause of back pain- it only helps you to ignore it. In fact analgesics and anti-inflammatory medication have negative effects on the body’s chemistry and in some cases can cause more harm than good.

Yes, seeing a chiropractor or an osteopath is a good idea, if only for a thorough examination and recommendations. If treatment is required, it is likely to be gentle, conservative, and work with your body’s own ability to heal, rather than just ignoring the pain with pills or taking a more dangerous surgical route which of course wouldn’t be recommended except in the most serious cases, and even then with caution.

But where I get a little concerned is the comment that someone’s GP “warned them off a chiropractor.” Firstly, this is highly unprofessional of the GP, and this action in itself has the potential to instigate an investigation through the GMC. No registered health professional may undermine the treatment of another professional, or especially an entire profession! Chiropractic is a regulated profession (which means it has to abide to very strict rules and regulations), it is proven to be extremely safe (much safer than medical alternatives, the statistics prove it) and highly utilised. In other words, people vote with their feet, and every year millions of people see a chiropractor, happily, and return again in the future when needed, even when they have to pay for it out of their pocket. So, if your GP says something like that, they are in fact acting unprofessionally- if not uninformed- and I would definitely ask for a second opinion.

Next, the comment that “I don’t like chiropractors”- this is a fair point. However it is actually likely to be biased against the specific chiropractor that you have seen, rather than an entire profession. In fact, every practitioner has a unique approach, and yes there are bad eggs in every lot- including chiropractic, osteopathy, physiotherapy, medicine and dentistry. After years of clinical practice, I have seen it all, good and bad, in every profession. It’s about who you feel comfortable with, who you trust with your health. Do the research, see who is properly trained and experienced, and then check it out. But the difference between chiropractors and osteopaths in the UK is negligible, especially when talking about UK-trained chiros and UK-trained osteos. You can’t generalise.

Some people, like Junkyard, seem to be an expert in chiropractic, although it is highly doubtful if he has ever, in fact, visited a chiropractor. For you, Junkyard, you would do well to observe that many people, including others on this thread, have reported very positive results from seeing chiropractors, and have no idea what you’re on about. Maybe you should get along to a chiropractor yourself.

The chiropractic profession make no outlandish claims. It’s simply a safe and natural intervention to help with your spinal health. Millions of people say so. If anyone is interested in “outlandish claims”, the claims of medicine trump the lot. I see huge shop-front and bus-shelter advertisements including pictures of people in ambulances being rushed off to the hospital, apparently because they haven’t had their ‘flu shot (this year). Someone show me a single piece of evidence that having the ‘flu shot increases the strength of the immune system. And where is the research that medicine and surgery can cure back pain? If you read it, it’s more of a horror story than a success story; death and paralysis are major “side effects.” No thanks.

One more thing, Mr. Junkyard: the degree on my wall says “Doctor of Chiropractic”. That’s after eight years of full-time university and post-graduate study, national board exams, three years of clinical internship, and registration to a national regulatory body. Add to that fifteen years of clinical experience and continuing professional development, and you have a health care professional. The semantics of whether we call ourselves “Dr” or “Mr” are completely unimportant, but for the record, I and my colleagues have earned the legal right to our title.

MrK, I do apologise that your thread has been sabotaged by this conversation. I wish you very well, and I do hope that you received the treatment and advice that you were looking for.

Best wishes.

Funny how it’s only the quack doctors who have to join random forums and bump old threads to “set the story straight” isn’t it?

Did your training include all the vitalism and subluxation stuff? I’m presuming it did, given you’ve been so well trained…

Someone show me a single piece of evidence that having the ‘flu shot increases the strength of the immune system

It’s called vaccination. Edward Jenner in 1796.

Exposing the body to the vaccine prompts an immune response; that’s why chiropractors don’t have to treat people for smallpox.

The chiropractic profession make no outlandish claims. It’s simply a safe and natural intervention to help with your spinal health

Seriously? No, really SERIOUSLY?