Interesting article, I’ve posted copy below since it’s behind paywall here

Interested in peoples opinions, especially regarding dieting and iDave diet etc. I’m still in no fruit camp and never ate fruit before anyway!

Modern low-carb diets have given fruit a bad reputation, but you and your family avoid this vital food at your peril
Who would have thought that fruit could go out of fashion? But, it seems, as far as food favourites go, our eye has gone right off apples, plums have plummeted in our estimation and pears have gone, well, you know, pear-shaped.
And this trend is likely to continue, thanks to faddy celeb diets that label fruit as fattening. But that is a perilous mistake— and the latest government figures show the extent of the problem.
Despite constant nudging from health experts, our purchases of fresh fruit have fallen by an astonishing 11 per cent in the past five years. We can’t blame the credit crunch: fruit prices grew more slowly than other foods in the same period.
Much of the fault lies with the enduring popularity of high-protein diets. The Atkins diet, which forbids fruit in favour of bacon, steak and eggs, first appeared in the 1970s, then returned to global acclaim in 2002. Enthusiasts claim that by cutting carbohydrates (and fruits count as carbs) the body’s production of insulin is reduced. According to Atkins’s theory, this in turn inhibits the body’s ability to store fat.
Now we have the Dukan diet, a Gallic son-of-Atkins, that has rapidly become a bestseller in France and Britain. Much of its popularity in the UK can be put down to the revelation, last year, that Carole Middleton, the Duchess of Cambridge’s mother, was happily using the weightloss regimen.
Already, dietitians have questioned if the programme’s high salt content and lack of vitamin C could cause nutritional imbalances. The British Dietetic Association, the country’s organisation of professional dietitians, lists it as one of its five worst diets. Cutting any big food group out of your diet defies common sense, it says.
In addition, scientists are revealing how shunning fruit can be a complete dietary fallacy. A recent study by the Florida State University found that women who ate 75g of dried apple a day, (the equivalent of four apples) for six months, lost weight and improved their cholesterol levels. As well as significantly raising their levels of “good” HDL cholesterol and lowering their “bad” LDL cholesterol, the women lost an average of a little over 3lb in weight.
The cholesterol benefits are said to have been triggered by the antioxidants in apples, while the slimming effect has been attributed to pectin, a compound that can suppress appetite. High levels of pectin are also found in apricots, carrots and citrus fruits.
Similar results were formulated by scientists at the University of Navarra, in Pamplona, Spain. Their study found that overweight women on diets in which 15 per cent of their calories came from fruit lost an average of 15lb after two months. And there was another benefit: the women had a significant fall in blood markers for free radicals, which can contribute to cardiovascular disease.
The benefits of fruit do, indeed, go far beyond weight control. This seems particularly true for expectant mothers. For example, a British study of almost 7,000 pregnant women revealed that those who included fruit and vegetables in their daily diet were 46 per cent less likely to suffer a miscarriage. The 2006 study, by the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, found that those who ate fruit and vegetables daily, or almost daily, were half as likely to miscarry in the first three months compared with those who ate fruit and veg less regularly.
The benefits can cross generations, too. Children whose mums ate plenty of apples during pregnancy have a significantly lower risk of asthma, says a five-year study of 2,000 mothers in the journal,Thorax, by Scottish and Dutch scientists. The cause has not been fully explored, but the investigators think that flavonoids in the fruit may have a protective effect.
Women’s bodies can benefit in other ways, too. Eating fruit regularly may reduce their risk of endometriosis — a painful condition that primarily affects organs in the pelvis and abdomen — by as much as two thirds.
Regardless of your gender, simply including any amount of fruit in your diet really does help to keep the doctor at bay, according to University of Cambridge experts who studied 20,000 people for four years. They report that consuming a single piece of fruit — such as a good-sized orange — each day can cut the risk of death in middle age by a fifth. The effect is strongest in relation to heart disease, but it is also significant in cancer, the second-commonest cause of death, the investigators explain in The Lancet.
Finally, there is another reason to smile while scoffing fruit: it is great for your morale. Two years ago, researchers in the British Journal of Psychiatry found that people who eat the most fruit are least likely to suffer from depression. And a similar French study revealed that those who shun the stuff are not only most at risk of being miserable, they are also more likely to be fat.
A day’s perfect fruit intake
For breakfast Bananas with oats and yoghurt. Bananas are rich in the soluble fibre pectin.
This makes them good for keeping blood fats such as cholesterol in check. Slicing a banana on top of porridge oats, which are also high in soluble fibre, makes a great breakfast.
Despite a reputation for being fattening, the average banana has fewer than 100 calories. Bananas can raise your blood-sugar level quickly, which may put you at risk of that dozy mid-morning carb-crash feeling. But this sugar boost is allayed if you eat the banana with plain, unsweetened yoghurt. The proteins and acids in yoghurt inhibit the sugar spike.
Lunchtime and dinner Try eating an apple or pear before your main dish. Fruit and veg tend to contain low levels of calories for their physical size, so they can encourage a feeling of fullness and suppress appetite. This is helped by the fact that fruits such as apples and pears contain significant levels of dietary fibre, which give us a sense of satiety.
A study in the journal Nutrition found that women who ate a small apple or pear before their three daily meals lost more weight on a low-calorie diet than women who did not add fruit to their diet. In addition, the fruit eaters ate fewer calories overall, so boosting their weight-loss efforts.
As a snack For a quick mouth-zinging sweet treat, try berries. These magical little fruits contain phytochemicals that foster healthy blood chemistry and, as a bonus, strengthen capillaries, helping to prevent thread veins. They are also rich in vitamin C.
Berries also contain polyphenols — groups of chemicals with a range of potential health benefits. New research from Texas Woman’s University this month suggests that blueberries, which are particularly high in polyphenols, may help you to lose weight, because they can break down existing fat cells and prevent new ones from forming.
Avoid Fruit juice, especially the cheap stuff. It can make you fat and rot your teeth. A 400ml glass of orange juice can contain more calories than a Mars bar. Gulping a one-litre carton gives the same calorie kick as a Big Mac and fries. In cheap juices, the fibre and nutritious skin and pith are lost. Sugar and acidity are increased dramatically, putting your teeth at risk.

