How ’bout this… We’re all fantastically considerate people, we understand the impact of our (and those we are responsible for) actions on others and would consider teh impications of our choices.

Now, I’m a big sweaty fatty with a body odour and flatulence problem. I also have a nasty infection that is easily transferred. I fancy a weekend in Prague. What should I do?

Ok, lets clear this up once and for all…

Parents have the right to go on uneccesary holidays with their young children because, although they farted the screaming thing out in the first place, they don’t want the inconvenience of having to change their lifestyle, and dont give a monkeys about upsetting others.

Passengers on planes with screaming children on have the right to complain about said children, even if it doesn’t make a blind bit of difference and makes them a S.Y.N.T.

There, a synopsis everyone can be happy with, surely…. 😉

actually you have the right to do things so long as it does not impinge or incionvenience anyone else

Where did you read that? There was a van blocking the road making a right turn across traffic this morning. Boy, was I inconvenienced?! Maybe that guy did not know about my inalienable right to drive to work on empty roads.

– and you don’t have the right to take your kids on holiday

I think you’ll find you’re wrong. Not just a right but more or less an obligation!

Holidays are not a right – they are a privilege

Freedom of movement is as close to a right as you get in a modern affluent society.

Its far closer to the mark that I have the right to go about my lawful business without your brat screaming in my ear. Your brat does not have the right to scream in my ear.

I think it does. And I think it has the right to not be insulted by you.

This just gets better.

😆

Now, I’m a big sweaty fatty with a body odour and flatulence problem. I also have a nasty infection that is easily transferred. I fancy a weekend in Prague. What should I do?

Do you even consider NOT going? The infection thing should get you in trouble, but for the rest, you would just be one more traveller.

If no-one had kids then human society wouldn’t last long would it?

Ironically, it may last a little longer than if the population reaches 14 bn as projected by the UN. We can’t feed the 6.5 bn already here.

Plus, any one of those kids might be the one who figures out how to produce limitless free energy on earth or feed the world.

We had the world feeding with the green revolution – simply not much more can be grown. Oh, and didn’t you listen in your first ever high school science lesson: energy cannot be created. Again, the closest we’ve come to that is nuclear, and we all know how popular that is…

GlitterGary – Member
This just gets better.

Like kids, do you? 😀

No.

Ironically, it may last a little longer than if the population reaches 14 bn as projected by the UN. We can’t feed the 6.5 bn already here.

The human race won’t end if the population grows to unsustainable levels

People will just starve to death until it’s sustainable again

If people stop breeding, it will definitely end wont it?

DrJ – actully that is the basis of rights 🙂 – you right to do as you want so long as it does not inconvenience others.

Very few rights trump that – and allowing your brat to scream in my ear is not one of them.

So which is worse – dogs or brats?

Very few rights trump that – and allowing your brat to scream in my ear is not one of them.

It’s not so much “allowing” them to scream, it’s more that (with babies) you can’t always stop them. And if you’re all stuck in an enclosed space there’s not a lot you can do about it other than moan.

So which is worse – dogs or brats?

Yorkshire terriers, a terrifying combination of the two. Especially the silky haired ones with little bows.

mogrim – Member

It’s not so much “allowing” them to scream, it’s more that (with babies) you can’t always stop them. And if you’re all stuck in an enclosed space there’s not a lot you can do about it other than moan.

Ahh, but this is about the choices made. You (not you specifically, more those hypothetical pesky doting parents) have chosen to take junior in to that environment in the full knowledge that it may impact others. You’ve decided to jgnore the impact of your choices to achieve the greater good of your essential holiday and furthering the human race/paying my pension/cultivating future world leaders.

By making those choices with known (or very likely) impacts, you’re thumbing your nose at the rest of us whilst demanding our tolerance and understanding in doing so.

Bit unreasonable isn’t it?

We took a 7 month old to Lanzarote and only booked two seats. Both ways we got their early and flattered the check in staff to get a row of three seats. How good they resist when they saw her lovely face. Put the child in the middle, stay relaxed and hopefully they will sleep most of the way. Our daughter loved it.

I would probably book earlier and pay for the extra seat but we booked only a week in adavnce on that trip.

The human race won’t end if the population grows to unsustainable levels. People will just starve to death until it’s sustainable again

Depends just how serious the fighting gets over the last bits of food/water/oil

Spinning that argument around boblo, you knowingly chose to go on an airplane which might have children on board. ‘course you dont have to go on holiday mind……

You have chosen to take junior in to that environment in the full knowledge that it may impact others. You’ve decided to ignore the impact of your choices to achieve the greater good of your essential holiday

This is how I see it. Sadly parents like this will raise their children to think and behave in a similar fashion and the cycle will perpetuate itself.
Its unfortunate when people fail to see that their needing a holiday, traveling by plane, doesn’t give them license to inflict their children upon others.

