davidtaylforth – Member
…People who drive manual cars are keeping the tru spirit of motoring alive.

Nah, they are just using a complicated procedure for controlling a tin box with an engine.

Probably use MSDOS2.1 on their computers too.

Had a DSG Golf for a while. Lovely car, well executed box (I’ll call i a clutch-less manual)…

But if I had another it would be a manual

Manual.
Auto’s are for women, & blokes who can’t manage. (one way or another)
Fact.

Always had a manual up to last car. Now have a large diesel auto estate car.

Kind of torn. 95% of the time stop/go is fantastic and if stuck in traffic jams it is soooo much better. However when driving spiritedly esp cross country even in BMW sport mode it just doesn’t feel right.

That niggle may be enough to see me back in a manual next time though!

All you hairy chested real men best make the most of your manuals then. In 20 years we’ll all be driving auto hybrids or electric cars with one gear.

coffeeking – Member

Its amazing that in the 21st century most drivers are still having to change gear using two bits of bent metal shoved through the floor of the car. In what other consumer product would we have accepted such lack of progress?

Bikes.
Motorbikes.
Taps
Bins

Pretty much hundreds of consumer products where the owner wants control over the item rather than the item deciding itself. I’m 100% sure that 95% of bike owners would hate to ride a CVT or auto type shifting bike.

OK change manually if you must but we’ve been able to change gears on our bikes with our fingertips for the last 20 year so why not our cars- except of course for a few DSGs with paddle shifters.?

Hate autos! They disconnect you from the driving experience and waste fuel.

The only time they have worked for me is when I was driving in and out and around central London in massive jams day in day out.

Always driven manual and never even considered an auto, but here in oz the majority of cars seem to be auto and I actually quite like it. Also much prefer driving with my wife when we have an auto car as there’s no clutch riding, high revs or dodgy gear changes. No roll-backs on hills and no stalling. Considering getting an auto car for her when we come back to the UK actually.

Don’t see how people say auto’s are not proper driving. Surely rally cars or F1 cars are auto?

Manual.

Much better control of the car, through corners or on any kind of hilly road, and much more interesting to drive. More options – lazy cruising early shifts up through the gearbox or hold the revs (as long as I like) for making better progress. The engine feels properly connected to the drive wheels.
A manual car with a modern ECU will trickle along quite nicely in traffic in 1st without any throttle so they’re not that much more of a chore unless you’re in full stop/start traffic.

I’ve on occasion driven a torque converter auto and owned a BMW SMG for about a year.
Didn’t like:
(TC) springy “broken elastic” disconnected feel between the accelerator and anyting actually happening
Poor / non existent engine braking
The fact that a tiny prod of the accelerator makes the revs go mental, long delay while TC catches up and eventually the car goes a little faster / maintains speed up a hill.
Having to sit with my foot on the brake at traffic lights.
(SMG) Jerky starting off. Jerky when going from forward to reverse modes. Occasional random large THUMP when shifting gear. Having to finesse the accelerator to get a gear change that was worse than what I could do with a conventional manual. Bewildering array of almost but-not-quite identical shifting modes/speeds.

so they’re not that much more of a chore unless you’re in full stop/start traffic

And of course, that never happens.. 🙂

I had forgotten about the elastic band connection between the wheels and the engine. That wiffly waffly noise it makes while it is deciding if its going to go faster or not 🙂

The non-existent engine braking varies in different torque converter autos. Some completely de-clutch, some leave you in top, some in a lower gear. It feels really weird at first but you can get used to it and it saves fuel I think because you can roll for ages.

6 speed auto in my diesel BMW.

It’s the older type with a torque converter, but a lock-up in each gear makes it near enough to a semi-manual box you can’t tell, but without any of the disadvantages that comes with that.

If you do buy one of the fancier autos, make sure you test drive it for low speed manoeuvring, as the ones I’ve driven don’t have any creep, and with no clutch your only choice is to give it a bit of welly and then jump straight on the brake. Bloody awful.

Having said that, the BMW one is not without its problems. Primarily, it’s because none of the fancy lock-ups work when the gearbox oil temp is below 30C, so it’s like a nasty, sluggish, 1980’s gearbox for the first mile when the engine’s cold. Not really noticable when the outside temp gets above 10C, but it takes quite a while to warm up when it’s say, -10. And the fuel economy stinks when it’s cold.

But that might be a BMW thing, because the fuel economy stinks anyway.

as the ones I’ve driven don’t have any creep

My DSG does, but only a little bit at first, then the computer decides to tickle the clutch but doesn’t do it very smoothly, so it’ll start to surge forward or backwards. Manoevring in a car park is a question of learning how to get on the brakes quickly enough to control it – can be done, but it’s an art.

No harder than learning how to use the clutch yourself mind. But also no easier.

I’d be interested to hear why, since its the combo I have!

