Shame the travel advice was changed to allow anyone to go but good that this has happened now rather than in a few weeks when far more folk would have been there. Anyone who goes abroad nowadays without thinking this might be the outcome is pretty naive!
its not just a blunt tool, its nothing better than a club.
spain is experiencing increased virus incidence IN SOME AREAS, i dont see anyone advising limiting travel to UK based holidays where their route passes through/near watford, luton, leicester etc.
as i said at the top of this page, six days ago, on entering the UK there were zero checks - unless you believe that after we created and implemented the digital customs checks in the irish sea, we moved swiftly onto thermal imaging cameras, linked to passport details, cross checked to airline check-in data, headcount on the flight and facial recognition in the airport.
It was obvious that there was a a big risk of something like the quarantine on return from Spain happening which is why I cancelled all plans to go out of scotland this year
We arrived in Spain on Thursday. Left Bristol at 3am and arrived (near Bilbao) at 9.20pm. Via tunnel. Took all our own food so had no contact with others on the way. We have a house here which suffers if left locked up for too long. Damp and wildlife soon take charge. We’ll quarantine on return. I’m self employed and work from home so it’s annoying but not the end of the world. Makes me more angry thinking at Dom and his ‘ eye test’.
It would be nice if you could get a test on return to avoid quarantine, like in Germany.
Local beaches are crazy busy as everyone is holidaying locally. We are swimming in the evening or hidden spots to avoid.
Sat on an easyjet flight back from majorca waiting to take off, been in majorca for 3 weeks, for us quarantine is annoying but not a major issue.
But I feel for everyone who it is a major issue for who flew out in the last few days on summer hols.
Seems like a very blunt instrument, not sure why we can't take a test on arrival like Germany are doing.
There is a glimmer of hope in that Spain are petitioning the UK to exclude the Islands from the quarantine. Only time will tell how effective that petition is.
I knew it was a risk, and I'll probably be paid as precedent was set at the start of the crisis. My wife will be paid, my son will be paid but his GF has already had a week off due to self-isolation so she may only be paid for one week.
The lack of actual testing in the UK is a farce.
I think it's reasonably likely that the Balearic and canaries will be excluded from the quarantine by the weekend.
A few notes on quarantine from Australia, which you may find interesting:
Australia was pretty quick to shut down it's borders, allowing only citizens (or "permanent residents") back in - this was still a significant number of inbound people (thousands a day). All returning travelers, regardless of where they had been, were required to self-quarantine for 14 days. This was prior to the first peak.
Not sure what the data was, but the NSW government realized that people weren't self-quarantining strictly enough, so they introduced fines, and used Army personnel (under the direction of the police) to knock on the doors of people at home who were supposed to be quarantining. I don't think Melbourne (Vic) did this, but Sydney (NSW) certainly did. From memory, this was about when we were seeing about 100 ish new cases a day in NSW.
Soon after that, it was announced that all overseas arrivals (which were only returning Aussies anyway) would be taken directly from the airport and locked in a hotel for 14 days on arrival. They didn't trust that (even with checks) returning travelers would self quarantine.
Here's a picture of my friend arriving home with her family from Vietnam at the end of March, being taken to a (quite posh!) hotel in circular quay, where she was locked in a room for 14 days (it was on the front of several newspapers).
This has been the reality since then - you can leave the country, but when you return home you will be quarantined under lock-and-key for 14 days. Since then, NSW has recorded single digit or low-teen new case numbers every 24 hours for the last few months, despite high testing rates.
During that period, we've been getting daily briefings on the number of tests and the number of new cases. Typically all, or all but one/two cases each day were from people in quarantine. It was surprising (maybe not) to hear how many of them had actually caught it on the plane home.
HOWEVER, things have changed in the last few weeks:
The quarantine hotels in Melbourne haven't been run by the police/army, they've been run by security guards. This has resulted in them being quite "leaky": Hotel staff catching it and taking it home, people testing positive but then being allowed home while still symptomatic, and (I'm not kidding) security guards shagging the "inmates". This has led to a massive spike in Melbourne/Victoria, with about 500 cases a day now, and yesterday 10 people died in a single day (the total deaths for the whole of Australia has been 104 for months). Basically the whole of melbourne is in lockdown (much stricter than the initial) and NSW risks going back into lockdown because of the leaky quarantine in Melborne.
As a result, Quarantine measures have been toughened up: travelers now have to pay for their own quarantine ($3,000 AUD, 1,700 GBP), and arrivals are capped at 4,000 each week so as to be manageable.
Because we have low numbers, we are able to invest heavily in tracking every single case, to find out where it has come from, and test all known contacts.