For the brazillianth time iDave diet isn’t low carb.

Yesterday I ate more fruit than many people do in a month. I just do it one day a week.

Sure, that wasn’t the point, the point was fruit for which the iDave diet says, “No Fruit”.

But your body can’t store the water soluble vitamins stored in fruit, so where is the benefit in eating it one day a week?

Sure, that wasn’t the point, the point was fruit for which the iDave diet says, “No Fruit”.

If you are trying to lose weight, then reducing anything with sugar in is a good idea no?

But your body can’t store the water soluble vitamins stored in fruit, so where is the benefit in eating it one day a week?

a) because I want to

b) If you follow the plan, you’re eating a shed load of veg/salads through the week. All rich sources if micro-nutrients.

Good point ^

My opinion is that iDave has the patience of a saint and that I can’t believe he still answers his critics on this.

Personally I enjoy fruit far too much, luckily I also enjoy exercise far too much.

I have never seen a study which compares the benefits of eating fruit, compared with the benefits of being normally sized. If you’re a fatty and eat fruit, are you more likely to die/have health problems than if you are thin but don’t eat fruit 6 days a week, and eat a massive pile of vegetables? Are fruit really that wonderful? There’s an awful lot of deaths being attributed to being overweight. Not that many due to scurvy.

Just as a point of note I’m not a critic of iDave diet, I’m actaully on something very similar with great results. Just thought the article was interesting. And if you note I said I don’t eat fruit…

I think maybe I’m missing the point of any of these what I would call ‘fad diets’.

Whatever happened to eat less, move more? If calories out>calories in then only one thing is going to happen. Is it really that hard?

Eskimos.

Big fruit eaters.

Whatever happened to eat less, move more? If calories out>calories in then only one thing is going to happen. Is it really that hard?

So if I eat 2000 calories of caster sugar per day or a 2000 calories of veg which one would pile on the weight more?

Obviously the veg would get fatter, the sugar person would loose weight through teeth falling out!

Pretty sure that Eskimos get some of their essential nutrients from whale blubber.

I’ve asked Waitrose to get some in for me.

In theory, calories are calories regardless of where they come from. If you isolate the calorific content from any nutritional value then no calorie is ‘better’ than another.

What’s wrong with just eating properly? Want to lose some weight? Well look at how much you eat, and eat a bit less, then do a bit more exercise!

Pretty sure that Eskimos get some of their essential nutrients from whale blubber.

Whales are not fruit AFAIK.

