Royal mail have binned my rear shock!

Just had a call from a gentleman from the Chief Exec’s office…. been told that the shock has been disposed of. He doesn’t know where it is!

I pointed out that he must have records which method of disposal was selected. He confirmed that they would and that he’d find out and get back to me. He told me that it didn’t look good and that since the new regulations came into force earlier in the year that this type of situation have caused a lot of problems.

so how do I escalate this?

Sternly worded letter to RM 🙄
Letter to MP
Contact Police
Citizens advice
Trading standards
National news papers
Magazines
Social media
Rogue traders
Watchdog
???

RicB – Member

It’s not wrong; it’s theft.

RM has a duty of care to protect its employees from harm by banning and safely disposing of hazardous materials. That’s fair enough.

However, those items never become RMs property, so they can’t sell them on. They certainly aren’t the Ebayer’s property to sell.

If I was the OP I’d be tempted to report it to the police.

Totally agreed. “You’ve sent something that’s too dangerous to deliver. Our only option is to destroy it securely sell it for profit.” WTF, frankly.

so how do I escalate this?

Sternly worded letter to RM
Letter to MP
Contact Police
Citizens advice
Trading standards
National news papers
Magazines
Social media
Rogue traders
Watchdog
???

All of the above!

Maybe see if the major mags can pick up the story and start the social media off for you, someone (Dave?) from STW has already commented I think.

It’s bonkers that RM can do this.

I’ve been in contact with Dave@STW hopefully this may help apply some additional pressure.

I hope it does hit RM hard, that over time people wont risk anything other than a book or box of tissues. Must admit that recently I sold a few bits on ebay and the cost of postage was just crazy compared to the last time i sold stuff. I lost a bit of money on that lot. I have used parcels2go in the past and been very happy, so i wager that i will just carry on with them. Collection from my place of work also included in a sensible price.

Slighlty OT- I’d be interested to know why the entity that was allowed to buy the most shares (6%)- who they are. Apparently its an offshore company. I think every other company was allowed 3% max?

Sternly worded letter to RM
Letter to MP
Contact Police
Citizens advice
Trading standards
National news papers
Magazines
Social media
Rogue traders
Watchdog
???

All of the above.

Happy to get this one tweeting for you and do some targeted tweets to warn companies not to use RM.

Why not let RM know that you appreciate their assistance so far, but as pointed out previously, they need to prove you did not state contents when posting and believe their T&C of what constitutes a potentially dangerous item are unreasonable. If they cannot locate the item or how they disposed of it, you will report to police as theft.

Subtly mention you don’t want to have to start a social media frenzy…

Will be a big can of worms and a PITA for them if they need to start investigating all similar claims….

When ever I buy anything off the web I have to tick a box stating I have read all ther t&cs before letting me proceed.

Surely if they are confiscating goods to sell for profit they should be making people sign something saying they understand all terms and conditions at point of posting.

As the way things are the system is wide open for abuse.

Slighlty OT- I’d be interested to know why the entity that was allowed to buy the most shares (6%)- who they are. Apparently its an offshore company. I think every other company was allowed 3% max?

It was Fox, so they could intercept all their products being sent and re-sell them for profit.

Now to watch to see the buggers try to sell it on. Judging by some of the stuff on those ebay accounts, I’d be surprised if they didn’t.

I’d agree with the earlier posts that selling other people’s property on without their explicit consent should rank as theft, but they will of course claim that by handing over at the post office, you accepted their spurious t&cs which effectively give them carte blanche to do what they will with your ‘dangerous’ goods.

Would be nice to see that tested under criminal or civil law, but I imagine the coppers wouldn’t be keen to spend their time on that particular grey area.

At least you have someone at head office you can now discuss directly with, as opposed to the nameless and faceless pit of despair that is the usual complaints process.

I gave up on RM for anything valuable after they lost a £30 bike bit. I hadn’t insured it because their counter person told me that standard post was covered up to (iirc) £50. So i went with a signed for delivery but no special insurance. So when they lost it, i claimed for my £30 ‘loss’ only to be told that they wouldn’t pay it because they had no proof that the contents were worth £30. Even though i emailed them links to the FS thread on here, etc. They reimbursed the cost of the postage, and to rub it in, did it in stamps so in effect no cost to them because the only way i could use them was to send something else!!

Why would the police care? they’re just following their Ts & Cs

(Not that I agree with them but I can’t see why it could be considered theft or fraud)

I think shouting from the rooftops on social media is the answer but you have to give the chap from head office a chance to do something….he has, after all, got on touch twice

In my experience with RM, requests for records usually result in shrugged shoulders about why they can’t find them.

Anyway, makes me think if I was to risk RM for posting a shock, I’d make a note of any serial numbers on it first. Match that on an ebay item and you’ve definitely got a case of theft. Though RM will of course argue you breached their terms by sending a prohibited item and their terms you could never have read say they can auction the item if they want.

This situation is nuts. Really think I’ll stop using them to send anything at all now. That they’ve gone private I hope means we get competition including for the final mile and for the Post Office.

Why would the police care? they’re just following their Ts & Cs

Just because they have T&C doesn’t necessarily mean they are 1) enforceable or or 2) legal.

Social media shit storm then legal action. Or threats of legal action then the other two things.

(Not that I agree with them but I can’t see why it could be considered theft or fraud)

To paraphrase an example earlier: if you stick a note to your front door saying “if you knock on my door I’m entitled to mug you and take your car”, then go through with that, it doesn’t stop it being a police matter.

Whether terms and conditions are legally enforceable isn’t a police matter…That’s for the courts to decide

Just to clarify, i’m not going to kick off straight away. I’ll be waiting until I hear back tomorrow before doing anything else. Even then, i’ll write to RM first and give them a deadline to respond, 7 days or something.

