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  • STW Zwift Autumn Race Series 1
  • Premier Icon robbo1234biking
    Full Member

    Right bear with me on this one. I am going to try and organise a STW Zwift Race Series.
    It will be based on 6 races across a 6-week period, with races taking place on a Tuesday evening at 19.30.

    You can turn up to any race as the idea is for it to be fun and engaging and not too serious (see below for my attempt to level the playing field 😉) but I will try and determine a series winner for bragging rights.

    I have chosen a subset of courses across the Zwift world. There is only one big climb across these. I have chosen routes that should take about 40 to 60 minutes to complete. The courses and dates are listed below:

    Courses

    1st September – RGV (France) 15 miles (24.1km)
    8th September – 2018 UCI Worlds Course Short Lap Innsbruck 14.7 miles (23.6km)
    15th September – 10 Laps – Volcano Circuit 2.5 miles (4.1km)
    22nd September – Road to Ruins 18.4 miles (29.6km)
    29th September – Royal Pump Room 8 17.2 miles (27.7km)
    5th October – 8 Laps – London Classique 3.4 miles (5.4km)

    In order to equalise things I am going to apply a handicap to the results. Zwift’s method of using w/kg doesn’t really work on flat courses so I am going to be more scientific (I am an engineer) so I will apply a time handicap based on your FTP and weight. I have done an example of how this would apply with 4 different rides below. You can see the time differences on each one and the handicap that would be applied. This would be applied post-race but I would also keep the original results as well. I won’t break it down to the individual seconds but round up to the nearest minute. The time difference are calculated in Best Bike Split based on a 0.9 intensity factor.

    Example Handicap

    220w FTP 90kg rider
    220w FTP 70kg rider
    350w FTP 90kg rider
    350w FTP 70kg rider

    2018 UCI Worlds Course Short Lap Innsbruck Example Handicap

    Based on 0.9 Intensity Factor (90% of the FTP average for duration of the race)
    220w FTP 90kg rider – 1hr 2 mins
    220w FTP 70kg rider – 55 mins (7-minute handicap)
    350w FTP 90kg rider – 46 mins (16-minute handicap)
    350w FTP 70kg rider- 42 mins (20-minute handicap)

    6 Laps – London Classique Example Handicap

    Based on 0.9 Intensity Factor (90% of the FTP average for duration of the race)
    220w FTP 90kg rider – 10 min 12 per lap – Total 61 mins 12 seconds
    220w FTP 70kg rider – 9 min 53 per lap – Total 59 mins 18 seconds (2-minute handicap)
    350w FTP 90kg rider – 8 min 32 per lap – Total 51 mins 12 seconds (10-minute handicap)
    350w FTP 70kg rider- 8 min 20 per lap – Total 50 mins (11-minute handicap)

    How do I enter?

    1. Post on here saying you are interested.
    2. Follow me on Zwift – R obbo1234biking (STW) (The space is important)
    3. Send me a PM with your FTP and weight (FTP can be taken from Zwift or your chosen training program).

    That’s it really! I will send out the invites a few days in advance of the meetings.

    If anyone has another suggestion for the handicapping I am all ears! As you can see it makes a large difference on a hilly course but not such a difference on a flatter course and should allow people to remain competitive with your peers.

    Premier Icon DrP
    Free Member

    go on then!
    you know who I am….
    71kg…
    259ftp…

    DrP

    Premier Icon phil56
    Full Member

    You had me at ‘the idea is for it to be fun’
    FTP 344
    86 KG

    PS
    Thanks for making the effort to organise this, well done

    Premier Icon twisty
    Full Member

    Interested, 85kg Zwift says my FTP is 304W

    Those handicaps look impossibly strong for a short flat road race though, look more like what they would be for a TT.

    Premier Icon mos
    Full Member

    I’ll have a dig at this, even though I never made any of the group rides.
    Last tested ftp 297
    93 kgs

    Premier Icon mrhoppy
    Full Member

    Oh hell yes!

    270W FTP, 98kgs

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    Yep, I’m in.

    Which one is the climb course as of really best turn up for that, I’m assuming France?

    It seems we’re ignoring the pm thing so I’ll put my vitals here!

    79kg 339W apparently. Though I think that’s unlikely, I suppose I should probably do a ramp test or some nonsense.

    Let me know if you need a hand setting this up.

    look more like what they would be for a TT.

    It’s all about the craic though.

