Well you keep repeating how bad independence is going to be for Scotland.

Do I ? Are you sure about that ?

I have done very little in suggesting that ‘independence’ would be bad for Scotland. My main focus has been in the lack of a compelling argument in favour of independence from the yes camp, and that whole case appears to rely on faith hope, and wishful thinking.

Are you confusing me with another poster ?

We’re all agog to see all these examples of failed independence.

Many many pages ago on this thread I made it absolutely clear it is inconceivable that Scotland couldn’t be independent, that it was perfectly feasible for Scotland to be independent, that in fact very little would change if Scotland became independent, most people wouldn’t even notice – significant changes imo would only become apparent over time.

Again, are you confusing me with another poster ?

That’s a joke, right? Perhaps an Australian, Canadian, Indian, or Pakistani may like to comment if they would prefer Westminster to take over the running of their country.

You obviously didn’t read the whole post.

Junkyard
it is not the best worded question [ it is a false comparison] you will ever see but the point is , as far as I am aware that no former colony has asked to return after gaining independence…

Exactly. It was difficult to come up with a perfect question because rather than addressing the specifics of the various posts I was querying the undercurrent, which basically boiled down to “independence bad, Scotland will regret it”.

I couldn’t think of any country that regretted it, so maybe someone else knew of one. No matter how bad things may have been in the various countries after independence, they have never been so bad that they want to return to the fold, so why would Scotland be different?

I couldn’t think of any country that regretted it, so maybe someone else knew of one. No matter how bad things may have been in the various countries after independence, they have never been so bad that they want to return to the fold, so why would Scotland be different?

It’s still a completely false premise. I don’t think that anyone is arguing against independence as a political concept or for colonialism for that matter; I think that some people are arguing that Scottish independence from the UK isn’t worth it.

Equally, a person arguing that “most regions of most countries don’t intend to go independent from their parent states, so this proves that Scotland will regret independence” would be just as wrongheaded as you are.

It’s all completely irrelevant.

There is no sensible comparison.

Well since you’re ignoring the given example of a country where things are worse now than before independence, clearly not only is it an irrelevant question, but giving an answer is also pointless.

Good to see the DO living up to his name re the £200m costs in FM Questions. Even after the good prof clarifies that £200m is not the correct number to use, good old Alex still goes on…..

Dunleavy seems to be flapping round like a wet trout, flopping from one side to the other trying to retain the remotest degree of credibility as he sees his reputation sinking in front of him.

Even his peers at the LSE have begun ripping apart his figures:

What will it really cost to set up an independent Scotland? A critique of Patrick Dunleavy’s report

£200 million, less than half a Holyrood.

Mind you, I reckon the HM figures are tosh too.

teamhurtmore – Member

Good to see the DO living up to his name

“Alex” means “defender/helper of men”.

Just sayin’

Interesting to know NW. To which the reply was, if only.

Perhaps he simply misheard defender as deceiver?!?

With all the major issues now dealt with (a long time ago) and mainly falsified I guess it will be more trivia and nonsense for the remaining days. The TV debate was pretty unedifying all round, but I fear this could get very dire.

Yeah – the trivia and nonsense for today includes a Labour candidate resigning after comparing young Yes supporters to the Hitler Youth and a swastika being scrawled on a SNP MSP’s office along with the UKOK slogan.

Unpleasent at best.

Indicative of deepening divisions at worst.

Stupid undoubtably.

the trivia and nonsense for today includes

Here’s a thought. How about not bothering with trivia and nonsense for a day and instead focusing on the arguments for and against Scotland separating from the rest of the UK……good idea or not ?

bencooper – Member

Yeah – the trivia and nonsense for today includes a Labour candidate resigning after comparing young Yes supporters to the Hitler Youth and a swastika being scrawled on a SNP MSP’s office along with the UKOK slogan.

As with the image of the Union Jack ablaze at Bannockburn which is doing the rounds on twitter, this too is deeply unpleasant. Some real idiots about.

Here’s a thought. How about not bothering with trivia and nonsense for a day and instead focusing on the arguments for and against Scotland separating from the rest of the UK……good idea or not ?

I usually get called delusional or insane or something similar when that happens 😉

Well spend less time with separatists then ? 💡

I’m almost married to one, so that could be tricky.

