Molgrips and drac you are trolls and I claim my £5.

no, it wont be quite that dramatic, but they have been a user of the cheap residue, now thats banned it will push the price of diesel up. Even if the ammout of diesel goes up by aproximately the ammount of HFO thats not used it’s still an expensive process to convert it, and that cost will be spread over all diesel users. The same way as prices spike over the winter as lots of people use diesel type fuels for heating.

I think some people here are missing the point of a VW sports car with a diesel. Just think about the average buyer of this type of car and the type of driving they actually do. The words ‘sunday’ and ‘driver’ spring to mind.
For the majority of people who will buy a car like this, a current diesel will serve their needs pretty damn well.
I also think half the people in this thread who are knocking the concept, haven’t actually driven a current generation diesel engine.

Is this the VW BlueSport that they punted round the shows last year? Quite like the sound of a 1000kg car with 300lb/ft of torque.

It’s like people who say that saving 1lb from your bike won’t make you go faster – assuming (still) that all people are interested in is timing their personal best up a climb – when that’s clearly not what most of us do.

Likewise a diesel roadster might not be the ultimate finely tuned performance beast, but that’s just not the point of this car.

I reckon saving 1lb from your arse would make you go faster than on your bike anyway 🙂

Yes but ultimate speed isn’t the point, that is what I am saying. Unless you are a roadie 🙂

Forest of Boland(sp?) has some amazing roads- I wouldn’t want to drive an Eos TDI around there

I would.

Out of interest, if you come across a nice windy road in the countryside do you drive it flat out on the red line the whole time?

No but I love changing gear. On some country roads you have to drop down alot- which isn’t pleasant in a diesel. Diesels IMO thrive in smoother scenarios I.e cruising, swift progress and smooth and hassle-free overtaking manouvers with no resulting drama.

Petrol = balls to the wind in addition to smooth

On some country roads you have to drop down alot- which isn’t pleasant in a diesel

Yeah but the point is you don’t need to in a diesel. I like that, and I like the smoothness. A roadster for me would be about smoothness not outright speed. I do get the point about working through the gears but that’s all too hectic for me. And if I were redlining a car with more than a very modest amount of power I’d be quickly frustrated on a public road.

In reality I would enjoy an MX5 or similar but I can’t justify the fuel consumption. I’d love a Honda CR-Z mind 🙂

Good to have an amicable discussion on the subject at last tho 🙂

I keep reading the thread title as “WE are making a roadster….”

that would be interesting, an STW roadster. How many gears would it have, and would it have suspension at both ends, front or neither?
And of course it would have to be made of steel, wouldn’t it?

Oooh 🙂

When I had my old diesel Passat I really wanted to get hold of a knackered MX5 and put the diesel engine in it 🙂

Update: The Passat does 120mph in 5th I can confirm.

What speed are your tyres rated to and how old are they? A high-speed blow out at 120mph would be fatal for you and everyone around you.

everyone around him?

I assume this tyre overspeed you’re alluding to results in some kind of explosion?

There was a clip on Police Camera Action where a patrol car/mounted camera was speeding down the fast lane of the motorway when one of the cars tyres blew out sending the car spinning repeatedly but thankfully missing the central barrier. The car didnt flip and you could hear the Officer grunting and basically crapping himself 😆

Of course a blow out at just 70 can have disastrous consequences if the tyre de laminates or its the front etc- causing loss of control. Loss of control at 120 means alot of speed will be scrubbed……..somehow.

I always check the sidewalls and avoid kerbing/rubbing against kerbstones however quality-failure or if you’ve had your tyres a while can cause failure.

Stay safe.

This guy didn’t listen to Hora’s advice.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsTRxXvQY0s&feature=related[/video]

Sighs…………..

More torque (in isolation) does not maye a car quicker accelerating.

A flat torque curve (a la diesel) gives you a linear power curve form 0rpm to the redline.

A peaked torque curve (a la petrol) gives a progressively steper curve that flattens out towards the readline.

So to everyone who keeps blabbering on about the low down grunt of a diesel, please remember that at the end of the day the petrol has a flatter power band which is the point at which you get peak acceleration. And its not just diesels that have the ability to overtake without changeing gear, stick your foot into the axminster in a big petrol engine and it has just the same effect as it does in the big diesel, only if you keep your foot there you reach the peak power a little earlier in the petrol (rev wise) and a lot earlier (time wise).

I can drive the midget arround in 4th on B-roads, just like i could a diesel, only its not fun, having the option to rev the tits off it through the power band ocasionaly, now thats fun!

If I was driving to London tomorrow I’d chose a diesel.
If I was rich and driving to the Alps tomorrow I’d chose a Quatraportte 😀

What speed are your tyres rated to and how old are they? A high-speed blow out at 120mph would be fatal for you and everyone around you.

V rated tyres (150mph) that are three weeks and about 1500 miles old.

And its not just diesels that have the ability to overtake without changeing gear, stick your foot into the axminster in a big petrol engine and it has just the same effect as it does in the big diesel

It’s true, that’s why Americans like big V8s. I drove a 3.8l V8 and it had lots of low end torque like a diesel but really took off when you wound it up.