Escalating things too early can sometimes cause more hassle. You’d be surprised what being polite, respectful but clearly stating your case can achieve.

I’ll not bother with the police, can’t see that going anywhere.

If the dubious terms and conditions appear to involve the committing of a criminal offence, it is a police matter, theoretically. I tend to agree that in practical terms, no action is likely to result from reporting it as a crime (although the act of reporting it may offer some leverage…and also may make it easier for news organisations to follow it up as a story.)

Well said, OP

It’s funny. I was getting my deck built by a bloke that was recommended to me by the local timber yard. One morning the postie saw him and asked if that was (insert name) and I said yeah it was. Postie told me that this fella did time inside for stealing mail. He seemed ok but it proves that it goes on.

In my experience with RM, requests for records usually result in shrugged shoulders about why they can’t find them.

This situation is nuts. Really think I’ll stop using them to send anything at all now. That they’ve gone private I hope means we get competition including for the final mile and for the Post Office.

^^This. Hopefully privatisation will result in forced competition and with that forced modernisation so that the “don’t care” and “do the bare minimum” culture is brought to a halt.

So now if the Royalmails intentions are honourable and genuine measures to protect their staff and not a means to a cash cow.
And they have decided shocks and alike are to be targeted for those reasons should they not be targeting CRC and the likes of.

Or do they have an HHHHRrrrmmm unwritten agreement that they will not be bothered or have to comply with said rules .

Or have we already established that Different t&cs apply to them .

I could be wrong but didn’t rm forum link site that different rules apply to Joe Public?

Send a recorded letter (preferably using an alternative delivery company for comedic irony) stating they have 10 working days from receipt of the letter to resolve the issue to your satisfaction

Tell them what you will accept.

Explain your next course of action if the matter isn’t solved. Which would, in my opinion, be warning friends and other people via social media about the risks of using RM, and sorting out a court date at your local county court.

I find the court threat works best if done in a rueful manner; ‘I really hope you can sort this problem out for me because I hate taking companies to court’. Works for me every time, especially if you’ve already enquired with the court and quote document titles etc.

Edit – spelling

shouldn’t you be able to find out disposal routes / revenues etc through the freedom of information act?

that would be interesting.

Pitchforks at the ready, op.

Totally agreed. “You’ve sent something that’s too dangerous to deliver. Our only option is to destroy it securely sell it for profit.” WTF, frankly.

Nutshell.

Privatisation closed the door on FOI requests to RM.

Like most on here, I’m no expert but if they tell you it’s been destroyed so that you no longer pursue the matter, but actually, they sell it on, surely that is obtaining good by deception. (theft act 1968 possibly)

I thought the wording was “disposed of”?

If they can’t provide proof of safe disposal, I’d take them to the Small Claims Court…

It’s astonishing that they can get away with this.

Basically, despite shipping hundreds of shocks each and every day, they can, at random, confiscate and dispose of those that they arbitrarily decide are dangerous?

So despite suspension components not being on a banned list they can still confiscate at their discretion? That makes no sense.

They’ve basically given themselves a licence to steal whichever items of mail they can make more from by selling then delivering! That’s what this comes down to – A simple economic decision to make more money through theft.

Of course it’s no coincidence that the rules were rejigged just in time for privatisation. Another little mechanism to increase shareholder value at the expense of customer service.

WOW!

Just had a call from someone (they shall remain nameless for the time being) and they have offered me a brand new shock for my bike free of charge!

I was totally stunned when I was told this and felt a little bit squishy inside that someone could be so generous and compassionate.

If you’re reading this…thank you so much!

I’ll provide more details when things are finalised.

A crap day has turned into a great day 😀

Great news!

But doesn’t get away from the crime Royal Mail have committed. Other won’t always be able to stand in when RM steal items.

Was the nameless person the boss of Royal Mail?

Just be sure they don’t post it to you…

Great result op ,

And very kind of whoever as offered this kindness.

I would make sure they are happy with being named or I could see a lot stwers suddenly being robbed by the Royal Mail.

Definition of dispose in English
dispose
Pronunciation: /d??sp??z/
Translate dispose | into French | into German | into Italian
verb
1 [no object] (dispose of) get rid of by throwing away or giving or selling to someone else:
the waste is disposed of in the North Sea
people now have substantial assets to dispose of after their death
informal kill:
she came up with schemes for disposing of her husband
overcome (a rival or threat):
the Scottish champions were buoyant after they disposed of English champions Leeds
informal consume (food or drink) quickly or enthusiastically:
she watched him dispose of a large slice of cheese
2incline (someone) towards a particular activity or mood:
prolactin, a calming hormone, is released, disposing you towards sleep
[with object and infinitive]:
if you touch the female readers’ hearts, it might dispose their husbands to be charitable
3 [with object and adverbial] arrange in a particular position:
the chief disposed his attendants in a circle
[no object] literary determine the course of events:
the government proposed, but the trade union movement disposed
[from the proverb ‘Man proposes, (but) God disposes’, translating Latin Homo proponit, sed Deus disponit (Thomas à Kempis’s De Imitatione Christi i. xix)]
Derivatives

Disposed of sure covers a lot despite in my mind meaning to throw away.

No problem OP. Least I could do for a cycling brother 😀

WOW!

Just had a call from someone (they shall remain nameless for the time being) and they have offered me a brand new shock for my bike free of charge!

I was totally stunned when I was told this and felt a little bit squishy inside that someone could be so generous and compassionate.

If you’re reading this…thank you so much!

I’ll provide more details when things are finalised.

A crap day has turned into a great day

Cane creek DB then?