Following on from my thread yesterday, I am not sure a heavily mud orientated tyre is the way ahead, given that I ride on a variety of surfaces as well as filthy mud/peat. Today I have had reccomendations for an all rounder of the Hans Dampf or the equivalent Conti (Mountain King I think, can’t recall 100%). I can’t really buy different tyres for different routes and all that jazz, nor be bothered to keep changing them week by week. So, are the Hans Dampf at or near the top of the class for an all rounder? Grip is way more important than speed.

I love ’em and run them all year round. Peaks weekly, Alps in summer and the odd winter trail centre. Best I’ve run yet, but not tried Maxxis for a few years.

HD is great for me, very grippy, very capable and rolls well enough.

Used to be a big fan, then Maxxis brought out the High Roller II. Much better grip in corners, IMO – the HD shoulders are a lot rounder and weren’t as confidence-inspiring for me as the HRII.

They can wear out quite quickly, too – depending on what you’re riding them on.

Minion DHF on front and back

I have had a HR2 on the front until it broke today (crash at NR, tyre now massively misshapen). I got the impression from yesterday’s threads that there were better tyres in the mud than HR2’s?

I really like Hans Dampfs except in mud where they clog up and stay clogged.

Minion DHF on front and back

I always thought the dhf looked like it would work on the back.

I run rons and ralphs for the speed and weight, a hans would be too heavy duty for me 80% of the time, and i don’t mind getting bogged down in mud now and then if u can’t skirt round or just use speed to plough through small patches of deep mud.

It depends how heavy you are and how fast you corner. In my experience as someone heavier than average (about 100 kg in kit) I found that they roll well for a large quite knobbly tyre but that the side knobs are totaly unsupported and fold under when cornering hard.My front one lasted about 3 rides untill all the side knobs were hanging off, my 75 kg mate loves his though! I now use a Specialized Butcher grid and the difference is amazing.

Found the HD extremely underwhelming. Near complete lack of edge bite when leant over, and though braking grip was ok, it wasn’t incredible. They’re pretty light for what they are, but then they’re also quite fragile. Several people I know have destroyed them very quickly, and I took mine off after only 8 rides, as from 4 rides in the side knobs were starting to tear off.

Maxxis Minion DHF on the front now, 2.3 on the HT and 2.5 3C on the FS… Can’t beat em! The new DHR2 is a pretty tasty rear tyre too…

FWIW I really can’t get on with HR2’s. Complete lack of grip until they’re leant right over. If you’re on the ragged edge all the time, then they’re ace, but if you’re not giving 10/10ths all the time they can cause some brown trouser moments I find!

It depends how heavy you are and how fast you corner. In my experience as someone heavier than average (about 100 kg in kit) I found that they roll well for a large quite knobbly tyre but that the side knobs are totaly unsupported and fold under when cornering hard.My front one lasted about 3 rides untill all the side knobs were hanging off, my 75 kg mate loves his though!

I’m closer to your mates weight than you, but my experience mirrors yours…

That said, I know some guys that are faster riders than I’ll ever be that ride HD’s and rate them!

It’s all personal preference… They just don’t work for me.

Had OEM HD on my Cannondale Jekyll. Felt like the hubs had seized they were that slow. Mate has some on his Turner Burner and it rolls so much better. Guess they’re different rubber/ compound/ version

Weight – quite a lot 🙂

Used to run HD F&R & loved them.

My most recent bike came with HD rear / MM (Magic Mary) front – felt perfect the 2 rides I had with them.

I didn’t like hans dampfs. Minion F and high roller or panaracer rampage on rear. Or anything on the rear.

Not terrible but not good enough to consider, imo. I use one on my rigid just because it’s big and not too slow, but I wouldn’t have them on the proper bike. Decided to try again when they came with the 29er, nope, still substandard. Not that grippy for the speed (or fast for the grip), very blocky in mud, pretty pinched on an average rim robbing them of cornery grip (improves a lot on a fat rim, this). And they do that schwalbe thing where the grip’s quite dependent on the tread blocks, so once they wear they go off. Not as bad as a Nic for that but still means they spend half their lives being past their best.