    (but a TT would be a good 7th stage, unless it’s flat, then it would be rubbish 😉)

    Premier Icon 10
    Full Member

    Yep. I’ve not raced on Zwift before so this will be a nice way to get into it. 226 at 79kg.

    Premier Icon Poopscoop
    Full Member

    Well, this is a bit like dropping your pants then being asked to cough.😉

    Feeling a little inadequate!😳

    102kg (been, well, celebrating since doing the SDW) and a mighty 241FTP.

    My weight is likely to go down markedly by the 1st Sep and in the following weeks as I’ll be back on the semi keto band wagon.

    Will it be ok to amend weight as the series goes along?

    I doubt my FTP will change much though!😆

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    Sure, i’ll play.
    FTP 298w
    Weight 90kg…
    I won’t be winning any even with a handicap as i solo a lot worse than i group ride, but i’ll put in a shift 🙂

    Premier Icon twisty
    Full Member

    How about pairing up riders and placing based on the average of their times.

    Or setting the handicap for race n based on their split from last place time on race n-1.

    Just trying to think of a way the handicap can help with fun racing tactics. The time penalty based handicap system, if not ignored, would motivate the faster riders to split the pelo right off the line and TT to try and make up the time penalty.

    Premier Icon b1gf00t
    Free Member

    Will have to miss the first one but the others look interesting…

    64kg
    300w

    Premier Icon zilog6128
    Full Member

    hope that handicap system works as most people above are putting out some very big numbers 😭
    79Kg, 255W

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    hope that handicap system works as most people above are putting out some very big numbers 😭
    79Kg, 255W

    I hope it doesn’t as zwift seems to make up some big numbers!

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    64kg
    300w

    OUCH !!!

    Premier Icon oopnorth
    Full Member

    Can I play too but I may not be able to make every week due to work commitments? I’m not bothered about the winning (let’s be honest I won’t be anywhere near the pointy end!), just having fun on the days I can join. If not being able to do every week screws up the maths, feel free to tell me to do one! 🙂

    88KG
    271 FTP

    Premier Icon nixie
    Full Member

    7.30pm is normally a bit touch and go for me however would like to try and join at least some of these. Last 42 days is showing eFTP as 335W @ 75kg.

    Premier Icon J-R
    Full Member

    I’m interested in this, especially as this year’s wonderful summer riding season draws to a close.

    My details are 72kg, and 270W.

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    Due to a calibration issue, my power FTP has been lowered by ZP Mods to 275w.

    So i’m

    275w
    90kg.

    Premier Icon robbo1234biking
    Full Member

    Thanks all for the interest. I have tied up most of you to your zwift username but I need to know the zwift usernames for the following:

    @mos
    @10
    @b1gf00t
    @nixie
    @J-R

    I have had a couple of follow requests but need to tie these up with the right people and I might already be following some of you but cant associate the username on STW with the Zwift name.

    As for handicap – the other way to do it would be to let people go in reverse order. You get given your handicap time and you set of X minutes after the first person. Should bring everyone together for the end then…would have to be self policed but sure we can trust you! This series is to find a way to run these in the future as I hope to do something through the winter months so it might be that we try something else as we go through the series. its about fun so we can change the rules as we go along.

    I forgot to mention that the points will be awarded according to the finish on the day so it could be about consistency than being good on a particular course. I will do something similar to F1 so 25 points for fastest time (allowing for handicap) down to 1 point for 10th.

    People can turn up to individual races – its about having fun with a bit of structure (I think I have to make every week though for it to run!).

    P.S the numbers dont tell the whole story. weeksy is pretty similar numbers to me (I have a 10W higher FTP at the moment but that was the opposite a while back). On a flat crit style course weeksy would beat me all day but on a hilly course (from the one time weeksy turned up to a Sunday hills) I would be faster than him so it depends how you ride certain courses.

    Premier Icon b1gf00t
    Free Member

    David C@DPCT

    Premier Icon nixie
    Full Member

    You get given your handicap time and you set of X minutes after the first person

    You mean like the TTT events do. I quite like that as an idea as it would make it more likely that I’d make the start on any given week :D. The Deeside event ran like this last ‘series’ block. When the handicap is spot on the lead groups from each cat should come together for the last few minutes.

    My zwift name is set as “Aaron Barry [BRT]” currently.

    Premier Icon robbo1234biking
    Full Member

    Cheers guys I have got you both already!