Good point but if those dudes miss the annual whale migration they can get kind of ill. Pretty sure that scoffing on the odd appple or orange would be a welcome alternative.

I’ve researched quite a bit on the fruit Vs veg thing since the early iPosts, and while there are some micronutrients & phytochemicals that are higher concentration in fruits some are of debatable value and a good variety of veg should cover it.

A good basic principle for veg is to combine colours so not all legumes/leaf veg but mix in those radishes, peppers, carrots, beetroots and chuck in a few seeds such as pumpkin, linseed, hemp & flax.

If I was going to sneak some fruit into an iDiet I’d choose rhubarb, cranberries & blueberries all of which are low GI.

And it’s worth considering that it could be better to think of low/high GI meals rather than low/high GI ingredients as food combinations & method of cooking/preparation can modulate the GI values of the individual ingredients.

Good free web resources for food data are
http://nutritiondata.self.com/
http://www.ars.usda.gov/Main/site_main.htm?modecode=12-35-45-00

One quick iQuestion if I may, if sugary carbs are OK for exercise does that imply that a breakfast for a 15km brisk pace off-road cycle commute can include cereal/bread as I find cycling on an egg/meat based meal a bit uncomfortable.
Or just MTFU and commute on ’empty’ then have post ride iBrekky…..

When is a fruit not a fruit? When it’s a vegetable?
Peppers are fruit as are tomatoes, courgettes, squashes……..

Good point but if those dudes miss the annual whale migration they can get kind of ill. Pretty sure that scoffing on the odd appple or orange would be a welcome alternative.

Yeah sure, but claims that if you don’t eat X you’ll suffer health problems are obvious crap. You only have to look at the weird (to us) diets that isolated communities eat to see that. Ironically they’re perfectly healthy until the western diet arrives.

Hob Nob – Member

In theory, calories are calories regardless of where they come from. If you isolate the calorific content from any nutritional value then no calorie is ‘better’ than another.

Trouble is, the calorifc values are obtained by combusting the food and measuring the heat produced, so it’s looking at an inorganic chemical process rather than a biological process.

Add in the factors of food digestion, abosrbtion and hormonal regulation and you’ll find the animal method of obtaining energy from food is far more complex than the “move more, eat less” method of weight loss can account for.

geoffj – Member
When is a fruit not a fruit? When it’s a vegetable?
Peppers are fruit as are tomatoes, courgettes, squashes……..

they may be fruits botanically but they fail the custard test and so are not iFruits 😉

In conclusion… I couldn’t be an Eskimo or Innuit. I like fruit too much.

It’s the arrival of western ‘convenience’ diet that ruins them, isn’t it? Not the introduction of fruit.

Its interesting having had to totally change my diet to recover from a long term illness.

Overall, to me there are two aspects of diets – 1. To lose weight and 2. to put the right fuel in my body. I’m shocked by these fad diets in magazines where it states you can eat shite and lose weight – just eat the right things in moderation!!!

Previously it was about maintaining weight by eating the same calories as I was using.

Now I’m very much tuned in on the quality of those calories and the nutirents within my diet to support the various different functions and systems within the body. In fact as people who do an activity that is quite intensive and destructive to the body I am surprised we don’t focus more on what we eat.

Its amazing how different I feel now and wish I’d done it years ago.

Whales are not fruit AFAIK.

We keep our whales in the fridge, not the fruit bowl. Therefore, they’re vegetables.

I have freshly clubbed baby seal with custard, therefore it seems it could be classed as fruit

It’s the arrival of western ‘convenience’ diet that ruins them, isn’t it? Not the introduction of fruit.

Convenience is the key – if you read between the lines of all the iDave diet debates while everyone gets tied up in knots about the nutrients its actually the availability of the foods that is the key. cutting dairy, fruit and cereals is in effect cutting everything that is conveniently to hand – because they are the staples of our modern diet. We’re a very rich nation and our diet as a result is pretty much made up of party food. The effect of iDave’s instructions is that you effectlively eliminate ready-meals and eating out and restrict yourself to food you’ve actually had to prepare and cook yourself, rather than simply reach out for. The diet restricts fruit not because of whats in fruit but because its always to hand.

Personally I like Kiviaq Eton Mess, nothing like fermented seabirds, cream and meringue IMO.

iDave you up for DirtyG’s lap challange then?