Used DOUBLE the fuel though, and ultimately, both me and the planet are paying.

This isn’t a thread about the perfect driving experience, it’s a thread about real world driving.

both me and the planet are paying.

How old is your car? 🙄

4 years, why? Whatever car I order from new is going to be in the system for 10-15 years isn’t it?

It was a general point about consumption that’s all.

Mercedes, BMW and Audi have been putting diesel engines in CLKs, 3 series convertibles and A4 cabrios for years now.

I’m sorry but I just don’t buy the “sports” diesel thing. I’ll admit that every performance diesel ive driven in the past 3 years has been awesome when mated to a good automatic gearbox. However, every performance diesel car I’ve ever driven has been a HUGE disappointment when it revealed it’s average fuel economy to be in the low to sub 30s when driven properly.

This begs the question….why bother? My Z4MC is. 3.2l straight six which returns 27ish mpg in my daily 20m commute. It sounds wonderful, burns clean (unlike diesels) and is naturally aspirated. It also works properly with a manual gearbox, which in my opinion diesels, (especially fast ones) don’t.

Diesels will face heavier taxation once governments wake up to the fact that Carbon Monoxide and particulates from (especially poorly maintained) diesels are polluting water systems the world over.

Yes, somehow 30mpg for a diesel car is acceptable. I think because 30mpg has that instant physchological justification.

A diesel car should get more like 50-60mpg.

Sighs…………..

More torque (in isolation) does not make a car quicker accelerating.

It just does though!

A flat torque curve (a la diesel) gives you a linear power curve form 0rpm to the redline.

A peaked torque curve (a la petrol) gives a progressively steeper curve that flattens out towards the readline.

Which is why a petrol engine has to be “on the boil” to get optimum performance. You need to be driving in this narrow slither of peak operating power the whole time if you want top acceleration/performance. This is why motor racing starts involve engines run almost to bursting point. It’s noisy, wasteful and tiresome driving this way.

So to everyone who keeps blabbering on about the low down grunt of a diesel, please remember that at the end of the day the petrol has a flatter power band which is the point at which you get peak acceleration.

The petrol is not flatter, the diesel is! (supported even by your own admission above so you are contradicting yourself)!

And its not just diesels that have the ability to overtake without changeing gear, stick your foot into the axminster in a big petrol engine and it has just the same effect as it does in the big diesel, only if you keep your foot there you reach the peak power a little earlier in the petrol (rev wise) and a lot earlier (time wise).

Wrong again! The big diesel has vastly more torque than the big petrol (it’s to do with compression ratios). Peak power covers a wider band in a diesel and at lower RPM’s, so you get to peak power much sooner (almost immediately). A big petrol engine has the equivalent torque of a modest turbo diesel – fact! The modest diesel uses a third of the fuel of the big petrol, or less.

I can drive the midget arround in 4th on B-roads, just like i could a diesel, only its not fun, having the option to rev the tits off it through the power band ocasionaly, now thats fun!

Each to his own! I personally like smooth power delivery, a smooth swift drive with minimal noise, using whatever gear is required for that experience. I don’t need a horrible row from a petrol engine to reassure me i’m going fast, besides, all others think you’re an anti-social cock when you make such a disturbance to the peace of the countryside!

Another poster said that a diesel, when thrashed, uses negligibly less fuel than a petrol. This isn’t true either! Sure, a diesel when caned has poor economy, bit it’s still very much better than a petrol on consumption. Seeing as normal people only drive like this for 2-3% of the time they are at the wheel, the issue is irrelevant.

A flat torque curve (a la diesel) gives you a linear power curve form 0rpm to the redline.

Actually, this is wrong too. A diesel’s power curve tails off well before the red line.

The power is more linear than a petrol, but not linear per say. The band therefore covers a much wider rev range and commences at much lower revs.

However, every performance diesel car I’ve ever driven has been a HUGE disappointment when it revealed it’s average fuel economy to be in the low to sub 30s when driven properly.

What do you mean by ‘properly’?

Your Z4 does 27mpg on your commute, presumably you are driving pretty carefully. I wonder what MPG (say) a TT TDI would return driven in the same conditions ie not thrashed.

Diesels ARE more economical, I’m afraid, that’s a fact. For all sorts of reasons. It’s arguable if they are better for the environment or not, it rather depends on what your criteria are.

Actually, this is wrong too. A diesel’s power curve tails off well before the red line

Depends on the engine. It’s to do with variability of injection timing. In my car power keeps going until 4krpm, then the limiter kicks in gradually, the red line is at about 4.5krpm. For some reason the auto gearbox keeps on going until power has already started to tail off which I don’t quite understand.

More torque (in isolation) does not make a car quicker accelerating.

It just does though!

Torque at the wheels does. However torque at the wheels is determined by the gear ratios and hence the speed of the engine as well as torque. Which is power. So power determines acceleration, of course, as GCSE Physics will tell you.

That’s why a petrol engine can have less max torque but the same max power, cos it can rev faster.

When people call an engine ‘torquey’ they mean low-down torque. Which is about power availability, which is what we are talking about here. To me, in ascending order of availability of power:

1) normal NA petrol
2) Turbo diesel
3) Turbo petrol
4) V8 petrol