neninja – Member

It’s not the Coalition to blame for this. It’s Labour creating totally unsustainable public sector jobs and spending rather more money than they had coming back in for a decade.

Utter nonsense I am afraid. Other nations manage to have a much bigger public sector and much higher tax rates.

Utter nonsense I am afraid. Other nations manage to have a much bigger public sector and much higher tax rates.

OOo, yeah.

Lets turn ourselves intooooo…….

CUBA !.

Yay !.
TJ has the answer.
🙂

OOo, yeah.

Lets turn ourselves intooooo…….

CUBA !.

Or Norway.

This idea that there is a huge pool of money being hoarded by the rich is a bit tired. So you tax them at 100%

Where did I or anyone else suggest a 100% tax rate. Complete straw man argument.

And there is a huge pool of money being hoarded by the rich – claiming otherwise is just a basic denial of reality. Even Solo isn’t denying that, it’s just that he doesn’t have a problem with people being selfish and greedy – in fact he applauds it.

BTW the options aren’t either the rampant unchecked greedy capitalism/consumerism we have or Cuba – amazingly enough there is a middle ground.

Or Germany, or France, or Sweden, or many other nice places ot live.

This idea that there is a huge pool of money being hoarded by the rich is a bit tired.

Still true tho

the top 1% of rich folk have 21% of the nations wealth IIRC

selfish and greedy – in fact he applauds it

Your version of selfish, greedy.

BTW, how do we describe those who wish to rob the rich, make them as poor as the rest ?.

I really struggle with your idea of fair.
That being to take what others have, away from them.
On the basis that they’re quite good at making money.

And, France. 10 percent unemployment.
Nice place to live ?.
Do we need 10 percent unemployment ?.

The day I feel I’m being punished too hard for making money.
Is the day I leave.
Then how much do the treasury get from me ?.

[COUGH] laffer curve [/COUGH]

Tax today.
Then, when that is all spent……

TAX SOME MORE !.

😆

currently i know nothing of the single status pay review, it appears to have began life in 1997 and not been implemented properly…… it seems it was designed to make pay grades and structures “equal pay proofed”

so at first glance it should appeal to the reds and the torys alike, sorry to hear the OPs missus is lined up for a long pay freeze, join the queue for sympathy.

i do know that im sick of reading the tripe spouted by the regular politial numpties on here.

so it’s all the tories fault? if labour where in how would they sort this problem? the country is in a mess and it needs sorting. the public sector is far to big and needs a culling, I feel sorry for the original posters wife because a pay cut of 25% is a real kick in the teeth but we can’t blame anyone party. we need to get over the fact that rich people are rich, it doesn’t bother me, I provide what I can for my family and bring my kids up the best I can with what I have. I suppose we can all vote against austerity like the french and see what happens then.

philfive – Member

the public sector is far to big and needs a culling,

Which bits don’t we need? healthcare? Education? Defence? Welfare?

I cant be arsed following all the political ding dong thereads but is Solo a troll?

TJ you have taken what i said literally. we need to cut down the amount we spend and the headcount, unions jump on the bandwagon and say that cuts will effect services, well making something more efficent means our money works better for us. How much do we waste in the NHS, Education, Defence and Welfare? think of better ways of reducing this waste and we are on to a winner.

The public sector wastes so much money that its criminal, this is what needs sorting.

the top 1% of rich folk have 21% of the nations wealth IIRC

The top 1% of rich folk pay almost 30 per cent of all income taxes.

so, on that basis, they pay more than their fair share, don’t they?

philfive – Member

TJ you have taken what i said literally. we need to cut down the amount we spend and the headcount, unions jump on the bandwagon and say that cuts will effect services, well making something more efficent means our money works better for us. How much do we waste in the NHS, Education, Defence and Welfare? think of better ways of reducing this waste and we are on to a winner.

The public sector wastes so much money that its criminal, this is what needs sorting.

Really. find some waste then.

I am dead serious – the NHS for example is very efficient. all public sector has been under huge pressure for efficiency for years. there is no way to make significant reductions in spending without making either significant reductions in saleries or in services

I cant be arsed following all the political ding dong thereads but is Solo a troll

No. I am a meet popcikle.

😆

so it’s all the tories fault? if labour where in how would they sort this problem?

Nah ‘Labour’ are awful too, just slightly less awful than the Tories.

we need to get over the fact that rich people are rich, it doesn’t bother me, I provide what I can for my family and bring my kids up the best I can with what I have.

