Dogs - now I'm really annoyed « Singletrack Forum

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Dogs - now I'm really annoyed

65 posts & 48 voices | Started 3 years ago by onewheelgood | Latest reply from hora

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bites
dogs

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onewheelgood - Member

Out for a ride this morning, on a bridleway that passes through a farmyard. The dogs there usually bark but today...

...it just sank its slavering jaws into my calf. The farmer apologised and said the dog hadn't bitten anyone before, and asked me if I'd be alright. I said I'd go home and clean it up, but if it turned out that I wasn't OK then I'd be back. I've never been a dog fan but have grudgingly accepted that working dogs were justifiable - now I'm not so sure.

Can't get pics embedded from Picasa so look [url="http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/muni.pete/DogBite#"]here[/url] if you are interested

Posted 3 years ago #
MrNutt - Member

report it to the police now.

the next thing it bites could easily be a childs face.

My cousin was pinned down and her face was torn to bits by a family dog which "hadn't bitten anyone before". (a lab)

If its a working dog then the farmer will have to keep it under full control at all times or put it down.

Posted 3 years ago #
racing_ralph - Member

mr nutt do you work for the daily mail?

Posted 3 years ago #
andym - Member

mr nutt do you work for the daily mail?

He has a point though.

Posted 3 years ago #
Tracker1972 - Member

I was interested but I was already looking "here", got the Picassa link?

Posted 3 years ago #
racing_ralph - Member

What would you do if a cow charged you? Ram knocked you off?

Posted 3 years ago #
onewheelgood - Member

Oops - linky

Posted 3 years ago #
petetheplumber - Member

MrNutt is totally right, I have a dog he is fine with the kids and everyone. But the day he bites anyone will be the day he goes to sleep. Report it

Posted 3 years ago #
anagallis_arvensis - Member

I have to say that looks bloody sore, my first intinct wold be to go and talk to the farmer before the police, but then I hate the police.

Posted 3 years ago #
BoardinBob - Member

Aye, fellow dog owner here, but that needs to be reported. There's no excuse for a dog biting anyone unless it's acting in self defence, which it wasn't.

Posted 3 years ago #
Offroading - Member

Put all of them down - damn things.

Posted 3 years ago #
IWH - Member

Not good. You up to date with your tetanus shots?

I'd go have a quiet word with the Farmer. I've heard the 'never bitten anyone before' line too many times (and have a scar where one ripped through my nose to show for it) and there's no getting away from the fact he's got a dangerous dog and has to do something about it.

My only concern would be hat he'd do to the dog so it may be worth notifying the Police anyway.

Posted 3 years ago #
TandemJeremy - Member

Ask the farmer what he is going to do about it and then decide. If he says the dog will be chained up or otherwise controlled perhaps it might be OK.
I am willing to give farmers and working dogs a bit more leeway than for pets.

Posted 3 years ago #
RudeBoy - Blocked

I don't think MrNutt is being 'Daily Mail' at all. He's speaking of experience, which mustuv been horrible. That poor child.

I'm assuming the bridleway is a Public Right Of Way? Therefore the farmer simply has to ensure that the dog is kept under control at all times.

It's your obligation to report it, really, as the dog could potentially attack someone else. If the dog needs to be put down, it's a shame, but there's a good reason for such laws; to protect people from dangerous dogs.

Farm dogs often seem to be a lot more aggressive than pet dogs; they are guard dogs, and need to be. Therefore, they should be under control anyway. Can't have a dog like that out amongst people.

Posted 3 years ago #
glenp - Member

I love dogs, including my own. But - number one golden absolute rule of having a dog is taking responsibility for its behaviour. Biting people is not acceptable under any circumstances. I'd be telling the farmer that if I ever saw it out of control again I would be reporting it to the police. "Never bitten anyone before" is total bs too.

Posted 3 years ago #
onewheelgood - Member

@TJ he said he would keep it tied up - I guess I'll see next time I'm riding that route.

Trouble is, it's the best Mayhem training ride around here, and I really don't want to stop using it.

