Hi, Im new here. Long time lurker so I know you guys know your stuff. So….Something about this frame that just doesnt look right. Could it be a fake?
Item No 320736091451

looks nice and shiny

do you want to buy it???

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/320736091451?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.co.uk%3A80%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dp5197.m570.l1313%26_nkw%3D320736091451%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1#ht_500wt_950

Apart from the saddle being so far back it looks okay. Pretty old LX components (octalink etc)

suppose it could be a Rockhopper thats been resprayed. I have no idea about specialized frames other than the one the missus has.

I have always fancied one of these M5 alloy frames but this one just doesnt look right, especially the drop-outs and decals.
Just needed a few opinions before bidding.

Defo not a stumpy m5.
http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/SBCProduct.jsp?arc=2006&spid=21816

It looks like a Maxlight of some sort.

Looks like a Hardrock thats been painted.

I googled images too and it just doesnt look right. Think It may be best to stay well away then. Shame as it looks like its in great cond for its vintage. Strange mix of parts though.

yeah, its deffo not an M5, check out the v-brake mounts!

looks like a handsome dog or one of the many unbranded but identical frames you can pick up for £50. Great bikes for the buck but it’s no M5, that’s for sure..

Check out this picture on retro bike. The drop outs and down tube just don’t look S Works on the fleabay special.
retro bike M5
Get a photo of the frame number and ring up Specialized if you are that keen, but the price and spec don’t shout out bargain to me.

http://www.thaimtb.com/cgi-bin/viewkatoo.pl?id=152710%5D
Here’s some nice new shiny ones, but they maybe ok for £50

just compared it to some old pics of mine it would appear at first glance to be a 2005 vintage, however:

1. logos in the wrong place
2. dropouts wrong
3. mech hanger wrong
4. seat post wrong size (although there does appear to be a shim in there

Not an s-works.

Why would you build such a high end frame with cheap forks, EA30 bars etc?

It’s not a Spesh full stop – the mech hanger and the dropouts are totally wrong, let alone the decals. The alu frames have never even been close to £2000 either – they’re having you on. It may be a decent bike, but as they’re lying about what it is and how much it is I’d avoid.

going by B.A.Nana pic theres a lot of this non speshes knocking around 😕

Yep, thought so and you guys have confirmed.
Great photo B.A.Nana. those ones are identical, same stickers, drop-outs etc. So are they out-and-out rip-offs then?

I will get my barge pole out.

Should I message the seller and let him know?

From a quick Interweb Photo Browsing it looks like a sticker kit job, the TT “Specialized Sticker should be mounted in a slightly different Position I think.
Plus it’s an odd mix of parts for a “Nice Frame”, and He’s refers to the forks as “Rebras” suggesting He’s got no clue about it really.
I never trust anyone who feels the need to add the cost of certain parts to the listing but Glosses over the Shonky old Cranks and other stuff…

It looks like seller has acquired a Rockhopper frame, re-stickered it and raided the Spares box, that said I’m no Speccy Expert and He/She has not stated a year model so you never know… but looks like a Lemon to me.

Going by what he/she says in their ad,”I’m spending too much time working abroad”, my guess would be they spend too much time working abroad in China, Hong Kong and/or Thailand. I’m sure the ebay seller wasn’t stupid when they bought that Specialized M5 S-works frame brand new for £50 in a back street Thai bike shop. I’d say they probably know full well what it is (or isn’t), now they’re just trying it on, just send them a link to this thread.

Hijack of sorts….

A chap from our club who works for a Spesh dealer has had the following sent to him:

Notice Regarding Counterfeit Tarmac Framesets

Specialized has learned of counterfeit S Works Tarmac framesets being sold from several online marketplaces like eBay, Craigslist, and other regional online sources.

These counterfeit frames and forks are not safe, should not be ridden and are not under warranty.

2008 S Works Tarmac SL, size 52 & 54cm in Red and Blue colors.
2007 S Works Tarmac SL, size 52 & 54cm in Red and Blue colors.
Genuine Specialized framesets are carefully designed, engineered and tested to meet stringent internal and international standards. Most importantly, Specialized products may be purchased only through Authorized Specialized Retailers and NOT via the internet.

We have observed fake framesets with the following incorrect characteristics:

No serial numbers on frame and/or fork
Fork serial number under crown (Near Tire)
Fork serial number starting with K85Lxxxx
Headset carbon cone with FSA logo
This list is NOT conclusive….there are other indicators of counterfeit composite frames and forks.

These framesets may or may not include a counterfeit S Works Pave Seatpost. The counterfeit seatpost is not safe, should not be ridden and is not under warranty. If you have any question regarding the authenticity of a Specialized product, please contact Specialized Customer Service at (877) 808-8154 or email Customer Service

Stickers look wrong.. Can’t put my finger on it but deffo a wrong un.
£2k new? No chance.