Ok, Im at a t-junction trying to turn right. Its busy i’ve been sitting there a while. A gap appears thats small but safe provide I react promptly and then this happens:

1. press gas pedal in an attempt to move out, car creeps forward barely moving.
2. Give it more gas, car still barely moving other cars are approaching!
3. Give it lots of gas, car drops gear revs increase turbo kicks in and now we have wheelspin! The car ends up making a drama out of what should be a simnple manouver.

The 2.0tdi engine is ok, the DSG gearbox is ok but they combine horribley.

Yeah Horatio – that is the one downside of my DSG. Like I say there are supposedly ways round it but I’ve not been able to make them work.

Changing from a manual to an auto there will be a moment where you go for the clutch. If it turns out ok it is amusing to see the looks of ‘Why the emergency stop?’!

My Volvo is an auto. It kind of suits it as it’s got a shed load of power. Would I swap it for a manual? Hell yeah!

Not sure I agree it’s that much better in traffic, tend to use my left foot to brake in an auto and I find it gets more tired than normal sitting on the brake instead of the clutch.

horatio – Member
I’d be interested to hear why, since its the combo I have!
Ok, Im at a t-junction trying to turn right. Its busy i’ve been sitting there a while. A gap appears thats small but safe provide I react promptly and then this happens:

1. press gas pedal in an attempt to move out, car creeps forward barely moving.
2. Give it more gas, car still barely moving other cars are approaching!
3. Give it lots of gas, car drops gear revs increase turbo kicks in and now we have wheelspin! The car ends up making a drama out of what should be a simnple manouver.

The 2.0tdi engine is ok, the DSG gearbox is ok but they combine horribley.

I had a A3 TDi S-line with DSG as a courtesy car a while back and had exactly the same issue. It made pulling out a real chore – it just crawled out ad then lurched forward when the power came in, htne as soon as it had come it was gone…one of the reasons I don’t like diesel much, too short a powerband for me. guess you just adapt to it in the end

In traffic – auto, to save the clutch and left leg 🙂

everything else – manual

I like changing gear

one of the reasons I don’t like diesel much, too short a powerband for me. guess you just adapt to it in the end

That’s NOT a diesel thing, it’s the way they’ve set the DSG up on that particular car.

But let’s not get stuck into this again eh? Just use higher gears, that’s all you need to know.

Having to sit with my foot on the brake at traffic lights.

My merc auto has a neat feature. Just press the brake pedal a bit firmer as the car stops and it applies the parking brake. Leave in D and when the lights change press the accelerator to move off – simples.

Most of the time auto is fine but I did nearly bin it on the snow last winter on a slight downhill country road. I realised that if I touched the brake I would be in the hedge so I used the tiptronic to change down from 4 to 2 which still involved a fair bit of fish tailing but I managed to save it. Without tip I would have been in trouble.

tend to use my left foot to brake in an auto

Why would you do that?

Having to sit with my foot on the brake at traffic lights.

VW Auto-hold FTW.

I realised that if I touched the brake I would be in the hedge so I used the tiptronic to change down from 4 to 2

Can’t see why that would be better than using the brakes properly. Why brake two wheels instead of four?

Can’t see why that would be better than using the brakes properly. Why brake two wheels instead of four?

tbh in snow I disconnect the traction control and use the manual side of the auto gearbox, – the idea is you can still steer with the front, but slowdown with the rear 😕 it works

six speed manual in my car. driven plenty of autos, much prefer manual by miles.

Kev

My E class merc. had an auto box which was ok, all my Vw’s and BmW’s have had Manual which I prefer.

Manual here. I’ll happily put up with the boring clutchwork round town to enjoy the cross country stuff. Cars are already too civilised without them taking yet more control away from the driver.

I’d be interested to try a flappypaddle effort at some point.

Its amazing that in the 21st century most drivers are still having to change gear using two bits of bent metal

Ever looked at the front mech on your bike? The rear ain’t much better. For all the hubgears, and hammeredschits, derailleurs are still the best option most of the time.

tbh in snow I disconnect the traction control and use the manual side of the auto gearbox, – the idea is you can still steer with the front, but slowdown with the rear it works

If you say so 🙂

tend to use my left foot to brake in an auto

Why would you do that?

Why not? Not having a clutch frees up the left foot meaning it’s doing nothing. Means each foot has one job. Probably not much of an advantage but why have a lazy foot getting away with a free ride while the other has to work hard???

In response to the original post, it depends on your driving conditions.

From my experience:

Majority of UK driving suits an auto. Roads are flat and congested. Can’t enjoy driving so why bother with a manual. Zoom around in direct control of the perfect gear as much as you want you’ll soon be tucked up behind a slower moving vehicle.

Would consider a manual if majority of driving didn’t involve traffic and the roads were hilly purely for the engine braking.