Wound-wise, I've cleaned it up and given it a good splash of TCP, and I think my tetanus is up to date. It's not much worse than some of the damage I get from the carnivorous brambles around here.

Posted 3 years ago #
MrNutt - Member

No I don't read the daily mail, but I did see the following:

a very pretty little seven year old girl with a very normal life ahead of her.
the result of what happens when a dog pins said little girl down and tears her "mask" off.
the disbelief and anguish that the poor little mite had to endure at the time.
the true horror at what had happened to her when the dressings were removed
the resultant difficulties that she had to deal with everyday when going to school, children can be very cruel.
the years of extensive plastic surgery required to rebuild her face and fix the major scarring.
the strength of character that she has shown and the fact that she's turned out a well rounded and pretty adult. (much credit deserved all around, her, the surgeons, her mother, etc)

so no, I'm not a fan of knee jerk reactions, just common sense.

The dog has bitten. It is NOT an acceptable risk.

As I said, if it is a working dog then the farmer should be allowed to keep it but conditions should be imposed that it is kept under control at all times.

otherwise it should be shot. end of.

Posted 3 years ago #
Moda - Member

Sympathise got surrounded by 5 collies off their leads on a bridleway dogs surrounded me and then backed ioff then came back growling. I stopped they encircled me one decided to bite me shoe and then my calf. Woman in charge said my dogs never bite so enraged with her denial that i forgot to pull up my tights and show her the wound. Gave her some verbal and then reported it to the police. Was told that collies do nip but even thats not acceptable. How can anyone control 5 dogs off a lead....

Posted 3 years ago #
househusband - Member

Agree with TJ's, and others, sentiments that working dogs should be given some latitude, but I'd still report the matter to the police - you never know; this may not be the first time this has happened.

Posted 3 years ago #
smell_it - Member

Yes, I'd much rather be attacked by a working dog

Posted 3 years ago #
Dorset_Knob - Member

I am willing to give farmers and working dogs a bit more leeway than for pets.

That's cobblers. I bet the farmer would be quick enough to destroy the dog if it started attacking his sheep.

Farmer's choices: remove aggression; remove dog from public; remove dog.

Report to police, I'd say.

Posted 3 years ago #
lodious - Member

There is nothing 'Daily Mail' about it, a dog bite is unacceptable, regardless if the dog is working or taking time off between jobs. Those bites look nasty, if it were me, i'd report it.

Is the owner really going to say, 'goodness, this happens all the time, i'll do something about it'? No, he's going to say it's the first time it's happened, everytime it happens.

Posted 3 years ago #
mrmojo - Member

Needs to be reported mate that's a nasty bite not like it just "nipped" you.You could have had your son or daughter out with you and a bite like that on a kid could be serious.
I had a farmers dog attack me few weeks back it somehow got hold the strap on my shimano boot near ripped it off. I went to speak to the farmer who said the dog "aint used to people on bikes up here" WTF !!

Posted 3 years ago #
Dorset_Knob - Member

5 collies off lead

I'm a collie fan, and even I find that frightening.

And they do nip - they're small animals bred for herding much larger ones - but it's up to owners to train it out of them. It's one of the reasons collies make such difficult pets.

I'm starting to believe in the collie breeders' mantra: no sheep, no collie.

Posted 3 years ago #
Dorset_Knob - Member

"aint used to people on bikes up here"

Well, that I can understand. Tricky compromise. I think there's potential for a good magazine article here: MTBers meet expert dog handlers.

One: what to do when you meet a nervous/spooked/aggressive dog. Two: how to train your dog for polite and safe trail-hound usage.

Posted 3 years ago #
aracer - Member

Farm dogs often seem to be a lot more aggressive than pet dogs; they are guard dogs, and need to be.

Rubbish, and rubbish. Why does a farmer need guard dogs? I've always understood that working dogs on farms are herding dogs, for which the last thing you want is an aggressive dog.