TSY – yes indeed, as the day after is my birthday.

The diet restricts fruit not because of whats in fruit but because its always to hand.

It’s because of the fructose actually.

The effect of iDave’s instructions is that you effectlively eliminate ready-meals and eating out

I eat out a lot – just ask for extra veg instead of rice/potatoes etc.

I don’t feel under some rigid restrictive blanket ban on foods. I eat very well I think you’d struggle to find a knowledgeable dietitian look at my weekly intake and say it was unhealthy or lacking anything.

This is an extract from a book I’ve been reading about diet and history

Human beings evolved over millions of years eating particular foods. Neanderthal man was a carnivore and only ever ate meat, fish and shell fish. More recently Paleolithic man expanded the diet to include root vegetables, fruits, nuts and seeds which he could scavenge from the wild. It is only in the last few thousand years since the Persians, Egyptians and Romans that we began farming, and grains and dairy products were introduced into the human diet. A few thousand years from an evolutionary point of view is almost negligible. Many people have simply failed to adapt to cope with grains and dairy products and it is very likely that these foods cause a range of health problems in susceptible people.

Modern studies on ancient tribes who continue to eat a Stone Age (paleolithic) diet show that these people do not suffer from diabetes, obesity, heart disease or cancer. If they can survive the ravages of infectious diseases, childbirth and war wounds, then these people live healthily to a great age.

I am coming to the view that whatever your medical problem may be, or even if you simply want to stay well, we should all move towards eating a Stone Age diet based on vegetables, nuts, seeds, meat, fish and eggs. Recent Western diets get 70% of their calories from wheat, dairy products, sugar and potato and it is no surprise that these are the major causes of modern ill health such as cancer, heart disease, diabetes, obesity and degenerative disorders.

I estimate that over 90% of people who consult me are addicts. Addiction usually starts off in life with sugar, but then moves onto carbohydrates generally, chocolate, caffeine, nicotine, alcohol and maybe onto other hard drugs. There is a carbohydrate addiction gene which switches on when the carbohydrate content of the diet exceeds 4%. This makes one endlessly crave carbohydrates when carbohydrates are available. This does not make sense until you think from an evolutionary point of view. Protein foods such as meat, fish and shellfish, were available throughout the year, but every so often there would be a bonanza when, for example, the banana tree would ripen. The only way man could store this food source was to eat it and store it as body fat. So once carbohydrate appeared in abundance and he started to eat it the carbohydrate gene was switched on to create a craving Homo Sapiens who ate to excess, put on weight and was thereby able to store it in his body for leaner times ahead. The problem in modern times is that carbohydrates are now freely available and we continue to crave them and continue to put on weight. Furthermore, once you put on weight, the imperative to use your brain and your body to seek new food declines and so you become sluggish and lethargic. The converse of this is true. If you wish to lose weight then eat a very low carbohydrate diet such as the Atkin’s diet and often you will see an immediate improvement in your mental and physical energy levels.

The fruit thing contradicts this but I can see the sense in it.

To me, the iDave diet seems to fit well with the thinking of the Stone Age diet. The once-weekly ‘binge’ is the equivalent to Caveman Ogg finding a particularly abundant patch of berries.

I have a high octane version of the diet now which I’ve been testing, which was prompted by a throw away comment from the philosopher Nassem Taleb about modern life. It ties in with some of the Stone Age stuff, but also what seen in the animal world.

I have a high octane version of the diet

There is your book title reet there.

*volunteers to be a test subject*

I’ll even stop eating fruit.

Bushwacked – Member

A few thousand years from an evolutionary point of view is almost negligible. Many people have simply failed to adapt to cope with grains and dairy products and it is very likely that these foods cause a range of health problems in susceptible people.

Good point, also the gut bacteria population varies massively depending upon the type of foods eaten, in particular the type of carbohydrate sources and soluble fibre content.
The role of these bacteria is increasingly acknowledged as playing an important role in food intolerances & other diet related health issues.

In conclusion… I couldn’t be an Eskimo or Innuit. I like fruit too much.

It’s the arrival of western ‘convenience’ diet that ruins them, isn’t it? Not the introduction of fruit.
Yeah, sure. I’m suggesting not eating fruit doesn’t mean imminent death, not that fruit is bad for you. I’m sure there are plenty of cultures that eat mostly fruit who are entirely healthy (and regular).