The Lies We Tell Ourselves

Interesting report on the miss-truths told about poverty by the media:

http://www.jointpublicissues.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Truth-And-Lies-Report-smaller.pdf

The report argues that the government is “deliberately misrepresenting” the poor, blaming them for their circumstances while ignoring more complex reasons, including policy deficiencies. Moreover, they feel that this scapegoating is the result of collusion between politicians, the media and the public.

From http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/mar/03/blame-poor-poverty-barbara-ellen

Interesting the number of lies being told in the Guardian about poverty levels in the UK also.

So looks like both sides are upto it.

The media sells stories not truth.

But how much credibility can you give to a study conducted by a coalition of churches?

“Part of our calling as Christians is to seek after truth”. Great, but within some very obvious limits right?

Definitely an Interesting source!

The Joint Public Issues Team is a venture of the Baptist Union of Great Britain, the Methodist Church and the United Reformed Church. We help our three churches work together on issues of justice and inequality.

What would be their motivation in making this up?

Buzz, you are on STW and you need to ask the question? We are reminded on here on a daily basis, that the whole raison d’etre of any church/religion is to make things up, indoctrinate, confuse and ultimately abuse. Why question this?

Referring to the thread title, I’ve been telling myself for the last half hour I am just about to get out of bed.

Truths:

Most people receiving benefits are in work.
The bulk of social care money is spent on the elderly.
Unless you earn more than £47k you’re a net reciever from the tax system.

sharkattack – Member
But how much credibility can you give to a study conducted by a coalition of churches?
“Part of our calling as Christians is to seek after truth”. Great, but within some very obvious limits right?

Bit narrow-minded perhaps..? Not everything produced by religious institutions is misguided or suspect.

Unless you earn more than £47k you’re a net reciever from the tax system.

And to think I was flamed previously for suggesting that despite a reasonably high salary that we had found child benefit helpful… I wonder how many people who criticised me for my perspective earned more than £47k?

Bit narrow-minded perhaps..?

Yes I’m the narrow minded one.

I’m also poor. So far blind faith has failed to provide either a roof over my head or the inner strength to not care about being a semi-homeless vagrant.

Unless you earn more than £47k you’re a net reciever from the tax system

How does this work?

Bit narrow-minded perhaps..?
Yes I’m the narrow minded one.
I’m also poor. So far blind faith has failed to provide either a roof over my head or the inner strength to not care about being a semi-homeless vagrant.

I’m not having a go at you – just suggesting that perhaps the authors may have a straightforward aim rather than a hidden agenda? I have said it before and I will say it again – I’m not a fan of organised religion, but it it doesn’t mean that everything they do is negative or necessarily done with a desire to proselytise.

To my rather brief review it seems the authors are seeking to remove negative stereotypes from poverty – although biblical references are somewhat present.

It also seems you are in a negative situation right now – apologies if I came across as insensitive.

How does this work?

Those people receive more in benefits and services than they pay in tax, assuming average usage. Free schools, free health care, child benefit, council services, roads, police, etc.

Most tax receipts come from those who earn most.

This weeks lie: my bike will ride better if I buy a new seatpost. It IS the truth, I tell thee.

Miketually, not sure that’s correct.
I seem to remember someone linking to a calculator on the BBC website that told you whether you were +/- on tax overall, depending on certain factors. There were plenty on here who paid more into it, than they got out.

Those people receive more in benefits and services than they pay in tax, assuming average usage. Free schools, free health care, child benefit, council services, roads, police, etc.

In which case your original point is slightly misleading or not worded accurately as you are referring to average benefit claim / service usage figures. There will be plenty of net contributors earing less than 47k.

I’d like to know how these figures are arrived at. Fiendishly comlicated I would imagine and probably open to criticism on the basis of the assumtions they would need to make.

I dispute that figure of £47k.
Remember that income tax & NI are not the only taxes, we all pay VAT on many goods, plus a variety of other taxes.

I saw the figure tweeted. By a lawyer. On the internet. Therefore, it’s fact.

😉

Rule of thumb: always ask yourself what the other party’s motivation might be for telling you what they’re telling you…
Certainly the media (tabloid, BBC, broadsheets) have no interest in telling you the truth… Organised religion too…
Social media is possibly one of the greatest things to happen to us. Ever. Very very hard now to control the message and mis-inform. Why do you think China and N Korea restrict internet access?

Social media is possibly one of the greatest things to happen to us. Ever. Very very hard now to control the message and mis-inform. Why do you think China and N Korea restrict internet access?

Hmmm….. True up to a point but also an easy medium for unsubstantiated crap and witch-hunts to circulate very quickly and become ‘fact’.

And yes you should always examine the source of information for potential bias, but that doesn’t mean you should just dismiss something out of hand just because you don’t like where it came from.

Not everything produced by religious institutions is misguided or suspect.

Nope, but it’s tough to tell the true stuff from the agenda-led pieces…

The Lies We Tell Ourselves

I am still attractive to women; and really, all I need to do is a bit of a workout once a week to be the same shape as Daniel Craig in Bond

The Lies We Tell Ourselves

I am still attractive to women; and really, all I need to do is a bit of a workout once a week to be the same shape as Daniel Craig in Bond

Me too…

Interesting the number of lies being told in the Guardian about poverty levels in the UK also.

Would you care to elaborate?

Not everything produced by religious institutions is misguided or suspect.

Nope, but it’s tough to tell the true stuff from the agenda-led pieces…

How is that different from any other organisation or institution ?