To those who understand and respect the fact that most likely, their very young children won’t travel well, and so therefore book holidays in the UK and travel by private transport.
I think you’re spot on. I think you’re good parents for not subjecting your children to long hours on planes, etc.
😉

To those of you who just barge your way through life and society exercising your rights regardless of what your actions mean for others. You are lesser people than the sum of your parts, imo, and I pity you for not taking a more responsible, considerate role in society.

As this little island we all live on increases its population density, it would have been useful for us all to aspire to be polite, considerate and respectful to each other.

Sadly, it would appear to be the case that the opposite is the mainstream and that people seem to delight in being rude and inconsiderate to strangers.
It’s probably an ego trip thing, especially in Toys19 case, where acting “heroically” is second nature and the true meaning for their existence, obviously.
🙄

One final thing. Wherever go, whatever you do.
You represent, in the eyes of the people around you, your family.

Pity then, that when people decide to be inconsiderate, they do not stop to think of how their actions reflect upon their nearest and dearest, in the eyes of the people around them.

You behave like an idiot in front of me, then on the strength of that, I’m going to assume that your entire family are like that.

Can’t we all just be nicer and more considerate towards one another ?.
Can’t you just take your fly away holidays once your children are up to the journey ?, whats so difficult about waiting a few years ?.

Interesting to see all the views of the jaffas amongst us 😉

Clong – Member
Spinning that argument around boblo, you knowingly chose to go on an airplane which might have children on board. ‘course you dont have to go on holiday mind……

Here we are again. The ‘non parent’ individual has somehow to interpret and compensate for the fact that they will have to share space with selfish oafs who consider their ‘rights’ trump everyone elses.

If I choose to use public transport, I guarantee, nay double guarantee, I will not interupt your peace/space etc with my noise/vomit/poo etc. I will allow all my fellow ‘space users’ to go about their business completely unmolested. All I ask is to share a little space and some recycled air with you.

Now then parents, would you extend me the same courtesy please?

There are some lovely ironies in that post there, momentum_2000, cant for the life of me fathom the quote thing out though and i cant be bothered to type them out.

TBH I’m not sure who are more annoying, the parents with the screaming brats that don’t care, or the pious singletons / couples who have made a concious decision not to have children.

A bit of tolerance works wonders – both ways that is.

Well Clong, if you can’t point em out they don’t exist… They’re not existential ironies y know 🙂

Geoff. Is there another group: Parents that consider others who just might not relish my kids company?

Jesus, you lot really are hard of thinking sometimes.

Let’s say I badly need a holiday, I’m really stressed out and all, depressed with some bad UK weather and someone’s let me use their holiday home in the Algarve for free. Great! Of course I’ve got to take the kid with me since no-one will look after her for a week, and you know, she’s a pretty good kid so I trust her to behave. However at the airport she starts crying a bit – oh no, she’s coming down with a cold. When the pressure changes she starts to cry and cry like never before. Oh no! I’m so embarassed about it, and I feel really bad for everyone else on the plane, but what I can I do? I’ve done everthing I can and I’m absolutely exhausted but I’m still trying. These poor passengers, they are really annoyed with me… Oh well perhaps they’ll be good natured enough to understand my predicament.

Perhaps not!

What are you lot going to complain about next? Bumpy flight? Congested airport? How DARE those other people want to fly into MY airport?! Traffic on the roads? Outrageous!

Sometimes a bit of tolerance makes the world a much happier place for you and everone.

Clong.

Then in that case, you and I simply do not understand each other.
A common failing, it would seem, in this place. Its Ok 😉

Geoff.
Yes, consideration and tolerance isn’t being witheld, but no body should expect / demand it from me.
Also, I’ve no objection to children on planes. When they are old enough to travel peacefully.
Surely they calmed down by the time they’re 5yrs ?.

And please people, try to exercise some restraint when accusing people of being a coal hearted, childless, so and so, etc.

You don’t know everyones history…

Geoff. Is there another group: Parents that consider others who just might not relish my kids company?

Well they might not relish it, but that doesn’t mean they couldn’t tolerate it for a while.

molgrips – Member
Jesus, you lot really are hard of thinking sometimes.

No need for that. Just cos you don’t get agreement doesn’t mean people are thick.

So now you really need your holiday (understandable, must be exhausting saving the planet and breeding world leaders) and you’ve been offered a freebie.

Cos of this the other 100 folk on the plane (assuming usual 737/A320 Algarve bus) need to tolerate whaterver you and your family throw at them.

Righty ho. Go it now. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

If you get offered a holiday it doesnt mean you ‘have’ to. You made your choice to have children. I did not make that choice for you. Therefore, do not inflict your screaming children on me when i cant control it.

Anyone who takes a child likely to scream on a plane is a selfish ..so and so… You have a baby, live with the consequences. You cant go on holiday abroad. Fact!

Boblo, so your right’s to quiet/hassle free enviroment are trumping the parents right’s to use public transport?

Geoff.
Yes, considerationa and tolerance isn’t being with held, but no body should expect / demand it from me.
Also, I’ve no objection to children on planes. When they are old enough to travel peacefully.
Surely they calmed down by the time they’re 5yrs ?.

