Well done to Wales, other teams may not have been great this year but they still had to go and win the matches.

I thought Scotland were embarrassing on Saturday, i would say we need to do what England have done and have a freash start but for the most part that is our best players..eek

Largely agree with A_As current Lions team

15 Kearney (moment of genius (maybe) from Grey rather than Kearney error)
14 Bowe
13 Tuilagi
12 Davis (can he play 12?)
11 North
10 Farrel/Sexton (depending on game plan)
9 Phillips (would rather not but slim pickings at present)
8 Denton (thought he has looked good even in a bad team)
7 Warburton
6 Lydiate (unbelievable on Saturday and pushing ahead of Ferris for me)
5 Grey
4 POC/A Wyn-Jones
3 Adam
2 Ford/Best again not much choice, both were below their best this weekend. Rees if he gets a run without injury perhps?
1 Gethin

A-A, ok so you like to have fun at the English, but really proposing Matt Stevens is a joke too far 😉

Matt Stevens is needed.

Ok A-A, its fair enough to have a joke at us English, but that one is going too far! 😉

Lancaster did a brill job bar the substitutions in the Welsh game. Bloody MS, I wince whenever he is warming up. Good job SL learned his lesson there.

glitch bump thing

Quite a few harsh or realistic (depending on your viewpoint) comments in the Sunday papers regarding where SL can take this Team and if its already reached its peak.

can take this Team and if its already reached its peak.

What a ridiculous theory. 5 games together and they’re not going to improve any further? Which newspaper is this in?
Far more realistic to say that the welsh have peaked. There’s only one direction to go from the top (of the NH teams at least).

Did you not see the first 60 minutes of england Ireland? just awful.

Youngs took his try really well.

Far more realistic to say that the Welsh have peaked

Yep, with an average age as low as theirs, they really can only go downhill from here on in, can’t they? I mean, playing more together, training more together, spending more time together as a unit, all of these things, over a long period of time, are what drives a team to being terrible, aren’t they?

🙄

Yep, with an average age as low as theirs, they really can only go downhill from here on in, can’t they? I mean, playing more together, training more together, spending more time together as a unit, all of these things, over a long period of time, are what drives a team to being terrible, aren’t they?

Ah, someone bit. 😀 Thank you, CFH
Exactly my point in response to;

Quite a few harsh or realistic (depending on your viewpoint) comments in the Sunday papers regarding where SL can take this Team and if its already reached its peak.

Complete nonsense isn’t it?

Ok A-A, its fair enough to have a joke at us English, but that one is going too far

but with 22 man match day squads you need a jack of all trades prop, I think paul james would be the better option to cover both sides from the bench but suggested stevens as Ididnt want to be too one eyed.

No Lions place for the 6N’s highest points scorer???

Obviously where SL can take this team and if it has reached its peak in terms of players ability are two equally seperate questions.

With so many false dawns particularly recently, is it really complete nonsense that this England team won’t get any better? I’d certainly not take it for granted, particularly with an inexperienced coach and as Stephen Jones in the Times suggests, basically a fair few stop gap players. Dallaglio and Walsh also made comments on this theme of varying subtleness. Makes fascinating discussion anyway especially with a tough 9 months coming up.

is it really complete nonsense that this England team won’t get any better?

What’s so different about this new england team and those of the welsh ones of the past? Or the present one? False dawns ring any bells?
How it can be suggested that a brand new team won’t improve whereas an established one will is one for the hard of thinking.

many of the journo’s are mentalists, apprently in the Times Steven Jones picked Sheridan in his hypothetical current Lions team!!!

Dean Ryan is my current favourite rugby writer, good sensible well thought out views.

12 Davis (can he play 12?)

plays 12 for Llanelli, previously with that no tackling kiwi fella at 13 and now with S Williams at 13. Very few potential Lions entres who can pass well though which is a worry. I doubt BOD will make it….have to pick Gav I suppose!!!! 😆 I am hoping Ashley Beck can develop into a potential Wales player soon he reminds me of will Greenwood.

Wrecker – i agree – there is no difference – regardless of nation a new team does not automatically improve over time, although you suggest this possibility is nonsense with the current england manager and players, which is fair enough.

What I like about SL is he seems to have got rid of a certain mindset in England players. Cueto was on record as saying he was looking forward to forcing his way back in once the interim head coach had left at the end of the 6 nations. He’ll be not so sure now.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/9154101/England-hooker-Dylan-Hartley-faces-12-week-ban-after-being-cited-for-biting-Irelands-Stephen-Ferris.html

thought he’d been quiet.

World champions New Zealand will be among Wales’ opponents during November’s autumn internationals.
The Grand Slam winners will face the All Blacks in Cardiff on Saturday, 24 November with a 1715 GMT kick off.
Warren Gatland’s side host Argentina in the opening game of the Autumn series on 10 November before they face Samoa on Friday, 16 November.
After playing New Zealand, Wales complete the series against Australia on 1 December.