Blimey, I have learnt something here. I never knew there was an industry out there making fake bike parts. Trainers and Watches yes but bike frames.!

Someone could get seriously hurt here and wouldnt have a leg to stand on (so to speak).

Makes you wonder how many ‘better’ copies slip through without anybody cottoning-on.

I suppose there is money to be made and thats all some people care about.
I hope Specialized are doing their bit on this sort of thing, just with a few messages and a bit of collective knowkledge we have sussed it out. Manufacturers should have people dedicated to just this srort of thing.

Im going to send the seller a message, you never know he may be totally unaware.
I will post the reply if I get one.

Stickers look wrong.. Can’t put my finger on it but deffo a wrong un.

It’s totally the wrong font for a start!

It looks like seller has acquired a Rockhopper frame, re-stickered it and raided the Spares box, that said I’m no Speccy Expert and He/She has not stated a year model so you never know… but looks like a Lemon to me.

Nope, it’s not a Specialized at all, definitely one of those cheapy alu frames. May be decent, but like I say, the seller is passing it off as something it’s not (and I’d be stunned if he thinks he’s got a pukka S-Works there), so that alone is enough to make me not want to give him my money.

Never trust someone who puts a stem that long on a bike…..

😀

it’s not about making fake bikes, it’s more about re-stickering cheap tat as more expensive stuff, you can regularly find stuff on ebay that had it done.
This has been knocking about on ebay for ages, & eventually sold it, though at least he did at least eventually added that he’d been informed it was a Marin (B17 from around ’99) rather than the C’dale prophet he’d bought it as(?)

maybe we should go the way of the Italians and burn counterfeits and their sellers!

Actually, if he is willing to ship to Italy then he could be in trouble 😀

Blimey, I have learnt something here. I never knew there was an industry out there making fake bike parts. Trainers and Watches yes but bike frames.!

Search for ‘Chinarello’ – the common name for cheap Taiwense Pinarello copies, some of them are amazing:

£300 for a frame, not £3500! Sadly there’s also stories of pretty horrific steerer tube failures and what not. I was really tempted by one 🙁

I’ve seen stories of fake Specialized S-Works hardtails going around for three years or so. It’s definitely not the genuine article. There are a lot of lookalike frames being produced in the far east.

On a slightly different tack, does anyone know what happened to the Ebay seller who had a 2003 Marin full suss for sale which had been repainted with Intense decals recently?

There was a fake ebay Yeti posted up on here not so long ago. It was so not a Yeti its untrue.

Little update:
I sent a message to the seller
He’s saying he bought the bike complete as it is from Evans in 2005.

He didn’t, he’s lying, categorically. Avoid.

2005 S-Works hardtails had the ‘ORE downtube’ with a marked kink at Nthe top, those dropouts are not off a Spesh. They were also polished or ano black, and were only sold as a frame combined with a Fox fork. No S-Works has ever had a Reba, in fact the 2003s which had a SID World Cup are the only ones ever to have been specced with an RS fork.

It’s also got a Phenom saddle, which was introduced in 2008 and a similar vintage Reba.

Looks like a Hardrock thats been painted.

What he said ^

PJM1974
On a slightly different tack, does anyone know what happened to the Ebay seller who had a 2003 Marin full suss for sale which had been repainted with Intense decals recently?

This thread prompted me to search it out, it sold (for £255, so luckily the buy wasn’t too ripped off) even after I reported it for “mis advertising”, which ebay obviously ignored…

I’ve seen worse

http://specialized.com/us/en/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?arc=2007&spid=22236&menuItemId=0

A real one, loads of things different, cable routing, dropouts, decals etc etc.

To be fair, that’s a 2007 one, they changed to the wishbone stays in 2006, prior to that they had conventional ‘a’ seatstays and downtube cable routing, so that part is right on this frame.

Again though, it’s not a Spesh, not a repainted Hardrock, not anything. Not speculating, it isn’t. He did not buy it from Evans in 2005, he did not buy it in 2005, and certainly not from Evans.

The most regular occurances on Pinkbike seem to be Silver Fox suspension bikes with orange decals as above, or, forks with the wrong stickers on.

Mostly seems to be brand obsessed kids.

Anyone else sent a message to the seller?

These people come over all innocent but someone will get at the very least stitched-up.
At the worst after reading oldgits post they could get seriously hurt.

Should I report it to Ebay, is it worth it? Will they do anything?

Looking a little closer is the Fork even a Reba?

Yeah it does look like a pukka Reba.

I seriously doubt it’d be dangerous, and to be honest if he was marketing it as a fake S-Works it’d probably be worth a punt, but it’s the fact he’s trying to pass it off as something it really isn’t, I wonder what else he’s covering up.

I like that Orange 5, it looks better than the real thing!

There are loads of dodgy schemers on Ebay trying to offload fakey jake gear. Avoid!

Oh, and that saddle will snap at the rails too. 😆