And please people, try to exercise some restraint when accusing people of being a coal hearted, childless, so and so, etc.

You don’t know everyones history…

Like I say, it cuts both ways.

Clong – Member
Boblo, so your right’s to quiet/hassle free enviroment are trumping the parents right’s to use public transport?

Not at all. I think we have equal rights and I’ll guarantee not to be a pain and upset you and your family.

Will you do the same for me please?

Sometimes a bit of tolerance and consideration for your very young children and others makes the world a much happier place for you and everone

There, fixed that for you.
😀

As above. I’m not anti children on planes, I’m not anti children.
But there are children, and there are unhappy children travelling.

A point I think Molgrips made earlier.( I think you wrote badly behaved)

But surely theres an point, an age where air travel for young children isn’t appropriate.

And in your post above, its all “me, me, me”

Let’s say I badly need a holiday, I’m really stressed out and all, depressed with some bad UK weather and someone’s let me use their holiday home in the Algarve for free

What does your 4 month old care about any of that ?.

In that scenario, you’ve worked yourself into a state and then grabbed a cheap holiday. I fail to see the 4 month old nagging you to get the family to the Algarve.
😉

I hate when people aren’t silent in the cinema

All I’m asking for is the right to not have to listen to other people making a noise, sniffing, coughing, rustling etc.

’bout the same as your demand boblo?

I’ll go with that. Noisey people in cinemas are selfish, like the ones who put their feet on the backs of the chairs in front of them.
They obviously don’t care that someone else is going to sit there soon.

And yes, I turn my phone off when in the cinema.

OMG, is the UK so full of mindlessly rude and inconsiderate people these days ?. What has happened ?.

Uplink, I’m not demanding anything. That’ll be the parents ‘demanding’ tolerance. It’s back up the thread (you know who you are 🙂 ) I’m highlighting the inequity of parental ‘demands’ for essential holidays and how this might impact innocents going about their business.

Re: noise in the pictures. Is that the same thing? Now if someone was shouting/crying/making a fuss in the Cinema, is that reasonable? You’d expect a bit of background noise in a cinema, you wouldn’t expect a crying 4 month old child (segways back on track).

Edit:

momentum_2000 – Member
OMG, is the UK so full of mindlessly rude and inconsiderate people these days ?. What has happened ?.

Yes it is and it’s gone to hell in a handcart.

No need for that. Just cos you don’t get agreement doesn’t mean people are thick.

I do get your argument, you don’t get mine. Let me spell it out for you:

1) Babies have as much right to travel as you do
2) The parents may have had every reason to expect that their kid wouldn’t bother the other passengers, but something unexpcted might have happened ie illness.
3) You don’t have the right to silence on a plane I’m afraid. So suck it up. We all need to get along. Parents need to take every precaution to stop their kids annoying other people; likewise other passengers have to make every effort not to be annoyed.
4) Planes sometimes make me feel decidedly queasy. Does this mean that I should’t ever fly because I might puke in the next seat to you?

Oh and by slagging off people just for having kids in the first place you are slagging off your own parents. If you are so worried about the resources kids take up you could kill yourself, that’d save a fair bit.

Yes it is and it’s gone to hell in a handcart
😥

Ill certainly try, but i cant guarantee it, Boblo. Just like you can’t guarantee not to upset me and my family. You could be a real charmer and run off with the missus like, that be upsetting.

Seriously though you can’t guarntee that, you might have offensive body odour, annoying voice etc. If i was to say anything though, i expect to be told to just deal with it.

I know i “upset” poeple on the plane, im rather broad in the shoulder and anyone of average size gets my shoulder dug into the side of them for most of the flight. No-one has said anything yet, but theres not a lot choice. If they want guaranteed space than they should’ve gone business class, or perhaps i should have.

Molgrips. There’s no need to be rude.

As far as I’m concerned, everyone has every right to do as they wish so long as it’s lawful and impacts no one else.

So long as your list complies with that, you have no argument from me. If you and your spawn need to start detracting from my environment (or the other 100 or so bods stuck with you) then, you are being selfish. It’s that simple.

The ultimate precaution to avoid impacting others is to consider the outcome of your actions. By dismissing the 100 or so souls that have to tolerate whatever you child chooses to do, you are just showing them contempt.

BYW I’m not slagging off people who have kids, I have my own. I’m questioning your apparent contempt for your fellow man.

Clong. No I do, I guarantee not to offend you. I’ll be up the front matey out of the way 🙂

Edit: Lemme see some pics and I’ll get back to you about MrsClong 🙂

You don’t have the right to silence on a plane I’m afraid. So suck it up
Wrong, so wrong.

We all need to get along. Parents need to take every precaution to stop their kids annoying other people; likewise other passengers have to make every effort not to be annoyed
Getting there. Allow me…
😉

We parents are grateful to you for your patience all need to get along. We Parents need to take every precaution to stop their kids annoying other people; likewise we parents are grateful to other passengers who have made an effort to make every effort not to be annoyed to overlook the choas we’re causing

There. No !, don’t thank me. You’re very welcome.
🙂