If Hartley did that, he deserves to be shot. That’s disgusting behavior.

Now, I’m looking forward to seeing Wales play NZ and SA. When England were on a high, they took the Southern Hemispere teams on and beat them home and away. Wales have to be able to do the same to really be rated as a great team.

Just heard about the citing of Hartley, if he is found guilty what will the punishment be? what should the punishment be?

Just heard about the citing of Hartley, if he is found guilty what will the punishment be? what should the punishment be?

The clue is in the link…

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/9154101/England-hooker-Dylan-Hartley-faces-12-week-ban-after-being-cited-for-biting-Irelands-Stephen-Ferris.html

Given his previous for gouging it would be a lengthy ban.

Now, I’m looking forward to seeing Wales play NZ and SA. When England were on a high, they took the Southern Hemispere teams on and beat them home and away. Wales have to be able to do the same to really be rated as a great team.

i dont think wales are anywhere near good enough to worry SH teams away from home.

Exactly AA he will find himself in real trouble, Tree Magnet he was banned for 6 months for gouging a couple of years ago, if he gets 12 weeks it will be a joke.

12weeks is the minimum if guilty he should get quite a bit more than that with his record.

He can apparently get anything up to a maximum of 4 years. He’s a proper idiot if he’s done it.

I guess best case there could be mitigating circumstances eg. Ferris grabbed his mouth and he did it to stop him. Given Hartley’s record I doubt that will carry any weight at all. 6 month ban on the cards I would say.

[innocent until proven guilty but…] I had thought that he had put all his BS behaviour behind him this season. Together with Stevens they were both walking penalty donators in the past. Should be a big ban if true. Hope it isn’t not for him, but for the sport.

Can you really bite an leave a mark with a gumshield? (non-troll question BTW)

Up to 4 years is it not?
Hartley looks like a comedy character I reckon. He’d make a brilliant little Britain sketch “spiteful uncontrollable rugby player”

Should be a big ban if true. Hope it isn’t not for him, but for the sport.

A strange comment when it’s already been established that Ferris was bitten, just not who the biter was.
I’d say its worse “for the sport” if biting goes unpunished, but I guess his defence is likely to be that it was someone else.

I think his defence is that ferris was twisting his head with his finger fish-hooking his mouth. Apparently it can be seen on the vid. Changes matters if true IMHO.

seems clear to me who bit Ferris but as wrecker says we dont know why and thats not clear at all.

Ioum, that’s what I meant but phrased badly. I hadn’t realised that it had already been proven to have happened. I was hoping for the sport that no biting had occurred. Not defending DH and if he did it, he should be severely punished. But if wrecker’s comments are also true, then Ferris isn’t clean on this either.

I must be thick but what do these YT clips actually show. You see Ferris withdraw his hand sharply, but anything else….?

That’ll be an absolute nightmare to sort out. Even if DH is innocent (and I make no suggestion that he is) he has form so I don’t fancy his chances.

Lots of informed [?] comments from fuzzy clips. Still cant see what happened on any of the versions apart from Ferris’ reaction.

Like you, I can’t see it in the YT clips :- the alledged biting or fish-hooking.
But the officials must have access to the other cameras’ footage as well as the broadcast.
I don’t think anything will be cleared up until the decision now, with journlists being careful to report “alledged biting” on a player “thought to be Ferris”.
Nothing’s proven to have happened, but the ref’s transcript shows his position.

“I have an accusation of biting, a clear mark on the finger.
“I did not see something. If I do it will be dealt with severely, which would be a red card. If it is seen it will be dealt (with).”
Owens added: “Have a word. Nothing like that takes place in this game. I can only deal with what I see.”
As the packs then set up for a scrum, Owens added: “This game is difficult enough without stuff like that, is that clear?”
The referee then approached Ferris, while the back-row forward was receiving treatment from Ireland’s physiotherapist, and said: “I have done all I can. It has been noted. If I don’t see it, I can’t do anything about it.
“It has been spoken about and dealt with.”

You can track Hartley from one ruck to next where he is lying over Ferris. Ferris gets a bit animated and pulls his arm out from under Hartley’s face as the play moves on you can see a bit of a scuffle break out. At next break in play Ferris shows Owens a mark and Owens clearly says it looks like a bite mark. If Ferris stands in front of the citing board and says Hartley had a bite it will be hard to get out of, best hope is to say it was defence as hes was being gouged or fish hooked. You have to wonder if Ferris would draw attention to it if he was at it could be spotted on camera

Citing cmitties dont need video evidence by the way:
http://m.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2009/jan/29/paul-rees-marius-tincu-gouging?cat=sport&type=article

Sale have signed a sleb.

Hopefully Diamond can tame the little rascal!

Owens impressed me no end in that game (and in others).
How can there be such a gap between him and Roland?

Who have Sale signed? Be the last one in a while if Kennedy buys Rangers….