    Premier Icon zilog6128
    Full Member

    Starting everyone at the same time would make it feel like a race rather than a time-trial, however a staggered start would probably make it more exciting at the finish as well as making it a lot easier to work out who’s winning at any point (you would have to refer to a spreadsheet otherwise 😂)

    Premier Icon n0b0dy0ftheg0at
    Free Member

    Sounds intresting, but I’m still waiting for the all clear to get sweaty and start doing meaningful power intervals again on the bike after surgery three weeks ago, plus I will also miss at least one meeting in September due to hols.

    I’ll check back into the thread closer to September and see if there are any spots left, if I’m given the nod by my GP.

    Premier Icon J-R
    Full Member

    On Zwift I’m Southside Johnny

    Premier Icon oopnorth
    Full Member

    I’m not sure about a staggered start, I’m all about the draft!! I need it!! 😉

    Premier Icon neilarn2
    Full Member

    Hi Robbo

    i’m in but will do a ramp test  To get a new FTP as haven’t done one for about 4 months.
    followed you on Sunday when the post was first put up.

    currently 219 and 79.8kg

    Neil

    Premier Icon r8jimbob88
    Free Member

    I’m waiting for delivery of a Wattbike Atom but will be up for this once it arrives at some point next month.

    73kg
    332w

    Username is J Stockton (HPC)

    Premier Icon tyke
    Full Member

    Hi Robbo
    FTP 190w
    65kg
    Andy Robinson STW
    Cheers
    Andy

    Premier Icon IvanDobski
    Free Member

    Damn it, I’ve just cancelled my Zwift subscription to change to Sufferfest for a bit or I’d be well up for this.

    Premier Icon mrhoppy
    Full Member

    Chasing start would be interesting, maybe with groupings every 30 seconds to give some split but also some chance for drafting.

    Premier Icon undarra
    Free Member

    This might give me the motivation to start using zwift again regularly.
    Simon Collins (STW)
    ftp: 214
    weight: 78 Kg

    Cheers, Si

    Premier Icon robbo1234biking
    Full Member

    OK I have plugged in the info for everyone I have details for to date. Below is the handicaps for Stage 1 (dont worry I can update these if your FTP or weight changes before hand). The course is fairly flat so weight isnt the deciding factor on this course. I think if people are able to perform their best then this should be fairly accurate. I have rounded to the nearest 30 seconds. Weeksy and I rode the reverse course of this today with very different strategies and ended up within 3 seconds of each other at the end.

    The race will definitely reward you for hanging in as long as you can with a group a bit better than you as long as you don’t give up too much and blow up! If this doesn’t work we can try something else for race 2 (perhaps Twistys suggestion above). If everyone’s handicapped final times are within about a minute at the end then I would say we are fairly close to a decent handicap system that allows for individual performance on the day (good or bad).

    Handicap times (to be added to your time at the end) are as follows:

    DrP 4 mins
    Phil56 7 mins 30 seconds
    Twisty 6 mins
    mos 5 mins
    mrhoppy 3 mins 30 seconds
    10 2 mins
    Poopscoop 2 mins
    Weeksy 4 mins
    b1gf00t 6 mins 30 seconds
    zilog6128 3 mins 30 seconds
    oop north 3 mins 30 seconds
    nixie 8 mins
    J-R 4 mins 30 seconds
    neilarn2 1 min 30 seconds
    r8jimbob88 7 mins 30 seconds
    tyke 0 mins
    undarra 1 min
    robbo1234biking 4 min

    P.S Algorithm was not provided by Gavin Williamson

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Full Member

    Well, colour me impressed.

    I’ve raced Dr P and today finished 2s ahead of Robbo in a race, so us 3 having the same start time seems very fair to me.

    Question, are we allowed teamwork/drafting ?

    Premier Icon robbo1234biking
    Full Member

    Yeh drafting is allowed. So if you can hang onto a slightly faster group then it should give you a good result.

    Forgot dangeourbrain as well sorry! 7min 30 secs for you!

    Premier Icon Mark
    Full Member

    If I wanted to join in do I have to do that FTP test thing first?

    Premier Icon andeh
    Free Member

    I’m interested but between trainers, so will have to do an FTP when I get the new one rolling

    Premier Icon nixie
    Full Member

    Ouch I’m going to have to work hard 😀

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    Oooft. 7.5 min! Glad I’ve got a few weeks to get training!

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