We've had a cluster in Sydney in the last couple of weeks - an infected truck driver from Melbourne went to a pub in western Sydney, which has resulted in 56 new cases, all of which have been genotyped and confirmed as coming from that one guy. We're having another cluster (46 so far) associated with a thai restaurant - I don't think they know the source of that yet.
Quarantining returning travelers has been, by far, the most effective tool at keeping our numbers very low. In NSW, this has been really successful - we had months without any community transmission, but Melboune have shown what happens when quarantine wasn't done effectively, and how then those numbers can grow super quickly.
Anyway - just a different perspective from over here which you might find interesting.
an infected truck driver from Melbourne went to a pub in western Sydney, which has resulted in 56 new cases
And this right here is why i'm still not doing very much at all.
And this right here is why i’m still not doing very much at all.
Agreed. Why anyone would want to get on a plane is completely baffling.
mate of mine is off to Jerez for a 3 day trackday in a few weeks... I messaged him when the Spain situation came up this weekend.
"Changes nothing mate" was his rather baffling reply to me.
We've done the local once since they opened, 1 pint in the garden and a couple of trackdays at Silverstone, no contact at all... That's about it... I'm not prepared to do 'more' myself. Although we have potentially an overnight in PRemier Inn in a few weeks... which i'm kinda dreading lol.
Agreed. Why anyone would want to get on a plane is completely baffling.
Most of my family live in Australia, not having seen them for 18 months is pretty motivating - if it was allowed I'd consider it but probably come to the conclusion that it has to be next year.
Work have confirmed I'll be paid and are dropping off a laptop so I can do every online training course they can think of. Yay for being a valued employee at a company who do more than just claim to care about their employees.
We're halfway through a 2 week break in the south of France. Keeping an eye on the r rate as the uk rules may extend to returning from France soon.
Wouldn't be the worst thing in the world as we can both work quite happily from home - just tough on the kids.
Ironically we've been pretty well isolated here in a private villa, and driving ourselves around.
Masks are obligatory in most shops and are mainly being worn well- only a few are around the chin. Went to Marseillan yesterday though, which seemed to be full of French people who didn't want to follow any rules.
Work have confirmed I’ll be paid and are dropping off a laptop so I can do every online training course they can think of. Yay for being a valued employee at a company who do more than just claim to care about their employees.
My wife was offered that just before she was made redundant.
Just saying'..... but well done, it worked out OK for you after all.
Because its up to the Islands as the whether they want to let us in, and currently they do. The rules for coming into England from Spain are today, different.
No I think the point is that the UK Government is inconsistent between FCO travel advice and quarantining rules for the islands. i.e. the quarantine rule applies to Spain + islands, whereas the FCO advice against travel is mainland only.
This cuts both ways. An FCO ban makes it more likely that holidays get cancelled and therefore refunds offered. On the other hand, the outbreaks are localised, and so if you're travelling to another part of the country and aren't concerned by the quarantine restriction on your return, the FCO ban has the unhelpful effect of invalidating your travel insurance even though it almost certainly didn't cover risk from Covid-19-related risks anyway.
FCO now advising against all non-essential travel to the whole of Spain and the islands:
So the government decided that the initial FCO advice was wrong and doubled down when could just as easily taken a more pragmatic approach. I really feel for the poor sods in the Tourism trade over there.
So the government decided that the initial FCO advice was wrong and doubled down when could just as easily taken a more pragmatic approach. I really feel for the poor sods in the Tourism trade over there.
Cant win can they... People complain the government are not doing enough, now you're complaining they're doing too much... Sheesh.
The government have consistently mis-handled the pandemic, along with every else they do, why should they get a break?
If you travel in accordance with FCO guidelines, and they then change while you are there, are you OK from an insurance perspective?
Should you be making efforts to get home sooner (impractical if everyone did it), or is waiting for a scheduled flight to leave within the week a reasonable action?
Insurance isn't suddenly removed whilst you are there and advice changes, if you travelled out with it applying. You'd need to ring them and ask what to do about return but i don't think they'd be emergency repatriating!
Not sure what happens if you are delayed out there (can't get a fliggt back) and your insurance times out?
There wasn't anyone collecting paper versions of the quarantine form either, so they only have the details of people who filled them out online...
When we landed at Manchester on Sunday night they needed to see evidence of the form having been filled in on your phone (the form emails you a pdf at the end), and if you couldn't do that you were taken to one side and asked to fill out a paper version. But there was no validation that you fill in the form accurately, so if you wanted to you could just fill in with nonsense and probably get away with it.
No temperature or other health checks on arrival at Manchester either, unlike when arriving in Spain when you get your temp taken.
It all just seems like they're doing something just to be seen to be doing something rather than actually being effective.
Anyone returning from somewhere 'on the list', who is later found to have broken quarantine, can presumably be prosecuted or dismissed from work? But of course the Cummings rule applies, so come up with an excuse and you're OK. Basically tell no-one where youre going and keep a straight face and you'll be ok.