I like them, Trailstar front, Pacestar rear. Using for 2 year snow on 2 different bikes and never felt the need to change as they are not working for me. I don’t rode real slop, mostly trail centres and them there surrey hills. So a lot of hard pack, roots, loose stuff and the odd bt of loam.

Had them OEM on my Jekyll too. They were so bad I was constantly tinkering with the shock setup to try to get some grip at the back; touch the brakes and they’d lock at the back, couldn’t slow down right, it just seemed to skip over stuff rather than bogging in and gripping.

Found a spare pair of the cheapo (£15) Rubber Queen 2.4s in the shed, so stuck them on instead and transformed the bike. After all the raving on here I couldn’t believe how much better the RQs were, I really thought it was the bike at fault!

Going to wear them out on the rear of my SS as that goes through tyres like nothing else and has been running bald for a year or so.

What about Butcher Grids? They’re coming in at £35 each, and the LBS will give me a bit off that. Looks like the Grid version is a bit softer and a bit tougher.

Magic Mary up front is a better choice, HD on the back will cover all your needs

I use them all year round on my 29er full-susser; mine have done local woods, South/North Downs, Wales, Lakes, Dales over the last year or so and have been faultless run tubeless. 2.35 Trailstar front and Pacestar rear. They’re also a good price from the German online shops.

The only other tyre I’ve used that comes close is the Maxxis HR2.

The whole reason I like HD’s is the rounded profile, you trade a bit of outright leant-over cornering grip but you gain predictability. My style of riding is fairly laid-back and I rarely try and nail it round non-bermed corners so more than happy with that compromise but can understand why others don’t like them.

Weird tyres the HDs, as said above they’re really rounded and high volume so very predictable but don’t have the that much outright grip and do clog when things get muddy.

They came on my Enduro and I properly hated them as a front tyre, just didn’t have the grip needed when pushing hard. Swapped for a Mary/Rock Razor which suited the bike perfectly.

Then ended up with another set on my hardtail and surprisingly absolutely loved them. Wasn’t looking for the same level of grip and the predictability of them really suited and balanced the bike.

Horses for courses aint it.

Minion DHF & DHR was a real surprise how much better these tyres were, also fan HR2 great tyre. Quite light too.

I ran a HD 29er on the front of my HT and FS. Nobby Nic on the back as well. It’s an okay tyre for most conditions. Really clogs up fast in the mud we get here in the Forest. Back Chilli rubber queen was a better front for me (except 2.2 is HUGE and they’re not the greatest tubeless) in all conditions. Bit of a fragile sidewall tho.

I just run DHF / Ardent (summer) and DHF / HR2 (the rest of the time). I might try a DHR2 but I don’t like change 😉

Another thumbs down for HD. Not grippy enough for a front tyre and the knobs fall off. Conti trail king is a better all rounder, or some maxxis DHR2.

I love Hans dampfs on the front, as long as the tyre pressure is low enough, they will stick like s*** to a blanket on almost anything, HTH

HDs wear out on the rear pretty quickly (450 mies) but it’s a great front tyre for me. I swap it with a Mary up front and I’ve probably ridden more with a Mary up front recently.

I now use Maxxis HDR2 on the rear all the time. It’s done a lot better this year than the HD did on the rear before it.

Depends what you ride with the HDs. It doesn’t like very hard pack rock like Antur Stiniog much. It doesn’t puncture, it just gets shredded in the turns. Something where the trail is a bit softer and it’s fine for ages.

Can’t complain for <£30 each for HD, Mary, DHR2. All fab tyres tubeless.