FT poll today suggests that canny Scots remains an accurate description

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/238bf00a-0110-11e4-b94d-00144feab7de.html?siteedition=uk#axzz35mFY0HEK

Ernie, the “arguments” or lack of them were dealt with ages ago. When yS can’t even be bothered to argue for independence then it’s a bit hard on Ben and co. The rest of the debate will most likely roll along the gutter of trivia and nonsense eg the TV debate etc…..

Oh good grief. Utter pricks.

Other people are a constant source of disappointment.

That could be the SRSM – they’re fond of burning union flags, they’ve certainly done it before at Bannockburn.

There’s really only three of them, and that’s counting the dog 😉

I can’t see what’s particularly outrageous about burning a flag, or why anyone should be offended by it.

Obviously it’s intended to be offensive but that’s not a good enough reason to be offended imo.

If they pay for a flag then it’s up to them if they decide to burn it.

Obviously it’s intended to be offensive but that’s not a good enough reason to be offended imo.

Which is why I defined them in the way I did.

Just because it’s posted on STW doesn’t mean you should automatically assume offence has been caused. I can’t speak for Tightywighty however.

That could be the SRSM

Bloody communists.

Been at the Bannockburn re-enactment in the past when the black t-shirted goons of the SnG burnt the Union Flag on the hill.
That, alongside the drunken abuse & constant threats of violence against the ‘English’ army (many of whom were Scottish) made me decide there and then never to go back to that event. Travelling for hours & paying all my own costs for the weekend to put on a show & then being abused and threatened by drunken scum isn’t my idea of an interesting weekend.
In fact, I don’t really want to visit Scotland again to be honest & I certainly won’t miss it when/if you vote Yes.

Sorry if that offends.

Just because it’s posted on STW doesn’t mean you should automatically assume offence has been caused.

If it’s posted on STW it’s reasonable to assume someone has been offended.

Sorry if that offends

It doesn’t. I think you’re being a little daft to make a decision about a whole country after one incident, but that’s your choice. I’ve had anti-Scottish abuse when in England, but can recognise that it was just a tiny minority, and haven’t let it change my opinion of England.

I assume they sneaked up and burnt the flag early morning? Cant see that happening during the middle of the reenactment.I have always pointed and laughed at folk that do that sort of thing,you know when you see somebody burning an effigy of the US pres,having spent time and money making it,go on then,fill your boots,you have totally owned the USA. Still,only on here is it more of an issue than the Hitler youth tweet.

If Scotland is so full of bellends, why is the UK so bothered about then buggering off?

Still,only on here is it more of an issue than the Hitler youth tweet.

One person appears to have been upset about the burning of the union flag, and you presumably are outraged by the Hitler Youth tweet, doesn’t that kind of even things out ?

Or are you demanding that more people be outraged by the Hitler Youth tweet ?

No petal,I am referring to the respective media attention. Nor am I outraged by the HJ tweet,what in my post suggested I was?

If Scotland is so full of bellends, why is the UK so bothered about then buggering off?

Because there might only be a minority of bellends, in which case it would be a shame to throw the baby out with the bathwater

The beauty of a referendum is that it settles both these issues…

I am referring to the respective media attention

You said “only on here is it more of an issue” which very clearly suggests “only on here”.

But apparently you meant the “media”. Fair enough.

I have no idea how much media attention the two issues have received.

If it’s posted on STW it’s reasonable to assume someone has been offended.

It’s a fair assumption.

I have no idea how much media attention the two issues have received.

I’ve seen no reporting on the flag burning. Plenty on the Nazi tweet and graffiti scrawl.

I find the flag image a little suspicious – there’s only one image, it’s pretty blurry, and only seems to have one source on Twitter. There’s also not many people in the image. I think it might not be recent.

Here’s an image from 2014 at the same statue:

Wouldn’t surprise me. Certainly seems as plausible as a yes voter scrawling Nazi stuff on an SNP office to create negative news about unionists.

The only sure thing is that someone somewhere is being a tool about it

I certainly don’t blame the entire population of Scotland for my unfortunate experience, the Scottish reenactors were lovely and most embarrassed. However, it doesn’t make me want to hurry back that’s for sure.
Deep down I suspect we really don’t like each other & that’s why i think we will be better off apart.

What do you mean “we”? There are many English-born people living in Scotland, and vice versa, and lots of the English-born Scots are in favour of independence – like most of my family.

What do you mean “we”?

I think he means people living on both sides of the border. What did you think he meant ?