It all just seems like they’re doing something just to be seen to be doing something rather than actually being effective.
That's been Boris / Scummings strategy all the way through, same with Brexit.
But of course the Cummings rule applies, so come up with an excuse and you’re OK. Basically tell no-one where youre going and keep a straight face and you’ll be ok.
😂
I can see a trend forming: Barnier releases another lot of Brexit paperwork which can be summised as "No, go fish" and Johnson slaps on a quatorzaine. The last time it was France - which was quickly reciprocated which caused more trouble to the UK than France. This time he's chosen Spain. The Uk Covid rate is three times higher than the Costa del Sol.
It all just seems like they’re doing something just to be seen to be doing something rather than actually being effective.
There’s a lot of excuses reasons floating around about why it’s not worth testing temp on return but tbh for the sake of a quick temp check it seems odd not to do it.
South Korea does it and puts you in a special taxi home if you fail.
Well, Jet2 just cancelled all Spanish - including the Island flights to the 15th now. I hope no-on is badly affected.
I feel little justified in cancelling our holiday now - we would have flown out on the 14th....
Easyjet just cancelled my 5th September flight to Geneva 😢 this was to replace July flights. Flight coming home still exists 😕
@notsospeedydaz a Saturday from Luton?
Just claim on your booking number and you'll get both legs refunded
Saturday from Manchester, had a choice of Liverpool or Manchester when first booking now its neither
the sake of a quick temp check it seems odd not to do it
It's false reassurance. A one off check with a proper medical thermometer isn't a reliable way of detecting covid, and the contactless ones can have an uncertainty that makes them near pointless. You might detect someone with a fever, but you also get lots of people thinking "I've been checked, I'm fine" and being a little bit less careful about the stuff that matters.
Similar to the argument about false reassurance from masks, but here the benefit is much smaller.
Well we’ve made it out to Greece!
100% mask adherence on the aircraft and airport.
We are off sailing so social distancing no issue and all eating outdoors.
I love where I live, but a break was definitely needed.
Enjoy! We've just had 4 days up at the col de petit Saint Bernard hiking and dipping in mountain lakes. Now in Pila for a couple of days lift assisted riding. So grateful to have got away and all feels very safe.
Driving to Switzerland on Thursday, and looking at guidance even if there is a French lockdown not relevant, yet.
But it;s going to be a long winter, round two of lockdowns coming soon.
Been in Europe since early July, Spain, Italy, Switzerland and France, the only covid hysteria i've seen is coming out of the UK. Checked and double checked with my insurance before I travelled, got the ferry to Santander stayed in spain till the quarantine was announced then hopped over the border to france, then on to Italy, Switzerland and now back in France. The campsite i'm on is full of brits, way more than the other years i've been here. Its a gamble with the quarantine thing but if you're in a van/caravan/motorhome at least you have options, its up to you if you want to take the risk, but the situation is normal - with masks.
Yeah, but the risk is on all of us isn't it.
Its amazing how selfish and stupid people can be - the more people travel, the more the virus spreads. the more the virus spreads the more people catch it. The more people catch it the more people die or get seriously ill. Planes, trains and automobiles, crossing continents, hopping back and forth across borders - you guys just knock yourself out and don't worry - the situation is basically normal with masks.
Idiots.
Chill Winston
Its amazing how selfish and stupid people can be – the more people travel, the more the virus spreads. the more the virus spreads the more people catch it. The more people catch it the more people die or get seriously ill. Planes, trains and automobiles, crossing continents, hopping back and forth across borders – you guys just knock yourself out and don’t worry – the situation is basically normal with masks.
Idiots.
Shall we just sit at home with our supermarket delivered food and wait for the sweet release of death that way?
There have been quite a few people on here who have successfully made it to Europe for a holdiay, myself included. Has anyone caught the virus abroad, or known anyone that has?
Yeah, but the risk is on all of us isn’t it.
Its amazing how selfish and stupid people can be – the more people travel, the more the virus spreads. the more the virus spreads the more people catch it. The more people catch it the more people die or get seriously ill. Planes, trains and automobiles, crossing continents, hopping back and forth across borders – you guys just knock yourself out and don’t worry – the situation is basically normal with masks.
Idiots.
Ah the hide in your bedroom approach.
I think the vast majority of people in most countries would like to try to find a balance of reducing the risks at the same time as living their lives rather than hiding away and attempting to eliminate all risks.
No you want to find a balance between doing whatever you want and doing whatever the f*** you want. Its as much a disease as the virus and we all suffer from it to some degree but some have far more symptoms.
Why is it more risky for us or the rest of the population traveling in a car to a part of Europe that has a lower infection rate than here? As a family we are less likely to get infected there than here?