Posted 3 years ago #
pantsonfire - Member

Just looked at the pics OWWWWCH

Get yourself down the doctors tommorow and get yourself a tetanus booster you dont know what the dogs been eating or licking.

Posted 3 years ago #
Dorset_Knob - Member

I've always understood that working dogs on farms are herding dogs, for which the last thing you want is an aggressive dog

Trouble is, most of the herding breeds also come with strong guarding instincts. Anything that moves that isn't their owner is a potential wolf out to get the sheep, as far as their DNA tells them.

That behaviour's mostly redundant now (since we got no wolves), and they're just used for herding. But farmers mostly don't bother training the guarding behaviour out.

Which is why I'd never get a(nother) collie from a working line.

Posted 3 years ago #
RudeBoy - Blocked

Why does a farmer need guard dogs?

To ward off foxes, and to protect the farm. Do you know how much some farm equipment costs? There's a thriving black market in stolen farm stuff, and even livestock and horses.

Posted 3 years ago #
trailbreak-martin - Member

I've been trying to look up the official line on a farmers responsibilies with regards to where RoW cross through a yard where he keeps his dogs.

I've found a lot more info about bulls though, but did find this on the Leicestershire CC site

Also, an offence may be committed if an animal deters use of a route or injures a member of the public whilst using a public right of way.

So I reckon you'd be justified in reporting it. However, it sounds like the farmer has been reasonable in his reaction; he's apologised, asked if you'd be OK and offered to keep the dog tied up. It may even be true that it's never bitten anyone before!

Provided your injury gets no worse and heals properly ,give him the chance to do the decent thing. He wouldn't just be losing a pet; buying and training a new dog will have fairly serious implications for him. Have a civil word with him, and ask him to keep his promise and hopefully, he gets a view of bikers as reasonable people and your incident today becomes the lucky escape that makes that track safer to use in the future for you and that hypothetical 7 year old girl.

Posted 3 years ago #
coffeeking - Member

IS there any evidence to show that a dog that's bitten once will be more likely to bite again? What if the dog is punished/disciplined on the spot. Not really a dog fan but I dislike the idea of putting a dog down based on the fact that it MAY bite again at some point in the future - might as well put them all down now bcause all dogs MAY bite. If its not a retaliatory response (i.e. killing it for biting you) then the logic of killing it in case it does it again seems a little tenuous?

Posted 3 years ago #
GNARGNAR - Member

I'd imagine if the farmer sniffs any legal hassle on the horizon he'll be giving the dog the old Kurt Cobain nasal floss quick sharp.

Posted 3 years ago #
Dorset_Knob - Member

IS there any evidence to show that a dog that's bitten once will be more likely to bite again?

Yes.

What if the dog is punished/disciplined on the spot.

There is a school of thought that says the dog is more likely to bite again - punishment increases the fear response.

Depends on the circumstances and the dog: behaviour is no more black and white in dogs than in humans.

Posted 3 years ago #
lodious - Member

Surely it's not a question of if the dog is more likely to bite again, Unless the dog is LESS likely to bite again (which I think is very unlikely), surely it should be put down?

I don't mind dogs, but if an owner can't excercise sufficient control over the dog, I think the owner should be punished, and the dog put down.

We have had a large dog run full on at our daughter (age 4 at the time) and even though the dog did not attack her, she was terrified. It's antisocial and irresponsible behaviour on the part of the dog owner.

Posted 3 years ago #
tinribz - Member

To ward off foxes, and to protect the farm. Do you know how much some farm equipment costs? There's a thriving black market in stolen farm stuff, and even livestock and horses.

Foxes, lol that's what fences are for. As for guard dogs you don't use your sheep dog for that you use a pair of Alsations that you lock up during the day and let out in to a fenced compound during the night. The collies will be getting their zzzs.

Farm dogs are wilder and collies especially because of the herding instinct, territorial goes with that. If there's a bridleway they ought to be chained end of.

Before putting the world to rights though I'd be more concerned about getting some injections quick, dogs mouth's are not nice places.

Posted 3 years ago #