I’m not arsed about people being rich apart from that having a divided society isn’t a good thing for anyone. I don’t want more money for me, I’d just like society to be a better, more equal place. Plenty of evidence to show that societies with more equal wealth distribution are healthier, happier, safer etc etc

Plenty of evidence to show that societies with more equal wealth distribution are healthier, happier, safer etc etc

Where are these places? I need edumacation.

Really. find some waste then.

£12bn on a computer system that doesn’t work?

The top 1% of rich folk pay almost 30 per cent of all income taxes.

so, on that basis, they pay more than their fair share, don’t they?
No they have far more money than they need, than they could ever spend and that they will ever use. Imagine the QE we could have if the wealth actually got spent on stuff that had to be made.

HTH

philfive – Member
The public sector wastes so much money that its criminal, this is what needs sorting.

Read that in the Daily Mail this morning?

The waste starts at the top of any organisation puplic sector or private.

I really do hope that people who think they are taxed too much leave the counrty, it will be a much better place without you all, spreading your disease of greed and selfishness. Go to America and enjoy yourself.

Its not the country i want to live in.

Equality in living standards and opportunities is what we need, not people screwing others over to get a bigger Roller or yacht.

All you private employees are allowed to be part of the revolution too you know, you complain about my pension while you let your complany bosses rob you blind of yours. Its not me who is stealing your money its them on their fac cat salaries.
Seriously when did you need £500k + a year to have a very good life.

Its gone too far.

its a funny old world

pay the person who looks after your kids minimum wage (or there abouts)

pay the person who gambles recklessly looks after your money millions of pounds

Really. find some waste then.

I am dead serious – the NHS for example is very efficient. all public sector has been under huge pressure for efficiency for years. there is no way to make significant reductions in spending without making either significant reductions in saleries or in services

rubbish, my mates sister is a ward sister, my exwife a community nurse, my girfriends sister and best friend are district nurses and a nurse practitioner and the stories they tell are amazing, best one so far is the local PCT are no longer accepting crutches back from patients for MRSA reasons, they just buy new? plus who says we shouldn’t reduce headcount on non essential positions? red tape has created thousands of jobs across all of the public sector, how about we reduce this?

Maybe they need to use WPI or lean management principles for some tasks.

Steve i don’t read the mail and never will do but what is the fascination with how much executives get paid? smacks of jealousy and resentment.

I go to work, get paid, feed the family. I don’t care what next door do or what they guy across the road does. I just get on with life.

what is the fascination with how much executives get paid? smacks of jealousy and resentment.

As above, it’s nowt to do with jealousy and resentment, but about wanting to live in a decent, fair society where we have properly funded schools, hospitals, care homes, disabled care etc etc.

An ever increasing share of a diminishing pot going to a tiny amount of people who don’t need it doesn’t seem like the best way of achieving this.

what is the fascination with how much executives get paid? smacks of jealousy and resentment.

Agreed.

But some folk want to rob them.
Make them poor like the rest of us……
Then when all that money has been spent, errr, ummmm…
😯

We’ll, errrr…..
Rob someone else to fund our addiction to services and big Gov.

I go to work, get paid, feed the family. I don’t care what next door do or what they guy across the road does. I just get on with life.

Plus 1

about wanting to live in a decent, fair society

Define fair!

Is it fair that people with fairly moderate jobs, should have money taken off them, by force of law, and given to people who have no intention whatsoever of working for a living?

is it fair that someone earning 20k with no pension, should have money taken off them to pay for the pension of an ex police officer, aged 54, who is recieving 64k per year in pension payments?

But some folk want to rob them.
Make them poor like the rest of us……

Where did anyone say anything about making them poor? Yet another straw man. I’m talking about making them slightly less rich to make society a better place. How terrible of me.

Define fair!

One with much less of a gap between rich and poor. The degree to which this should happen can debated, but any progress would be a start (rather than those at the top end racing away exponentially as we have now).

thats not fair – it may be ‘more equal’ but its got nothing to do with fairness.

i don’t want to make rich people poor and i do agree with the comments about a fair slice of the pot but the private sector can do what they want with private money. I want a fair deal for my tax and there is a lot of waste, unions and people with a vested interest will say otherwise but it’s true.

I’m talking about making them slightly less rich to make society a better place

One does not automatically provide the other.