I believe knobs falling off is a warranty issue – I wore this one down a bit and knobs remained in place

Pacestar front, Trailstar rear

Seems like a ‘Marmite’ tyre – I prefer the downs and have some decent Strava results on Peak DH’s (yeah, I know it’s not real but an OK gauge) and it’s not the tyres that held me back, it was my braking fingers.

i’m running a Hans Dampf as a rear and a Muddy Mary up front. had one proper ride on them and so far they seem ok. long term use will be interesting based on the comments form others on this thread.
i got the Mary for free and the HD only cost me a tenner (used once) so if they die it wont be a big loss…i’ll just switch back to my reliable Panaracer Fire FR’s

So any thoughts on the Butcher Grids? Reckon I can get a pair for under £50 from the LBS, quite a difference price wise compared to Maxxis/Schwalbe tough & tubeless flavours.

I like riding HDs (when they’re new). They don’t handle serious tyre clogging mud very well, but a tyre can’t be excellent everywhere.

I’ve had a few pairs of them now and I don’t think I’ll be buying any more of them. Following reasons have meant I’ve had to retire 😆 the tyre after less then three months:

-Side nobs tearing off (trail stars on the front)
-Wearing out (pace star on the back, all sensible off road use)
-Casing tearing at the bead (front and rear single ply pace stars)
-Casing tearing on the top (Super Gravity HD, could put my finger through the hole)

Also on our last Alps trip two people’s Magic Mary’s developed a blister where the outer part of the casing separated from the rest of the tyre under the tread. So all not very good considering what they cost in the UK.

Yeah, SChwalbe did a Q&A on PinkBike, they said tyres with knobs falling off should be returned, was a quality issue, now resolved.

Pros:
Very predictable. Really, really predictable.
Rolls well for a big tyre
Good in everything but mud, excellent all-rounder. I use a Magic Mary now when it’s wet.

Cons:
Not quite as grippy at full lean as some, I don’t think this is a bad thing as sliding at little is fun if controlled, and it is controlled.
Wear can be bad on some surfaces. Again, not where I ride, they seem to be fine here.

I found them great on everything bar our local Cotswold clagg where they turned into 4″ mud tyres weighing 50lbs each .*

* could be slightly out on the width and weight.

So any thoughts on the Butcher Grids? Reckon I can get a pair for under £50 from the LBS, quite a difference price wise compared to Maxxis/Schwalbe tough & tubeless flavours.

Excellent tyre for trail riding, no brainer for £50/pair. Good balance of light/tough IME.

Hans Dampf is awesome in supergravity carcass as a rear tyre for AM/FR riding, not sure I’d bother with it in the more flimsy versions.

I’m running one on the rear at the moment (Pacestar, Super Gravity). It’s okay, but I definitely wouldn’t want to run one on the front. I run a High Roller 2 on the front, which I love. I got the HD after having endless issues with pinch flatting a tubeless High Roller LUST on the rear. The Super Gravity casing is great (no pinch flats since fitting despite putting a couple of dents in the rim), but the grip is distinctly average. I’ll be putting a High Roller 2 EXO on the rear next to see if that can also resist the pinch flats – if it does then I definitely won’t be getting another HD.

qtip – I have the same tyre in trailstar compound – no complaints about grip. Just thought I’d chip in as I didn’t expect it to grip as well as it does on off-camber stuff.

The hard Pacestar compound may well be the culprit. Not sure I’d want a softer compound on the rear though as the Pacestar seems to be wearing pretty quickly. I actually find it okay on off-camber stuff, but it seems to lose traction very easily when climbing. Cornering is okay, but I prefer the High Rollers and feel that I can push them more before they slide, hence my reason for saying that I wouldn’t want one on the front. Entirely possible that this is purely due to familiarity – the HD is my first departure from Maxxis tyres in the last 15 years!

I’m using it on a 180mm bike so not doing big miles TBH.

If only Maxxis tyres came in the SG carcass, DHR2 all the way then.

A Maxxis tyre with SG carcass would be great. Having said that, I’ve not tried a Maxxis EXO tyre on the rear yet. The EXOs are plenty strong enough on the front for me.