This was Labour’s mistake.
Thinking that all problems had a fiscal price tag.
Throw enough tax payers money at it and you win.
Nope !.

smacks of jealousy and resentment.

Odd the right wing always say this it is like they have no morals, fairness or conscience with which to make dsicsions and assume we are as pernicious and self serving as they are and the people they support

it may be ‘more equal’ but its got nothing to do with fairness

Ok think i have go this, so more equal is not more fair

fair
[fair] ? Origin
fair
1 ? ?[fair] Show IPA adjective, fair·er, fair·est, adverb, fair·er, fair·est, noun, verb
adjective
1.
free from bias, dishonesty, or injustice: a fair decision; a fair judge.

So Solo – people dying because they cannot afford healthcare? people relying on charity to eat?

thats what your attitude would bring us – just like todays USA

So Solo – people dying because they cannot afford healthcare? people relying on charity to eat?

thats what your attitude would bring us – just like todays USA

TJ.
Is there any chance that being born British, with our intrinsically unique stance on NHS.
Might skew our view on that ^^^ highly accurate and unbiased (Junkyard) precis of the US ?.

So, you’re offering me, France or USA.
You tinker you.
😉

Its a fact that people die in the US because they cannot afford healthcare. Its a fact that many folk rely on charity to eat.

TJ.

I’ve seen that you’ve had your ass royally handed to you on a plate on the other thread.
Quite amusing.

Its a fact that people die in the US because they cannot afford healthcare. Its a fact that many folk rely on charity to eat.

Is it a fact that ever increasing taxes will cure the worlds ills.
Is it a fact that robbing the rich to make them less rich will cure the worlds ills ?.

The fact that people in the US can not afford to eat or get medical care is not a taxation issue.
But nice try.
😉

Its a fact that many folk rely on charity to eat.

You mean like food banks in the UK?

Did you see that episode of the one show where Edwina went round to the house that ‘couldnt afford to eat’?

Flat screen TV the size of a wall painting, and a dog nearly as big.

Edwina says ‘how much does he cost to feed’ 😉

Did you see that episode of the one show where Edwina went round to the house that ‘couldnt afford to eat’?

Flat screen TV the size of a wall painting, and a dog nearly as big.

Edwina says ‘how much does he cost to feed’

😯

And people wonder why I might have something to say about Gov spending.

highly accurate and unbiased (Junkyard) precis of the US ?.

Dont drag me into your trolling 😉

Zulu I am disapointed you dod not answer me that is so unfair unequal unfair unequal unfair unequal predictable 😛

Dont drag me into your trolling

Junk.
You seem to proceed upon a mistaken belief that calling me a Troll bothers me.
😆

Core, its like you’re a Troll or something.
😉

The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians,passed on from generation to generation, says that,”When you discover that you are riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount.”
However, in our more advanced societies our governments developed alternative strategies that are often employed, such as:
1. Buying a stronger whip.
2. Changing riders.
3. Appointing a committee to study the horse.
4. Arranging to visit other countries to see how other cultures ride dead horses.
5. Lowering the standards so that dead horses can be included.
6. Reclassifying the dead horse as living-impaired.
7. Hiring outside contractors to ride the dead horse.
8. Harnessing several dead horses together to increase speed.
9. Providing additional funding and/or training to increase dead horse’s performance.
10. Doing a productivity study to see if lighter riders would improve the dead horse’s performance.
11. Declaring that as the dead horse does not have to be fed, it is less costly,carries lower overhead and therefore contributes substantially more to the bottom line of the economy than do some other horses.
12. Rewriting the expected performance requirements for all horses.
And of course…
13. Promoting the dead horse to a supervisory position.

this thread of discussing national economics on stw reminded me of a dead horse.

They don’t mind a bit of dead horse in France…

Doh !.

@zulu-eleven

Its a fact that many folk rely on charity to eat.

You mean like food banks in the UK?

Did you see that episode of the one show where Edwina went round to the house that ‘couldnt afford to eat’?

Flat screen TV the size of a wall painting, and a dog nearly as big.

Edwina says ‘how much does he cost to feed’

Money coming in < money going out = food bank situation.

If the family sells their TV, gives the dog to the RSPCA, then lives another month on the food money before they return to the food bank would you be happier? What next? Sell the kids toys? Their clothes? Secondhand electrical goods and “luxuries” as you might call them can only be transformed into so much food. Knee jerk Daily Mail reactions are such as the extremes that we are presented with in media and in those who take it as the norm.